Sam Allardyce

[Gladystweet]

Apart from Koeman you mean

Mind you even he's still getting around £100k a week off the club.

Koeman was just the face. It's the clowns in the background who've got off free.

 

[Marius57]

Thanks for reading it mate. Just my few responses...

3. I supported Koeman, even though I didn't think he'd prove to be correct for us. I praised him when we played well, and criticised him when things went badly, as I will with any manager. I was pleased we finished 7th and got Europe, but that was the bare minimum for me that season with that squad. The most common reason for wanting RM sacked that I would hear was that we had the best squad in 20 years. Yet that seemed to be ignored for a magnificent 7th place under Koeman. It was bare minimum and I said that at the time.
4. As you say, all personal opinion. I think we'd have steered clear with any decent manager, which Koeman wasn't and I don't believe DU is, but it wouldn't have been as comfortable achieved as it was under many other than Allardyce.
6. He hasn't. As I said in my original post.
7. He's been "Fireman Sam" at Sunderland and Palace. He started with much less at Bolton and WHU (lower leagues) and turned them to top 6 teams. He can do more than fit the kitchen.
8. Yes, he talks [Poor language removed]. Can't disagree. But unless he is rude, or says something like he did about Unsworth pre-WHU game which was unacceptable, I don't care.
10. This is the cherrypicking I mention. You can't blame him for all faults, and ignore any positives as if he had no influence. It doesn't work like that.

7. The league has massively moved on since those days. There now isn’t a big 3, or 4. There’s a big 6 which is harder to break down, and to do that, we need to get a couple of wins against those teams. Sam never looked for a minute like winning against any of them.
10. We were reliant a lot on individual skill before hand as well, ie Rooney, and siggy. We now have Walcott and Coleman for that. I don’t think he has had as big an influence that you think

 

[MrGrumpy]

The way the were discussing Rooney on talk sport this morning and the manor of the conversation about BS it sounded like it's going to be a total shock to them if he's goes this summer, please god he does, I presume they will talk off air with numpty Jim and that I think they are certain he's staying put.

I heard that, there even talking about Rooney to Rangers as if it’s going to happen.

Jim White has turned on us since Moshiri ditches him, u can hear it in his voice, he always goes quieter when saying about Sam leaving. He knows damn well he is but won’t say it on air.

They don’t watch Everton mate, they care about the top 6 until 4-5 games left then they talk about the bottom half, soon as any club outside the top 6 gets above 13th they say “well ..... has done a great job”
To busy waxing lyrical over Salah and RS who could and please please god finish 5th and lose to Real Madrid... that would be hilarious

 

[Bob Elstone]

Koeman was a disgrace. A lazy non interested fat bloke more interested in his holidays and the golf course.

He’s perfectly suited for the Dutch national team. Too bad to quality for the World Cup. The occasional fixture once in a blue moon.

Plenty of time for golf, holiday and red wine.

Surprised he has the nerve to post so much on social media given his managerial performances.

 

[gaino92]

7. The league has massively moved on since those days. There now isn’t a big 3, or 4. There’s a big 6 which is harder to break down, and to do that, we need to get a couple of wins against those teams. Sam never looked for a minute like winning against any of them.
10. We were reliant a lot on individual skill before hand as well, ie Rooney, and siggy. We now have Walcott and Coleman for that. I don’t think he has had as big an influence that you think

Just as an aside didn't he finish 13th and 12th with West Ham? Not exactly top 6 is it

 

[deipnosophist]

Koeman was a disgrace. A lazy non interested fat bloke more interested in his holidays and the golf course.

He’s perfectly suited for the Dutch national team. Too bad to quality for the World Cup. The occasional fixture once in a blue moon.

Plenty of time for golf, holiday and red wine.

Surprised he has the nerve to post so much on social media given his managerial performances.

totally agree. I never saw fatty Koeman when he was a player but people tell me he was good. But as a manager he was a baffoon (which, as I learnt from another thread, is a big woodwind instrument )

 

[Stephenlloyd]

I heard that, there even talking about Rooney to Rangers as if it’s going to happen.

Jim White has turned on us since Moshiri ditches him, u can hear it in his voice, he always goes quieter when saying about Sam leaving. He knows damn well he is but won’t say it on air.

They don’t watch Everton mate, they care about the top 6 until 4-5 games left then they talk about the bottom half, soon as any club outside the top 6 gets above 13th they say “well ..... has done a great job”
To busy waxing lyrical over Salah and RS who could and please please god finish 5th and lose to Real Madrid... that would be hilarious

Yes I’ve noticed how he used to mention moshiri about a 100times a show. And was positive about us challenging and moshiri targeting top players and managers. Now it’s the top 6 set in stone the best Everton can ever hope for us 7th.

When he’s sacked I think I will take the day off so I can listen all day, Just to Hear White & Brazil trying to stick up for their mate will be gold.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Thanks for reading it mate. Just my few responses...

3. I supported Koeman, even though I didn't think he'd prove to be correct for us. I praised him when we played well, and criticised him when things went badly, as I will with any manager. I was pleased we finished 7th and got Europe, but that was the bare minimum for me that season with that squad. The most common reason for wanting RM sacked that I would hear was that we had the best squad in 20 years. Yet that seemed to be ignored for a magnificent 7th place under Koeman. It was bare minimum and I said that at the time.
4. As you say, all personal opinion. I think we'd have steered clear with any decent manager, which Koeman wasn't and I don't believe DU is, but it wouldn't have been as comfortable achieved as it was under many other than Allardyce.
6. He hasn't. As I said in my original post.
7. He's been "Fireman Sam" at Sunderland and Palace. He started with much less at Bolton and WHU (lower leagues) and turned them to top 6 teams. He can do more than fit the kitchen.
8. Yes, he talks [Poor language removed]. Can't disagree. But unless he is rude, or says something like he did about Unsworth pre-WHU game which was unacceptable, I don't care.
10. This is the cherrypicking I mention. You can't blame him for all faults, and ignore any positives as if he had no influence. It doesn't work like that.

Ok mate. I've read your original post. I decided not to respond as @Marius57 feels pretty much the same as I do and summed it up nicely in the above post.

I will add a couple more points to that if I may.

Firstly, as I mentioned in my previous post, after his initial run of games Allardyce had us in 9th position, double digit points clear of relegation and 3 points behind 7th. We were not in a relegation battle at that time but for some reason he continued to fight one that didn't exist. In my opinion, his over negative attitude cost or more points than they won us. Why do you think Allardyce decided to do this?. You say you want to give him a chance to play more adventurous football next season. I would argue that he had the perfect opportunity to do so this season but passed it up. At that time he had practically the whole fan base behind him. Now it's the complete opposite. Why do you think he should be given a second chance.?

The second point relates to his press conferences and post/pre match interviews. I know you've since acknowledged that you don't agree with all he says. But my biggest issue with them is his self righteousness. He picks the team and tactics for every game. Apart from International weeks, he has all week to set them up to play the way he wants them to play. If we win, he invariably takes the credit. If we don't, he will always, and I do mean always, blame somebody else. Yes the players should take their fair share of the blame, and if you go onto their individual threads, you will see that nobody gets away with anything in this forum. But Allardyce has never, not once, held his hands up and said "that was my fault. sorry guys". He is the manager, the guy the book stops with. But notwithstanding this, a big reason why we've failed in so many of the games this season is because of the way he sets up. You mentioned Spurs away as a game where he set up to attack. The other game when he set up to attack was Manchester City at home, where he went with 2 strikers, 2 wingers and Rooney in a midfield 2. After each of those games he came out with some comment about being too attack minded and having to tone it down a bit. One could very easily argue that he purposely threw those games to justify the defensive tactics he normally employs. In fact, the vast majority of the fan base would probably have agreed with him had he gone into those 2 games with his usual defensive formation. How can you be happy with a manager, who cannot accept any blame for his bad decisions AND is quite happy to blame his own players, whether that be collectively or individually as he's done on occasion.?

 

[Frang]

Yes I’ve noticed how he used to mention moshiri about a 100times a show. And was positive about us challenging and moshiri targeting top players and managers. Now it’s the top 6 set in stone the best Everton can ever hope for us 7th.

When he’s sacked I think I will take the day off so I can listen all day, Just to Hear White & Brazil trying to stick up for their mate will be gold.

it will make your ears bleed hearing the yellow tie pisshead bemoaning Moshiri's decision to sack the fat one

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

The dissent from the majority of fans for Koeman was MONTHS too late, and the damage was done, yet Allardyce is being cast as having ruined our season. I was nearly a lone voice in saying Koeman wasn't going to do anything with us.


He hasn't proved to be not up to the task. He's made us the 6th best team in the league since his appointment. Just because it hasn't been to a style that you like, it doesn't mean he has failed.

If you didn't read over 90% of the post then I shouldn't bother discussing anything with you, as you clearly haven't the inclination to discover other viewpoints that don't match yours. Pretty much all of what you stated in your 1st and 3rd paragraphs I covered in my post, but that's your choice to not read anything that doesn't immediately fit your agenda.

I welcome opposing viewpoints - it's the only way people learn. It's why we have political parties and elections every 4 years, and why we have online football forums. If someone provides hard evidence that outweighs what I have witnessed and reflected on, then I will happily change my mind.
Having watched Allardyce teams over the years, I can see that he is capable of providing more than we are currently seeing from this side. I just don't think it is possible, or wise to try and get this side to be something it isn't i.e good.
And as I say, if he doesn't divert from this tactic next season then he should go. I believe that he will offer us a much better side if he is here.

6th best team since his appointment.......

The performances and the attitude underneath Allardyce and his "setup" has been utterly disgusting. The run of games without having a shot on goal said it all, and we where 3 points of 7th at that time.

He is a gate keeper, he is a "escape artist". If we as a club want to achieve absolutely anything in the future, it will not be with this man.

100%.

 

[Marius57]

Just as an aside didn't he finish 13th and 12th with West Ham? Not exactly top 6 is it

He finished 6th in his career once. In 2004/5. Funnily enough, the same year we broke the top 4. Neither him or Moyes could get us there now.

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

7. He's been "Fireman Sam" at Sunderland and Palace. He started with much less at Bolton and WHU (lower leagues) and turned them to top 6 teams. He can do more than fit the kitchen.

His achievements at bolton are 20 years ago.

Walter Smith won titles with Rangers 20 years ago, lets bring him back...

Oh wait.

WHU a top 6 team?? when did that happen?

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

The 9th best paid manager in the world and people are justifying keeping him because he reached 6th place with Bolton 20 years ago.

Stop the train, its time to get off.

 

[MrGrumpy]

6th best team since his appointment.......

The performances and the attitude underneath Allardyce and his "setup" has been utterly disgusting. The run of games without having a shot on goal said it all, and we where 3 points of 7th at that time.

He is a gate keeper, he is a "escape artist". If we as a club want to achieve absolutely anything in the future, it will not be with this man.

100%.

We are 8th despite him not because of him. Our conversation rate must be up there as we seem to take the 1 chance we get each game

 

[chazzle_dazzle]

We are 8th despite him not because of him. Our conversation rate must be up there as we seem to take the 1 chance we get each game

We should have been a lot higher because the league is utter garbage and we have played in that same bin since he has come.

He had the chance to show he wasn't a lower table manager when we where 3 points from 7th.

Instead he set the team up for a run of 0 shots on goal in 4 games... I was there for each of them, it was utterly horrific.