Ross Barkley

[bicycleheader]

Just to be clear I'm not saying that.

I'm saying I would happily see him.sold for the sorts of figures quoted as I don't think he'll likely achieve that level of performance (to justify such a fee) for us on a regular basis.

...so sell a career long 7 out of 10(as an example of where he might be over his career), if some club decides to pay the price of a 9 out of 10 player for him, because he will never be a 9 out of 10 in reality. even though he is boyhood fan of the club and a local lad and has been with the club since he was 11, and obviously gets many of the fans excited.

then, on top of all that....when its done...be delighted..and happy..and applaud?

is this how we are doing this football club supporting thing now?

 

[hibbos left peg]

Just to be clear I'm not saying that.

I'm saying I would happily see him.sold for the sorts of figures quoted as I don't think he'll likely achieve that level of performance (to justify such a fee) for us on a regular basis.

Didn't mean to put words in your mouth, I think this is a healthy debate

My opinion is he's a blue and we should never even contemplate selling him at any point

 

[Tel001]

I'm pretty sure that the Bale you mention hadn't played 100+ games at that stage

Bale was playing at age 16 for saints week in week out... He was being played as a left back and again at Spurs .... He was nearly sold to Birmingham for 3m and spurs didn't win a game he played in for over a year.... He was then moved to left wing... And the rest is history

 

[Duncan Disordely]

Charlie sweet you're really starting to sound like a @SteKelly / @StephenGOT multi.

Barkley was great yesterday, without really having a truly world class moment, and isn't that what we actually want? He's not going to hit a 40 yard screamer or run the ball 70 yards and score every week, so when he doesn't I'd rather he played like he did on Sunday than disappear in games.

 

[Charlie Sweet]

...so sell a career long 7 out of 10(as an example of where he might be over his career), if some club decides to pay the price of a 9 out of 10 player for him, because he will never be a 9 out of 10 in reality. even though he is boyhood fan of the club and a local lad and has been with the club since he was 11, and obviously gets many of the fans excited.

then, on top of all that....when its done...be delighted..and happy..and applaud?

is this how we are doing this football club supporting thing now?

Football is a business and we have to see it that way. I couldn't give two hoots if he's a local lad or not. For example, not being local didn't stop me loving the heroes of the 80s teams.

I'm happy to sell a player that I think has a value that overstates his ability. I don't think Barkley is anything like a career long 7 out of 10. More like 20% of games he really stands out.

 

[BlueToff]

Football is a business and we have to see it that way. I couldn't give two hoots if he's a local lad or not. For example, not being local didn't stop me loving the heroes of the 80s teams.

I'm happy to sell a player that I think has a value that overstates his ability. I don't think Barkley is anything like a career long 7 out of 10. More like 20% of games he really stands out.

Well he didn't particularly stand out the other day, and yet he still controlled the game for us without really having to put much effort in. That's a sign of the class he already had.

While he may not live up to some of the hype fully, to say sell him is for me, ludicrous, at this point.

Who are we going to get that is better? Even with the money... or will add more to our team. Nobody.

Moneyball just doesn't work - it's being proved by Spurs and Liverpool.

 

[Charlie Sweet]

Well he didn't particularly stand out the other day, and yet he still controlled the game for us without really having to put much effort in. That's a sign of the class he already had.

While he may not live up to some of the hype fully, to say sell him is for me, ludicrous, at this point.

Who are we going to get that is better? Even with the money... or will add more to our team. Nobody.

Moneyball just doesn't work - it's being proved by Spurs and Liverpool.

See this I don't get. I'm not asking for 40 yard screamers or mazy runs all the time. Not at all. I just think his end product is often very poor.

I'd sell purely on the basis that I think his value could be reaching a peak and I just don't think he'll get any better. If someone wants to come in with £30m then let them take the risk. It's not about moneyball at all. You sell if you think someone offers you a good price. I'd love to see us then use that £30m to spend on a real attacking midfield talent. The idea that Barkley is better than what £30m would get us on the world market is madness in my opinion.

 

[BlueToff]

See this I don't get. I'm not asking for 40 yard screamers or mazy runs all the time. Not at all. I just think his end product is often very poor.

I'd sell purely on the basis that I think his value could be reaching a peak and I just don't think he'll get any better. If someone wants to come in with £30m then let them take the risk. It's not about moneyball at all. You sell if you think someone offers you a good price. I'd love to see us then use that £30m to spend on a real attacking midfield talent. The idea that Barkley is better than what £30m would get us on the world market is madness in my opinion.

I respect your opinion mate, but really, these two points amaze me.

'Reaching his peak' - he's 21 years old.

And he is easily already one of the best attacking midfield talents in his age group in Europe. Easily. And he will probably move into a deeper role soon enough as well.

I'm not saying at the moment he is worth more than £30mil, but the fact is that Everton - even with money - will not attract a better player than Barkley for that position without Champions League football. It won't happen.

Also, without including his England games as well, this season he has 4 goals and 4 assists in all competitions, from 14 games played in total.

He also has about, off the top of my head, 3 assists for England this season and 2 goals - from playing in a deeper role.I don't see what more you want from him at this point when he is clearly improving game by game.

He wasn't at his best on Sunday, but he did two superb passes behind Sunderland - one that Mirallas was just offside for and another (again to Kev) that he just couldn't finish off.

 

[blue62]

He's an attacking midfielder, he makes killer passes and in the process is likely to hit quite a few stray ones, would you rather he knocked it sideways? His judgement can sometimes be a bit questionable, but experience will improve that aspect of his game but for God's sake, we have a genuine home grown international on our hands with real potential, why don't we just back him and see what happens instead of this senseless carping from some idiots who seem to think the way forward is to sell your best young players and play transfer roulette.

 

[bicycleheader]

Football is a business and we have to see it that way. I couldn't give two hoots if he's a local lad or not. For example, not being local didn't stop me loving the heroes of the 80s teams.

I'm happy to sell a player that I think has a value that overstates his ability. I don't think Barkley is anything like a career long 7 out of 10. More like 20% of games he really stands out.

Tell you what, you enjoy the business and I will continue enjoying the sport. I don´t HAVE to see it any way, despite the huge influx of money.

50M for Ross means nothing to me if the Everton teams following such sales go down the Spurs/Liverpool route of en-masse purchases and barely any identity to the team you are watching every week.

Football has changed hugely, but our club somehow manages to keep hold of some of the charm of the pre-Prem League era. We regularly keep hold of players longer than you think we would, enough for a rapport to grow between the fans and the general squad. Long enough that those players grow to actually give a crap about the club and it´s fans. Long enough that hosts of ex-players still actively either support us or keep a good connection with the club.

On top of that now we are giving a lot of youngers game time and responsibility. One of them is a local lad and a fan.

You are absolutely in the minority if you don´t care about the above and only see it as a business. It is one of the most common things in football at almost all clubs, that when times are really bad the fans can find some comfort or something to get excited about if the club is playing youngsters and even more so if the club plays somebody who is seen as "one of their own".

 

[Charlie Sweet]

I respect your opinion mate, but really, these two points amaze me.

'Reaching his peak' - he's 21 years old.

And he is easily already one of the best attacking midfield talents in his age group in Europe. Easily. And he will probably move into a deeper role soon enough as well.

I'm not saying at the moment he is worth more than £30mil, but the fact is that Everton - even with money - will not attract a better player than Barkley for that position without Champions League football. It won't happen.

Also, without including his England games as well, this season he has 4 goals and 4 assists in all competitions, from 14 games played in total.

He also has about, off the top of my head, 3 assists for England this season and 2 goals - from playing in a deeper role.I don't see what more you want from him at this point when he is clearly improving game by game.

He wasn't at his best on Sunday, but he did two superb passes behind Sunderland - one that Mirallas was just offside for and another (again to Kev) that he just couldn't finish off.

I meant reaching a peak value (relative to the market) - not necessarily his peak ability. He may well improve but I'm not very confident. He's played 100 games yet his decision making if anything is poorer now than when he first burst on to the scene. He's just too selfish in my book.

He gets talked up in our media because he's young and English. I don't follow England but haven't their games recently been against absolute dross?

Would Chelsea swap Oscar for Barkley? I'd take that deal in a heartbeat. Likewise Mata from United?

 

[Charlie Sweet]

Tell you what, you enjoy the business and I will continue enjoying the sport. I don´t HAVE to see it any way, despite the huge influx of money.

50M for Ross means nothing to me if the Everton teams following such sales go down the Spurs/Liverpool route of en-masse purchases and barely any identity to the team you are watching every week.

Football has changed hugely, but our club somehow manages to keep hold of some of the charm of the pre-Prem League era. We regularly keep hold of players longer than you think we would, enough for a rapport to grow between the fans and the general squad. Long enough that those players grow to actually give a crap about the club and it´s fans. Long enough that hosts of ex-players still actively either support us or keep a good connection with the club.

On top of that now we are giving a lot of youngers game time and responsibility. One of them is a local lad and a fan.

You are absolutely in the minority if you don´t care about the above and only see it as a business. It is one of the most common things in football at almost all clubs, that when times are really bad the fans can find some comfort or something to get excited about if the club is playing youngsters and even more so if the club plays somebody who is seen as "one of their own".

I don't know hold old you are or how long you've followed Everton - but do you remember the 80s? Or before that? Being a local lad was never a pre-requisite. Sure it's a bonus but it shouldn't cloud a judgement.

Football is a business. To pretend otherwise is nonsense. We've managed to stay in the top tier of clubs for the last 10+ years by being really smart in the transfer market. We've had to engage in the business side of things to stay competitive. I'd suggest we've hung on to a lot of those players you're alluding to as we had no other option. A number of those players such as Cahill should have been replaced long before they called it a day but we didn't have the option. Likewise Pienaar and Osman today. They shouldn't really be anywhere near a top 6 premier league squad but they still hang around out of necessity.

 

[bicycleheader]

I don't know hold old you are or how long you've followed Everton - but do you remember the 80s? Or before that? Being a local lad was never a pre-requisite. Sure it's a bonus but it shouldn't cloud a judgement.

Football is a business. To pretend otherwise is nonsense. We've managed to stay in the top tier of clubs for the last 10+ years by being really smart in the transfer market. We've had to engage in the business side of things to stay competitive. I'd suggest we've hung on to a lot of those players you're alluding to as we had no other option. A number of those players such as Cahill should have been replaced long before they called it a day but we didn't have the option. Likewise Pienaar and Osman today. They shouldn't really be anywhere near a top 6 premier league squad but they still hang around out of necessity.

I wasn´t giving a judgement....no judgement clouded here. I never said it was a pre-requisite. I am old enough to remember the cup final losses in the late 80s, and not the league wins....unfortunately. I said that it is a very important thing for many many football fans. And your I couldn´t give a hoot attitude would very much be in the minority. You can do a poll maybe, although the response in this thread to your posts should already give you the likely result.

Football to me is a great sport with an amazing and rich history, and is also many other tiny little things tied around watching the game. Football has also long been a business, but that part is not very interesting to me. I don´t think of Mexico 86 and think about how much the stars were sold for afterwards.

 

[Osamabindiesel]

That hospital ball to me was just a really bad pass rather than a bad decision. Having said that, he still makes questionable decisions that have me twisting my nipples... But I like how he can impact the game just by being there. The opposition are really starting to respect him on the pitch as well which opens up space for other players.

 

[TraffordBlue]

Ross Barkley is on of our best players and one of the outstanding talents in English Football and Europe. If we sell a player like Barkley to make a decent profit, we may as well not bother existing.

He's come on tremendously this season as well, and I think those who still berate him, either have some sort of grudge against him (probably because they were desperate to be proved right when he was poor last season), or just can't see a talented player when it's in front of them.

The best talent that Everton and England have produced since Wayne Rooney in my opinion.