2021/22 Rafael Benitez

[Yarrgh]

The manager getting blame for a poor run of results 4 months into a job and the owner and DoF getting away scot-free.

Plotters will plot, I suppose.

But, still 11th in the table after a terrible run of results.

Whose letting those off scot-free? They all deserve a large slice of blame for the state we're in.

 

[davek]

I didn't think you were

My point was more that this will just restart the loop all over again and we'll get ANOTHER week of both sides of the divide kicking lumps out of one another

So just let a group of sabouteurs who want the manager out run the forum's content then?

That sounds like a solution.

 

[davek]

Whose letting those off scot-free? They all deserve a large slice of blame for the state we're in.

No. They deserve ALL the blame.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

So just let a group of sabouteurs who want the manager - who's not to blame - run the forum's content then?

That sounds like a solution.

I feel that, as one of the more gifted debaters and wordsmiths we have on here, it behoves you to be on of those who are trying to reach across the aisle rather than dedicating yourself to being an agent of chaos

Basically, I expect more of you, whether that's fair or not

 

[Tubey]

Whose letting those off scot-free? They all deserve a large slice of blame for the state we're in.

Benitez deserves about 1% of the blame. He's made questionable tactical calls at times and there was one game where his team selection, even accounting for availability, was an abomination.

But he's getting 90%+ of the ire on here. That's the issue.

 

[grandjoeblue]

Benitez is not the long-term managerial solution for this club but if you think sacking him and bringing in someone else will be the silver bullet that kils off all this club's demons then you're sorely mistaken.

The cycle will continue as long as the ownership / board are able to operate completely beyond reproach and accountability.

If hes not the long term solution we need to look at sacking him and getting the right person in. We've stagnated for long enough.

 

[tommye]

It’s a sad indictment when you’re looking at the teams below and their fixtures hoping that they drop points...

...in November ?

 

[ToffeeTim]

They were not, all people said was he should be given a chance. You may have got one WUM at most going over the top, but generally people were simply saying wait and see.

That isn't 'idolising'. If Benitez gets sacked for poor performance I personally couldn't give a toss, but if he gets sacked because a bunch of fools can't wrap their head around he had a different job once upon a time then I do give a toss.

2 points from 18, 1 win from 9, is poor performance.

If we lose 2 or 3 more in succession then that's the definition of poor performance and no manager survives that. I don't know what people expect. Koeman, Silva, Martinez all were sacked for runs like that. In fact Koeman didn't get 12 games of a season! If it isn't turned around in the next month then there is no argument that he should go.

 

[Furey1878]

Whose letting those off scot-free? They all deserve a large slice of blame for the state we're in.

I think it's fair to say that a lot of people are calling for the manager's head louder than they are bemoaning the current ownership and board.

I mean if those people in question genuinely feel Benitez has to go AND we still address the issue of poorly this club has been ran for the last 5/6 years then fair enough, I personally think we should focus on the latter first though.

 

[davek]

I feel that, as one of the more gifted debaters and wordsmiths we have on here, it behoves you to be on of those who are trying to reach across the aisle rather than dedicating yourself to being an agent of chaos

Basically, I expect more of you, whether that's fair or not

Done that. It isn't acceptable to them.

'Cap in hand gets kick in teeth', as the old saying goes.

 

[Tubey]

2 points from 18, 1 win from 9, is poor performance.

If we lose 2 or 3 more in succession then that's the definition of poor performance and no manager survives that. I don't know what people expect. Koeman, Silva, Martinez all were sacked for runs like that. In fact Koeman didn't get 12 games of a season!

We were 1 point worse off last season under Ancelotti at this point of the season and just came off a 2-0 bumming at home to Norwich.

EDIT: Sorry no, wrong season, that was the season before - we were 1 point better off under Ancelotti after losing three of the last four games.

So in each of the past two seasons, we've been exactly the same. Because we've had largely the same bunch of cowards playing.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

There needs to be much more calm and reason to the debate, but I wouldn't say it's extreme to say a manager with 1 win in 9 should be under pressure. Teams who are below us in the table have already replaced their manager after form like that.

If anything, we are always the club who wait far too long before acting. It's not an extreme poisition to think the manager should be under pressure. The extreme position is to suggest that this run of form is fine and that staying up is the target.

There's a difference between saying the manager is under pressure after a bad run and some of the anti-Benitez stuff we're seeing, just as there's a difference between looking at genuine explanations for WHY we're in this period of bad form (injuries, tough run of fixtures) and acting like Benitez is some kind of tactical savant who is being unfairly critiqued

The problem is the extreme elements of the anti-Benitez camp and the extreme elements of the pro-Benitez camp are not prepared to yield on ANYTHING, and seem dedicated to just going through the same cycle after every game REGARDLESS of the result or performance

Basically, I'm frigging sick of it now, as are a lot of others I feel

It's the beyond the point that we got our collective stuff in order when it comes to this topic

 

[Tubey]

There's a difference between saying the manager is under pressure after a bad run and some of the anti-Benitez stuff we're seeing, just as there's a difference between looking at genuine explanations for WHY we're in this period of bad form (injuries, tough run of fixtures) and acting like Benitez is some kind of tactical savant who is being unfairly critiqued

The problem is the extreme elements of the anti-Benitez camp and the extreme elements of the pro-Benitez camp are not prepared to yield on ANYTHING, and seem dedicated to just going through the same cycle after every game REGARDLESS of the result or performance

Basically, I'm frigging sick of it now, as are a lot of others I feel

It's the beyond the point that we got our collective stuff in order when it comes to this topic

Nobody is doing this. Nobody.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Nobody is doing this. Nobody.

There are definitely those who are completely closed minded to any critique of Benitez and will push back on everything

 

[ToffeeTim]

We were 1 point worse off last season under Ancelotti at this point of the season and just came off a 2-0 bumming at home to Norwich.

Ancelotti didn't play Norwich last season, so that can't be right.

That result was under Silva, and pre-covid