[POLL] Should Ronald Koeman be sacked?

[davek]

Martinez brought a perennial 6-7 place team up two spots to a 5th place team and that earned him two more full seasons of below average football.

Koeman brought a team that was back-to-back 11th place finisher to 7th and people are clamoring for his outing two months into the season.

You're right, no comparing the two situations- Martinez was dealt an infinitely better hand and marginally improved results; Koeman had a much tougher task and improved the squad by a larger margin in his first year.

Lol.

 

[Efcjake]

Wow the numbers on that poll are worse than just about any Martinez one bar the week he finally got the sack. A lot less patience and good will for old moonhead it seems.

 

[matty1878]

So's Koeman right now. I've never been so miserable and put off and uninterested about Everton thanks to him.

The premier league to the under 23 one.... Totally different that's what I'm trying to say.

 

[matty1878]

There is no right team we totally messed up in the summer all over the shop. He could do better with what he has though. The point is if he goes we need a clear recruitment strategy. What type of team are we building?

This. It's not just koeman it goes further beyond but people don't see that. Selling your only good striker has derailed the season before it began. Which I said it would.

 

[ianefc]

Martinez brought a perennial 6-7 place team up two spots to a 5th place team and that earned him two more full seasons of below average football.

Koeman brought a team that was back-to-back 11th place finisher to 7th and people are clamoring for his outing two months into the season.

You're right, no comparing the two situations- Martinez was dealt an infinitely better hand and marginally improved results; Koeman had a much tougher task and improved the squad by a larger margin in his first year.

Anyway this isn't the Martinez thread, but I feel Koeman should get the same treatment Martinez did- a good first year should earn you time and I think (hope) the board agrees- if we don't see marked improvement by Christmas then it's time for change.

Lets be honest no matter who the manager is over the next 12 months this squad is a project, no manager worth their salt will want to come in if they see the club will abandon them at the first sign of trouble.

Bang on the money.

 

[kenada_blue]

Martinez brought a perennial 6-7 place team up two spots to a 5th place team and that earned him two more full seasons of below average football.

Koeman brought a team that was back-to-back 11th place finisher to 7th and people are clamoring for his outing two months into the season.

You're right, no comparing the two situations- Martinez was dealt an infinitely better hand and marginally improved results; Koeman had a much tougher task and improved the squad by a larger margin in his first year.

Anyway this isn't the Martinez thread, but I feel Koeman should get the same treatment Martinez did- a good first year should earn you time and I think (hope) the board agrees- if we don't see marked improvement by Christmas then it's time for change.

Lets be honest no matter who the manager is over the next 12 months this squad is a project, no manager worth their salt will want to come in if they see the club will abandon them at the first sign of trouble.

There's 200mill reasons why Koeman was dealt the better hand.

 

[ToffeeTim]

Shambolic that we are going into a must win game in 3 days time with a complete lame duck manager. Pathetic owners.

 

[riddick]

Martinez brought a perennial 6-7 place team up two spots to a 5th place team and that earned him two more full seasons of below average football.

Koeman brought a team that was back-to-back 11th place finisher to 7th and people are clamoring for his outing two months into the season.

You're right, no comparing the two situations- Martinez was dealt an infinitely better hand and marginally improved results; Koeman had a much tougher task and improved the squad by a larger margin in his first year.

Anyway this isn't the Martinez thread, but I feel Koeman should get the same treatment Martinez did- a good first year should earn you time and I think (hope) the board agrees- if we don't see marked improvement by Christmas then it's time for change.

Lets be honest no matter who the manager is over the next 12 months this squad is a project, no manager worth their salt will want to come in if they see the club will abandon them at the first sign of trouble.

TO BE FAIR, Martinez had us looking at a new dawn, he had a style, he had a vision.


Koeman has a massive(this cannot be understated) head.

 

[LookmanShootsGOLLLL]

I voted no because this side is to unbalanced for any manager to get them playing the football we want. Now Koeman is responsible for that but I think if u hand a manager a lot of money you should give him time to address the issues

 

[catcherintherye]

I'm sure the extra goals from Lukaku would have dramatically transformed the last RM season. But the counter point that conceding a lot less would have done the same trick is also valid. I dont think Lukaku not scoring or lack of scoring generally did for Roberto. My perception at the time was that Lukaku was keeping him in a job!

On the identity issue: Koeman is - as you say - unlike his two predecessors. He projects nothing. Not a thing. There is no Koeman hallmark. That's not just down to a clueless playing style. It's also because he doesn't connect with the organisation. He prefers to live well away from Liverpool. How many fan functions has he done since being here? I cant recall any. Moyes and especially Martinez were very accessible. Both men had time for fans. Can you think of many times Koeman has connected like that? Does he think tweeting some nonsense is him 'cutting through' and staying in touch?

He doesn't care about the club, he doesn't care about the history of it, he doesn't care about the players, he doesn't particularly care about the fans other than to fear their judgement because he doesn't want an ignominious sacking on his CV. If he did care he'd be getting an awful lot more support right now than he is. But he's a dislikable character and no one apart from a handful of people gives a flying one about his struggles here, they just want the miserable get out. And rightly so.

I subscribed to a similar view on Martinez. That being said, his Xg was 25 and total was 17. We made lots of chanced for Lukaku and he didn't finish them. The reality is, his finishing helped cover up the cracks for Koeman. Martinez gambled on Barkley, Lukaku and Deulofeu coming good, which unfortunately they didn't. I probably think now what did for him was his strengths not holding up, as opposed to his weaknesses. Lets have it this way, if Lukaku had scored 30+ goals most of the extra in the first half of the season we go into Christmas in the top 4. I still think we have a dip, but from a much higher point and arguably a far shallower drop.

I still think Martinez probably goes a similar way but slower, his vision was utopian and not ideal for England. But then thats what people have been cuing up to say of Pep and he seems to be re-writing that a little bit.

As for Koeman yes I agree. I think Moyes, particularly at the end became a bit up himself though I do think he cared about the club, and Martinez would do as well. I don't mind Koeman's arrogance, but you had better make sure you produce results if thats your attitude.

I like long term appointments. Thats what is keeping my support for Koeman. However you do have to say, he has never shown any interest in being here longer than 18 more months. So what can he realistically build in that time?

 

[Stan Lee Park]

I subscribed to a similar view on Martinez. That being said, his Xg was 25 and total was 17. We made lots of chanced for Lukaku and he didn't finish them. The reality is, his finishing helped cover up the cracks for Koeman. Martinez gambled on Barkley, Lukaku and Deulofeu coming good, which unfortunately they didn't. I probably think now what did for him was his strengths not holding up, as opposed to his weaknesses. Lets have it this way, if Lukaku had scored 30+ goals most of the extra in the first half of the season we go into Christmas in the top 4. I still think we have a dip, but from a much higher point and arguably a far shallower drop.

I still think Martinez probably goes a similar way but slower, his vision was utopian and not ideal for England. But then thats what people have been cuing up to say of Pep and he seems to be re-writing that a little bit.

As for Koeman yes I agree. I think Moyes, particularly at the end became a bit up himself though I do think he cared about the club, and Martinez would do as well. I don't mind Koeman's arrogance, but you had better make sure you produce results if thats your attitude.

I like long term appointments. Thats what is keeping my support for Koeman. However you do have to say, he has never shown any interest in being here longer than 18 more months. So what can he realistically build in that time?

Sorry, you lost me there.

 

[Famous_Seamus]

Lol.

Just a refresher dave- middle of 14/15 campaign we had a stretch of 2W-9L-5D with one of the wins being home to QPR. Over that stretch we scored 11 conceded 22. The manager at the time was given the remainder of the season and ANOTHER FULL SEASON after that. I'm sure you had the same exact sentiment calling for the managers ousting- unless of course we were playing "pretty" football at the time, but surely 11 goals over 16 games isn't "pretty" now is it?

Also if you don't think Koeman was more impressive in his first season I bring your attention to 1W-6L-3D - the record of the final 10 games under RM, with only 7 for and 19 conceded. THAT is what Koeman inherited.

 

[Rudolf Hucker]

Martinez brought a perennial 6-7 place team up two spots to a 5th place team and that earned him two more full seasons of below average football.

Koeman brought a team that was back-to-back 11th place finisher to 7th and people are clamoring for his outing two months into the season.

You're right, no comparing the two situations- Martinez was dealt an infinitely better hand and marginally improved results; Koeman had a much tougher task and improved the squad by a larger margin in his first year.

Anyway this isn't the Martinez thread, but I feel Koeman should get the same treatment Martinez did- a good first year should earn you time and I think (hope) the board agrees- if we don't see marked improvement by Christmas then it's time for change.

Lets be honest no matter who the manager is over the next 12 months this squad is a project, no manager worth their salt will want to come in if they see the club will abandon them at the first sign of trouble.

He’s spent TWO HUNDRED MILLION & made us worse FFS!!!

 

[ToffeeTim]

Plane needed

 

[davek]

I still think we have a dip, but from a much higher point and arguably a far shallower drop. I still think Martinez probably goes a similar way but slower, his vision was utopian and not ideal for England. But then thats what people have been cuing up to say of Pep and he seems to be re-writing that a little bit. As for Koeman yes I agree. I think Moyes, particularly at the end became a bit up himself though I do think he cared about the club, and Martinez would do as well. I don't mind Koeman's arrogance, but you had better make sure you produce results if thats your attitude.

I like long term appointments. Thats what is keeping my support for Koeman. However you do have to say, he has never shown any interest in being here longer than 18 more months. So what can he realistically build in that time?

Exactly. This feller though has traded on his playing days. His managerial record is abysmal. He is not a winner - the only thing that can make others tolerate the BS attitude he has.

No one's arsed about his playing career. It wont get him any special hearing here at this club, that's for sure. He needs/needed to understand that we've had bigger and better play for us and manage us, and that no one is cutting him or his antics any slack. This isn't Southampton. If he thought he could play the big I am that he did down there at this club he's going to be sadly mistaken...as he found out at that game yesterday when the fans called for his head.