New Everton Stadium - Hill Dickinson Stadium

Dr Baxter said:
Question for the nay sayers. Why are the club still insisting the stadium will be built? Has it been a con from day one? Or was a genuine plan which has just been too difficult and/or expensive to pull off? I understand the club has previous and the pretence of building a new stadium served Kenwright well on several occasions in that it took the heat off him and bought him more time in charge. I was certainly taken in by KD (and excited by it) and DK (thank God that didn't happen). But why this and why now?

What are Moshiri's motives in this huge con? He didn't have to suggest a new stadium. Most of us were just happy that at long last there was a change at the top (a change compounded in the last week, I might).

So, although all the clues for you Miss Marples out there seem to be pointing at it never happening, what is/was Moshiri's motive in this crime? Bogus from the off? Fine, but why even suggest it. Genuine attempt but ultimately not doable? Fine, but why prolong the agony and appoint a new stadium director, architect still on board etc and not pull the plug as soon as possible? That is what doesn't make sense to me.
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No one is suggesting it's all a ruse. Gregg wasn't involved with Everton over the KD stadium for a ruse; Earl (/Green) wasn't involved in the club over DK for a ruse. Moshiri isn't owner of Everton to conduct a ruse over the BMD stadium. They were/are all in it to get a massive return from the sale of a club with a new stadium. But what links them all together is a wing and a prayer attitude to funding one. Basically it's the same old story: we have an idea for a stadium...now YOU build it for us and YOU pay for it for us and we'll just hang about until you do (and keep our end of things up by spinning our fans a series of "updates" until it actually gets built or fails).

The "motives" are real enough. It's the delivery which is the issue. This club simply cant deliver. It doesn't have the clout and it doesn't have the cache and - most importantly of all - it doesn't have the wherewithall to deliver.

The absolute 'kin brass neck cheek of that Colin Chong "update" is only just hitting home with me now. Telling everyone that's been through three of these BS processes already that we need to understand this that and the other. Well we all 'kin KNOW the drill back to front you 'kin divvy. We dont need you to tell us how difficult it is, we need you to get GTF on with it and do it.

'kin 'updates" and "consultations". Just do what you should have done 20 years ago and get the 'kin thing built.
 

RobC said:
No chance, unless its around 40, 000 capacity.
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Easily could. In fact probably could build a 60,000 stadium but it would be a bare bones one. The Cardiff City stadium cost £48 million in 2009, those that have had the pleasure of being inside it will tell you it is a world away from the new Spurs stadium will be or say the Emirates/Wembley etc. with all the bare concrete/piping and wires and no finishing touches.

Granted inflation will have added a fair bit on to that but not to the point a larger version would cost 8 times more. So the devil is in the design and what you want it to look like, of course we wouldn't want to have a cow shed for a stadium but compromises could be made if they had to.
 
davek said:
No one is suggesting it's all a ruse. Gregg wasn't involved with Everton over the KD stadium for a ruse; Earl (/Green) wasn't involved in the club over DK for a ruse. Moshiri isn't owner of Everton to conduct a ruse over the BMD stadium. They were/are all in it to get a massive return from the sale of a club with a new stadium. But what links them all together is a wing and a prayer attitude to funding one. Basically it's the same old story: we have an idea for a stadium...now YOU build it for us and YOU pay for it for us and we'll just hang about until you do (and keep our end of things up by spinning our fans a series of "updates" until it actually gets built or fails).

The "motives" are real enough. It's the delivery which is the issue. This club simply cant deliver. It doesn't have the clout and it doesn't have the cache and - most importantly of all - it doesn't have the wherewithall to deliver.

The absolute 'kin brass neck cheek of that Colin Chong "update" is only just hitting home with me now. Telling everyone that's been through three of these BS processes already that we need to understand this that and the other. Well we all 'kin KNOW the drill back to front you 'kin divvy. We dont need you to tell us how difficult it is, we need you to get GTF on with it and do it.

'kin 'updates" and "consultations". Just do what you should have done 20 years ago and get the 'kin thing built.
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You've gone full Davek there, never go full Davek! :D

I think you will be pleasantly surprised this time Dave. No one likes waiting but unless the ark of the covenant is found at the bottom of BM dock or Moshiri shuffles off this mortal coil before it gets built then it should be ok.

...And just have a think about it for a moment and name me a club that has just built and paid for it's own stadium, the money always comes from other lenders why should we be any different?
 
wainy said:
Can't argue with any of that to be honest mate. I understand your caution and scepticism when it comes to Everton and stadiums, I just don't think the club would be commenting though if they wanted this issue to go away, for whatever reason.

I am keen to see this new "progress website" they have mentioned in that interview, maybe I am an optimist, but I don't understand why Everton would talk about this without being confident of it happening although, again, this is Everton we are dealing with.

Interesting also that Meis will be attending today, any thoughts on that?
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They've talked to exhaustion about every stadioum we've been linked with in the last 20 years: Kirkby golf course; Kings Dock, Destination Kirkby...all front and centre and full confidence, right to the last minute. I wouldn't say it indicates anything much.

The progress website will be interesting. But it'll be another case of distraction and I suspect it wont be interactive. They wont want that...at all.
 

The binman chronicles said:
You've gone full Davek there, never go full Davek! :D

I think you will be pleasantly surprised this time Dave. No one likes waiting but unless the ark of the covenant is found at the bottom of BM dock or Moshiri shuffles off this mortal coil before it gets built then it should be ok.

...And just have a think about it for a moment and name me a club that has just built and paid for it's own stadium, the money always comes from other lenders why should we be any different?
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Twenty years since Kirkby golf course I've been told that. "It's a done deal". "It's in the bag". "I heard it's defo going ahead from someone in the council". "Too many vested interests for it to fail".

We never learn. I'm not saying this one wont happen. But the view surely should be, after 20 years of shovelling BS piled on us from this club, "do it, dont talk about it...and until a PA is passed and a spade sinks into the ground you've got an uphill battle persuading me". We certainly shoudn't be hanging on the word of these people and accepting ITK info.
 
No, Dave. Not the motive to get it built. That's obvious to one and all. What is the motive a) saying we'll be building a new stadium when we have no intention of doing so and/or b) continuing to suggest that we'll build a stadium when the work done so far suggests it is no longer feasible. Please explain, be specific. Show working as the JMB used to say on the Maths O level paper.
 
davek said:
Twenty years since Kirkby golf course I've been told that. "It's a done deal". "It's in the bag". "I heard it's defo going ahead from someone in the council". "Too many vested interests for it to fail".

We never learn. I'm not saying this one wont happen. But the view surely should be, after 20 years of shovelling BS piled on us from this club, "do it, dont talk about it...and until a PA is passed and a spade sinks into the ground you've got an uphill battle persuading me". We certainly shoudn't be hanging on the word of these people and accepting ITK info.
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..that sounds reasonable. So, you’re not saying it’s not going to happen, you’re saying there’ve been too many false dawns. Lets’s be sceptical until we see actions instead of words.
 
Dr Baxter said:
No, Dave. Not the motive to get it built. That's obvious to one and all. What is the motive a) saying we'll be building a new stadium when we have no intention of doing so and/or b) continuing to suggest that we'll build a stadium when the work done so far suggests it is no longer feasible. Please explain, be specific. Show working as the JMB used to say on the Maths O level paper.
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The intention is there - I'm not disputing that; and it probably is feasible from a financial p.o.v. but it's not been possible yet.

None of that undermines anything I've said though.
 

Eggs said:
..that sounds reasonable. So, you’re not saying it’s not going to happen, you’re saying there’ve been too many false dawns. Lets’s be sceptical until we see actions instead of words.
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In a word, yes.

It's the common sense approach but will be shouted down as the negative one. People aren't paying attention if they think that though. The last 3 utter failures at building a stadium has been forgotten.
 
davek said:
In a word, yes.

It's the common sense approach but will be shouted down as the negative one. People aren't paying attention if they think that though. The last 3 utter failures at building a stadium has been forgotten.
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..and I do think that’s a very reasonable and indeed a sensible stance for us all to take. It’s just at times there’s abrasive ‘this is never happening’ posts.

I’m in the camp of this would be brilliant but it’s time for the talking to stop and the development to start. I think it will, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it didn’t.
 
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