Moyes

[Del]

I think the only thing that made us gash until Jan was selling Arteta

 

[Brennan]

Im not happy that our season started in January- but when we have had a squad that Moyes wanted we have competed. Look at the form table from where our signings came in January and you'll see.

The fact that we HAD to sell Arteta and didnt replace him, the fact that Moyes operates under such tight constraints and has to wheel and deal his way to a squad that can compete.

People have said how poor our football has been this season and yes at the start when a 17 year old kid and then a player many cant decide if he is a centre half or a midfielder was our most creative influence you know why.

If and its a big if, we manage to keep hold of our top players for next season, maybe if we have to sell to raise money one or two of the fringe players so we can secure Pienaar maybe invest in a right back and look at some more creativity in the middle.

Brennan when we sold Pienaar both he and Mikel had been out of sorts, when you have a small squad and your two most influential players are off form or injured you will struggle.

But the thing is, our season actually picked up AFTER Pienaar left. Pienaar may have been out of sorts, but that still doesn't explain us suddenly getting markedly better results after he went to Spurs.

Jelavic was rested against Sunderland, as was Baines and we still battered them all over the park. Clearly something is going wrong between August and December which is not just down to poor player performances, and it needs to be sorted out pronto.

 

[bluejock]

I think the only thing that made us gash until Jan was selling Arteta

MONSTER

 

[Summerskin]

I think the only thing that made us gash until Jan was selling Arteta

I thoroughly cannot agree with this, he was f*cking AWFUL for a long time before he left.

His own personal form and the fact that he was playing in such a rubbish footballing team made him painful to watch.

 

[Azzurri]

That 'seventh heaven' DVD wasn't about finishing seventh ffs it was when we beat Sunderland 7-0.

 

[paulbefc]

That would be great if it wasn't for the fact that we did the exact same thing last season with Arteta and Pienaar in the squad. We actually lost Pienaar and then our form picked up.

You can't play down the impact of losing them. Pienaar is one of the main, if not the main reason we have picked up form since january. The only time when we haven't had either Pienaar or Arteta in the squad since 2004 is September-January. And that period was one of the worst in Moyes' reign. Had we had Pienaar it could have been different. Same for Gibson. He's allowed Felli to be creative and Jelavic has provided the goals. We couldn't have done a whole lot better than we did because we were putting out an XI with only Baines and Fellaini who were actually top 6 quality. And even they were hampered by the fact that Baines didn't have a decent player in front of him to make space in behind the full back for him and Felli was restricted to defensive midfield.

Yes, we've had gash starts with Pienaar and Arteta in the squad too, but every summer we get shat on by the financial situation and the board before the season even starts ffs. The only recent occasion where this hasn't been the case is the "best squad since I took the job" year. A misguided statement from Moyes imo. Personally, I think we put a lot of pressure on Beckford, Rodwell and Coleman among others that season and they weren't the right calibre of player to push us on. Arteta was regressing and Saha was getting into his method for not getting injured but playing sensationally gash. But Beckford was free and Coleman was £60k, it wasn't like we'd spent anything that summer.

 

[thebluefox]

Thread title edited twice and Muggins giving me an infraction for expressing my opinion?

Nazi state, this forum lids!![ your not the only one,

 

[Del]

I thoroughly cannot agree with this, he was f*cking AWFUL for a long time before he left.

His own personal form and the fact that he was playing in such a rubbish footballing team made him painful to watch.

His leaving was the catalyst for our poor form mate

If he would have stayed I am sure we would be fighting for a top 5 place

 

[paulbefc]

But the thing is, our season actually picked up AFTER Pienaar left. Pienaar may have been out of sorts, but that still doesn't explain us suddenly getting markedly better results after he went to Spurs.

Jelavic was rested against Sunderland, as was Baines and we still battered them all over the park. Clearly something is going wrong between August and December which is not just down to poor player performances, and it needs to be sorted out pronto.

Certain players really played out of their skin second half of last season. Osman being one prime example. He was the scapegoat in the first half, catalyst in the second.

 

[Summerskin]

His leaving was the catalyst for our poor form mate

If he would have stayed I am sure we would be fighting for a top 5 place

I will have to respectfully but wholeheartedly disagree with you on that one, sir.

He's doing well at Arsenal but he's changed as a player too much to have an effect on us like he used to.

 

[micknick]

I know we were forced into selling Arteta but can we have some acknowledgement that this isn't the only thing that made us gash til January?

Before he left we got beat at home to QPR and spawned the jammiest win in history at Blackburn, relying on them missing two penalties.

Look im not just blaming it all on Arteta but selling one of our best players and at the time our most influential creative player just before the season starts is going to have an affect especially when we dont have anything in reserve or bring anything in to replace that void.

We then have to change the way we play because of it.

I still think our priority needs to be someone in the middle instead of Gibson. I dont think hes the answer even though many are cooing over him. We need someone who can put their foot on the ball, pick a pass and can take a player on if needs be.

Would love to see a playmaker in there with the big Fella.

 

[Summerskin]

Certain players really played out of their skin second half of last season. Osman being one prime example. He was the scapegoat in the first half, catalyst in the second.

All of these arguments just point to Moyes not being a particularly good motivator, half a seasons worth of good performances out of your football team for four years on the trot seriously puts question marks over his enthusiasm for me.

 

[Summerskin]

Look im not just blaming it all on Arteta but selling one of our best players and at the time our most influential creative player just before the season starts is going to have an affect especially when we dont have anything in reserve or bring anything in to replace that void.

Not Baines?

I know stats don't tell the whole story but goals are stats too, and he scored and set up nearly twice as more.

Squaring balls and playing in centre midfield doesn't equal creativity, and I suppose neither does a nice cross/cut back from the left...but I think until recently we've all lamented the fact that most of our play comes from the little lad at the back.

 

[Brennan]

2008/09 was the last season where we were higher in the table in the first half of the year than where we eventually finished. That should always be the aim for any team, a strong start to the season so you don't have as much pressure after Christmas.

We were 14th at the end of January 2011. Yes we lost Pienaar but regardless of that the squad we had should never have been 14th, as our second half proved when we went and finished 7th.

I'm sick of watching us play s***e football for the entire first half of the year and people defending it because we've sold some players. We smashed Sunderland 4-0 without Jelavic, Baines or Fellaini. We beat Chelsea 2-0 without Jelavic. We beat City 1-0 without Jelavic.

In fact, Jelavic didn't even play until March 10th (excluding a cameo against Wigan).

Moyes said that the new signings gave everybody a lift, but the players shouldn't NEED a lift to play their best, and the manager should be giving them the left and filling them with the desire to go out on the pitch and play as they prove they can time and time again.

Taking 4 points from Swansea, Stoke, Norwich, and Bolton at home is a disgrace.

 

[Brennan]

Not Baines?

I know stats don't tell the whole story but goals are stats too, and he scored and set up nearly twice as more.

Squaring balls and playing in centre midfield doesn't equal creativity, and I suppose neither does a nice cross/cut back from the left...but I think until recently we've all lamented the fact that most of our play comes from the little lad at the back.

Twice as more goals lad !