Marco Silva

[davek]

We've been over this countless times.

Fitness was an issue under Martinez, but not the only one. My main complaint was always that he clearly spent little to no time drilling his players on shape off the ball - something which has been vital to success in England since Mourinho's arrival.

Watching City from the Top Balcony, it was evident that the attention to detail was on another level. It obviously helps that Guardiola can just go out and buy whoever he wants, but it would only be money wasted if the players weren't buying into his methods wholeheartedly. The difference between their Goodison performances this season and last were night and day. They now have players that are at their physical peak, being drilled to press and squeeze at the right times and in the right areas.

Another example would be how Gasperini had his Atalanta team playing. They were fantastic from front to back, and that was a side put together on basically a shoe-string budget.

Yes, but I wouldn't say City hand out too many defensive masterclasses either. They just outplay the opposition and have them pinned most of the game.

The general trend in our game has been to place way too much emphasis on attack and not enough about the art of defending, and Martinez was a product of that thinking.

BTW, I liked Atalanta very much. But it's a lot easier selling defensive qualities in that league than the PL.

I'm really hoping Silva comes in and gets the balance right. I reckon he has half a chance.

 

[tsubaki]

Yes, but I wouldn't say City hand out too many defensive masterclasses either. They just outplay the opposition and have them pinned most of the game.

The general trend in our game has been to place way too much emphasis on attack and not enough about the art of defending, and Martinez was a product of that thinking.

BTW, I liked Atalanta very much. But it's a lot easier selling defensive qualities in that league than the PL.

I'm really hoping Silva comes in and gets the balance right. I reckon he has half a chance.

Martinez's problem was that he found a way to play in his first season and then threw it away for his second and third. If Silva can take us back to that style he and we will probably do well.

 

[Tubey]

Why bring Silva is showing ambition? West Ham are showing more ambition than Everton. Raff Benitiz and Manuel Pellegrini being linked. We need a big name. Most of the Fans want a big name.

Getting Silva is going to be another mistake.

If Aston Villa come up next season, they will spend big, as will Wolves - getting into the top 10 not going to be easy, never mind 7th.

When one of the top team sack their manager, you just have to look at the names being linked to the jobs. The ones linked to Everton are always managers the top 6 will never employ.

Everton lack ambition- just got to look at pre-season when we never play any of the top teams in europe for a pre-season game.
So Everton cannot play RS in the USA or Australia.

Time to be more ambition Everton, or mid table teams will go ahead of.

That's not ambition from West Ham; that's pandering to the fans. "Quick, get someone they recognise from Sky Sports News so they stop throwing things at us!"

Was signing Rooney ambition? Because that was the same thing - pandering instead of a plan.

Ambition means having a cohesive plan to achieve something. I'm at least seeing the start of such a plan at Everton - I'm prepared to see how it pans out instead of cryarsing because we're not signing someone boss on FIFA.

 

[Tubey]

Martinez's problem was that he found a way to play in his first season and then threw it away for his second and third. If Silva can take us back to that style he and we will probably do well.

The solid base from the Moyes era benefited Martinez tremendously and negated his defensive recklessness. Martinez effectively brought in the opposite of Moyes - attacking impetus and a bit of flair and belief - and for a while a nice balance existed that and the stoic traits we had under Moyes.

It was no coincidence that Martinez got worse the longer he was here and had time to impose his own way on the club.

 

[Eggsyblueskin]

We fall into the trap of categorising coaches based purely on the broad bush method of 'styles' , defensive, counter, possession etc. Whereas the truth is every coach or manager has their own unique template.
We may say that Simeone, Mourinho and Allardyce are predominantly 'defensive' , but in reality their methods of training , man management, and the way their teams move on the pitch are vastly different.
Perhaps it is the amount of pragmatism or variability a coach is able to introduce to his own template that define success or failure, because there is no one definitively successful way of playing football.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Why bring Silva is showing ambition? West Ham are showing more ambition than Everton. Raff Benitiz and Manuel Pellegrini being linked. We need a big name. Most of the Fans want a big name.

Getting Silva is going to be another mistake.

If Aston Villa come up next season, they will spend big, as will Wolves - getting into the top 10 not going to be easy, never mind 7th.

When one of the top team sack their manager, you just have to look at the names being linked to the jobs. The ones linked to Everton are always managers the top 6 will never employ.

Everton lack ambition- just got to look at pre-season when we never play any of the top teams in europe for a pre-season game.
So Everton cannot play RS in the USA or Australia.

Time to be more ambition Everton, or mid table teams will go ahead of.

I disagree mate. A big name is exactly what we don't need at the moment.

What we need is a clear strategy of where we want to be as a football club, and how we intend to get there. We've gone down the DoF route and appointed an experienced and respected operator to fulfil that very important role. Now we need to employ a manager, coaching staff and playing staff, who will work together to make that strategy a reality. Hopefully that strategy will involve a playing style that will invoke the support of all Evertonians and have us off our feet again and the old ground buzzing. But we all need to be pulling in the same direction. What we don't need is a big name coming in wanting to do things his own way, going against the structure and culture we are trying to build within the club.

 

[davek]

Any danger of a source for that?

We covered 109.4km per game under Koeman in 16/17.

Struggling to find data for us in Martinez’s last season, apart from that it’s less than 109.8km per game. (found a list of the 10 teams that ran most that season, which we weren’t in, and 10th was 109.8km)

2014/15 we ran 111KM average per game (which was 6th highest in the PL). Following season it fell off dramatically to 105KM - the players just downed tools. (Cant see the 2013/14 figures but I strongly suspect they'd be nearer the former than latter)

Point stands though: Martinez had us running more than Koeman did.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...en-promise-extra-day-Red-s-extra-running.html

 

[davek]

Regardless of how much they ran, they just didn't press. The likes of Lukaku, Del, Mirallas, Barkley etc did absolutely nothing to try and win the ball back early high up the pitch when we lost possession.

Yes, I agree there's a difference to how EFFECTIVE the running is. However, the point stands that they had to be fit enough to cover that distance....which was more than Koeman got out of them.

 

[Bluewolf]

"Looked like they didn't" being the key words.

Koeman's first season (the one he "solved" our lax fitness regime) it was shown our team ran less in games than under Martinez.

An utter fallacy repeated ad nauseam.

That little stat would be over Martinez 3 seasons in charge to koemans one? So whatever way you look at it that stat is going to be skewed.

What can't be skewed is the fact that we stopped conceding goals in the last 15 minutes of games under koeman and started scoring and wining games instead.

I wasn't a fan of Martinez but I backed him and I will back Silva even though he wouldn't be my first choice. What gives me hope even in the face of a "Martinez mk2" is the mistakes made by Martinez like the defence, lax training, keeping Howard in even though he was throwing goals into the back of his net every game, alienating the senior players while giving the youngest players the rule of the roost and buying a team of bloody crap midgets. Now that can't happen because you have a dof who knows what hes doing as his boss who can reign him back in when he can't see the Forrest for the trees.

 

[davek]

Martinez's problem was that he found a way to play in his first season and then threw it away for his second and third. If Silva can take us back to that style he and we will probably do well.

His mistake was to retain players he should have binned. He had the stock to carry out such pruning but chose to leave them in place...and spent WAY too much time that summer at the WC on tv panels.

 

[COYBL25]

The solid base from the Moyes era benefited Martinez tremendously and negated his defensive recklessness. Martinez effectively brought in the opposite of Moyes - attacking impetus and a bit of flair and belief - and for a while a nice balance existed that and the stoic traits we had under Moyes.

It was no coincidence that Martinez got worse the longer he was here and had time to impose his own way on the club.

I`m very much liking your stuff this morning

 

[jayonenote]

Correct loosing the ball with a high line and not pressuring to get it back is tactical suicide. Peps teams press, most organised sides in the bundselgia do, The unmentionables, athletico ect good teams have good work rates for all different styles. The less time a player has on the ball the more likely he will make a mistake it’s basic really

It was interesting ( and clecer to see)...when Athletico kicked off in the Europa League Cup Final they immediately kicked the ball into touch for a throw in high up near to the corner flag...meaning Marseille had to take a throw in way into their half..Athletico won the ball back within 2 touches from the throw in and immediately on tge attack with Marseille on the back foot...Very clever.

 

[davek]

That little stat would be over Martinez 3 seasons in charge to koemans one? So whatever way you look at it that stat is going to be skewed.

What can't be skewed is the fact that we stopped conceding goals in the last 15 minutes of games under koeman and started scoring and wining games instead.

I wasn't a fan of Martinez but I backed him and I will back Silva even though he wouldn't be my first choice. What gives me hope even in the face of a "Martinez mk2" is the mistakes made by Martinez like the defence, lax training, keeping Howard in even though he was throwing goals into the back of his net every game, alienating the senior players while giving the youngest players the rule of the roost and buying a team of bloody crap midgets. Now that can't happen because you have a dof who knows what hes doing as his boss who can reign him back in when he can't see the Forrest for the trees.

"Alienating senior players". That has to be his first task to accomplish when he arrives: bin the clique.

 

[nickDtoffee]

Martinez biggest problem was he didnt work on the defensive side through recruitment or coaching. He concentrated on our attack.

 

[COYBL25]

Martinez biggest problem was he didnt work on the defensive side through recruitment or coaching. He concentrated on our attack.

Martinez biggest problem was himself.