Leighton Baines

[mkrudden]

I reckon we're too hasty to write him off as fading. Fact is that he will never be as effective without Pienaar as that combination was the most in sync I've ever seen in Everton shirts.

He's still got his fitness and pace, he just doesn't have a partner out left per se to play off.

Probably my favourite Everton player of the last 20 years.

Couldn't agree more with this post mate.

We now play maverick wingers in front of him so of course his involvement will diminish.

Top, top player.

 

[davek]

Couldn't agree more with this post mate.

We now play maverick wingers in front of him so of course his involvement will diminish.

Top, top player.

The thing is, these players (the rot we needed out a week or so ago...Mirallas, Jagielka, Baines) have a good game near the ened of the season and all of a sudden it's short term memory syndrome and all is forgiven.

Look at those three and tell me the teams in the shake up for the CL spots would commit to playing them next season.

THAT is the rule of thumb.

If you think they should be anywhere near a start we are doing what we usually do: accept second best.

Sentiment like that over players who show up for one game in four has helped only one body of people over the past decade and a half - the Everton board. They will gladly bowl along not spending out and rejuvenating this squad for as long as they can get away with it.

Sorry, but it's time to say goodbye to that type of player and get better quality in...either that or it's time to say good bye right now to any serious hopes anyone here has of a CL spot challenge.

 

[mkrudden]

The thing is, these players (the rot we needed out a week or so ago...Mirallas, Jagielka, Baines) have a good game near the ened of the season and all of a sudden it's short term memory syndrome and all is forgiven.

Look at those three and tell me the teams in the shake up for the CL spots would commit to playing them next season.

THAT is the rule of thumb.

If you think they should be anywhere near a start we are doing what we usually do: accept second best.

Sentiment like that over players who show up for one game in four has helped only one body of people over the past decade and a half - the Everton board. They will gladly bowl along not spending out and rejuvenating this squad for as long as they can get away with it.

Sorry, but it's time to say goodbye to that type of player and get better quality in...either that or it's time to say good bye right now to any serious hopes anyone here has of a CL spot challenge.

David,

This stuff doesn't work on me. I agree with you on most but not this. You have no proof I wanted Baines or Jags out because I never have. I have bored this forum to it's knees with my requests to not write off messrs Leighton and Phil.

Kev frustrates me and I think you're spot on. He has shown up at the tail end of the season when anything more than 7th is a bonus. I'd sell him personally.

So let's get back to agreeing with each other rather than setting upon me like I'm one of your usual foes!

 

[davek]

David,

This stuff doesn't work on me. I agree with you on most but not this. You have no proof I wanted Baines or Jags out because I never have. I have bored this forum to it's knees with my requests to not write off messrs Leighton and Phil.

Kev frustrates me and I think you're spot on. He has shown up at the tail end of the season when anything more than 7th is a bonus. I'd sell him personally.

So let's get back to agreeing with each other rather than setting upon me like I'm one of your usual foes!

I'm not doing anything of the sort!

I'm saying anyone who sees those three puddings as being part of a successful PL squad are living in 2009...and even then only one was approaching that level.

They are yesterday's men and any club with realistic CL pretensions wont have them anywhere near their starting XI and probably their bench.

I hear a lot of chat here and elsewhere that this club is on the move. How exactly does that notion tally with keeping hold of players like Baines, Jagielka and Mirallas?

If we're serious about this we need to make a decisive statement and get them down the road and quality replacements in. If not then fine, we can rub along with them getting starts and we'll finish where we are: bang average PL position and not really troubling any of the big boys....but hey, we'll get a EL spot and get on the telly midweek and it'll all look like 'progress'.

We have two directions: ambition or sentiment. No doubt we'll end up going down the sentimental road as per.

 

[whiteshadow]

but hey, we'll get a EL spot and get on the telly midweek and it'll all look like 'progress'.

That's because it is progress from where Martinez took us the last 2 seasons.

 

[mkrudden]

I'm not doing anything of the sort!

I'm saying anyone who sees those three puddings as being part of a successful PL squad are living in 2009...and even then only one was approaching that level.

They are yesterday's men and any club with realistic CL pretensions wont have them anywhere near their starting XI and probably their bench.

I hear a lot of chat here and elsewhere that this club is on the move. How exactly does that notion tally with keeping hold of players like Baines, Jagielka and Mirallas?

If we're serious about this we need to make a decisive statement and get them down the road and quality replacements in. If not then fine, we can rub along with them getting starts and we'll finish where we are: bang average PL position and not really troubling any of the big boys....but hey, we'll get a EL spot and get on the telly midweek and it'll all look like 'progress'.

We have two directions: ambition or sentiment. No doubt we'll end up going down the sentimental road as per.

It was only tongue in cheek mate!
And I agree with that ambition is the way forwards. I just think Baines and Jagielka have a role to play. The former as a starter, the latter as a back up.

 

[Zatara]

We're past that stage. If this club has Baines as a starter next season I put it to you that even his supporters will have to think that isn't right and that it would underline that we just aren't serious about moving forward as a team. If we face poor teams or teams like yesterday conserving energy, he's ok. Against top teams he's a liability.

Who would you replace him with whose going to be top 4 quality....

 

[mkrudden]

Who would you replace him with whose going to be top 4 quality....

He would get in at LB at

City
Arsenal
Utd
Liverpool

Only teams Baines would get in are Spurs and Chelsea.

Yet retaining him is a lack of ambition to our David @davek

Not following this one.

 

[davek]

That's because it is progress from where Martinez took us the last 2 seasons.

7th. Brilliant.

Break the champagne out.

 

[Niapper]

I think this a problem of some of the players, they play it to feet too much instead of the space. This is what those playmaker we're missing does, they play strikers in behind. schneiderlin and davies have brought this into the team since january which is a god send.

Unfortunately Gana does not have it in him as well but makes up with his tackling

 

[davek]

Who would you replace him with whose going to be top 4 quality....

I've always thought someone like Schmelzer at Dortmund is an upgrade. I doubt he'd come here away from CL football, like. Bertrand would be a good addition though. Southampton have him on a long contract, but if Everton came in I'm sure he'd be available.

 

[meagher94]

Still a good player. But if we're really serious about going places, we can do better. Somebody like Coleman on that side who can go past a man would make us much more threatening.

 

[Zatara]

I've always thought someone like Schmelzer at Dortmund is an upgrade. I doubt he'd come here away from CL football, like. Bertrand would be a good addition though. Southampton have him on a long contract, but if Everton came in I'm sure he'd be available.

Schmelzer is about 30 now so wouldn't be cheap or easy to sign and just for the short term...id steer clear.
Bertrand is a good left back but not top class.

If it were me, id keep baines for another season and have a superstar kid learn the ropes off him and push him onto the bench after xmas

 

[davek]

Schmelzer is about 30 now so wouldn't be cheap or easy to sign and just for the short term...id steer clear.
Bertrand is a good left back but not top class.

If it were me, id keep baines for another season and have a superstar kid learn the ropes off him and push him onto the bench after xmas

Who;s the super star kid?

 

[Zatara]

Who;s the super star kid?

Ryan Sessegnon from fulham. Him and Galloway pushing Baines out for next season. Galloway for me is just like Holgate and would be fine there while we focus on centre backs + a couple of midfielders and another striker.