Greek Financial Crisis

Status
Not open for further replies.
http://theconversation.com/five-misconceptions-about-the-greek-debt-crisis-44536

"
It is widely accepted that the Greek bailout and austerity package has led to wealth flowing from Greece to its European creditors, benefiting foreign banks at the expense of Greeks, that its debt is unprecedented and unsustainable, that its recession is the unprecedented result of reforms that cannot succeed, and that Greece’s exit from the Eurozone would be calamitous.

Amazingly, none of the statements above are strictly true, leading much of the public discussion of Greece to be unusually detached from the facts.

In this article, I outline my reasons for no longer believing these claims – which I had been led to believe were true when I began to try to understand the Greek debt crisis. This is not meant as a comprehensive guide: I do not presume to make policy recommendations, but do hope that it will help readers better understand some of the issues at stake.

1. The bailouts have extracted resources from Greece
A common belief in discussions of the Greek economy is that the eurozone “has become an extractive project that imposes austerity on poor nations in order to collect debts on behalf of rich ones”. A recent study of capital flows to and from Greece by economists Jeremy Bulow and Kenneth Rogoff debunks this. As the tables below show, capital flows into Greece have not just remained positive, but have increased since the first bailout in 2010. 2014’s flow is slightly negative, partly as the Greek government chose to miss reform targets, preventing release of bailout funds.

image-20150710-17473-1b9qm9m.png

Jeremy Bulow, Kenneth Rogoff
image-20150710-17470-9ndlbq.png

Jeremy Bulow, Kenneth Rogoff
2. Bailouts benefit foreign banks more than Greeks
Another misconception is that: “It is not the people of Greece who have benefited from bailout loans … but the European and Greek banks which recklessly lent money to the Greek State.” This was the charge of the Jubilee Debt Campaign, which campaigns for further debt relief for Greece. They report that €252 billion has been lent to Greece by the “Troika” (the EU, the European Central Bank and the IMF) since 2010, which they claim has been used as follows:

  • €35 billion in “sweeteners" to get the private sector to accept the 2012 debt restructuring
  • €48 billion to bail out Greek banks following the restructuring
  • €149 billion on paying the original debts and interest.
These add up to €232 billion, causing Jubilee to conclude that “less than 10% of the money has reached the people of Greece”.

This conclusion incorrectly assumes that none of the recipients of the €232 billion are “people of Greece”. But if the “sweeteners” were for the Greek private sector, they benefited Greeks; bailing out Greek banks directly helps Greeks who have bank deposits, who hold shares in banks (whether directly or via their pensions), and who work for banks.

The best data that I’ve seen suggests that Greek banks may have held just under half the Greek government debt before the 2012 restructuring – twice as much as any other country. Thus, payments to creditors also reached Greeks. Finally, even payments to foreign creditors benefit Greeks by removing obligations from Greeks to pay.

Perhaps the most amazing estimate to come from Bulow and Rogoff’s study is that Greek citizens have “withdrawn over a hundred billion euros from the banking system” since 2010: where has that money gone?

3. A debt-to-GDP ratio of 180% is unsustainable
Japanese prime minister, Shinzo Abe, has said he will work with the G7 and other Asian countries to ensure economic and financial market stability as the eurozone grapples with Greece’s debt crisis. This news is unremarkable and unsurprising: the third-largest economy in the world is standing by to help. Unreported is that Japan has the world’s highest debt-to-GDP ratio, at about 240% – much higher than Greece’s.

Furthermore, Japan does not seem to have any easy measures for quickly reducing this: unemployment is already low, leaving little slack in the labour market. And, as one of the world’s least corrupt countries, its unofficial sector is small, leaving little hope that actual GDP is much higher than official GDP. Japan faces serious economic challenges (including two decades almost without growth), but no one sees it as other than stable.

By contrast, there are many ways that Greece could quickly reduce its debt-to-GDP ratio: its unofficial economy is estimated at 25% of its official economy; while some officially unemployed Greeks may be working unofficially, many are not – so labour market reforms could spur rapid growth.

There’s an open debate on how to interpret debt-to-GDP ratios and higher numbers are certainly worrying. Yet, Japan suggests there is no magic number: how a country can manage its debt depends on the circumstances and choices of that country.

4. Greece’s transition recession is unusually long
The graph below shows real GDP as a percentage of 1989 GDP in post-Soviet transition economies. Produced by economists Nauro Campos and Abrizio Coricelli, it shows that going through a political and economic transition simultaneously, without a coherent reform strategy, can be disastrous for economic growth. After the collapse of the Soviet Union, post-Soviet countries suffered decreases in official output for years, in spite of international support, including help from the European Bank for Reconstruction and Development. Twelve years after 1989, only six of the 25 countries had official GDP figures above their 1989 levels.

image-20150710-17473-eypod1.png

GDP in post-Soviet states in the decade after the collapse of the Soviet Union. Nauro Campos and Abrizio Coricelli
Greece’s political transitions between democratically elected governments have been less fundamental than the post-Soviet transitions, but its commitment to reform has been questionable throughout. Its poor performance in privatisating inefficient state-owned enterprises has drawn particular attention: the following graph shows privatisation not only well behind schedule, but falling further behind all the time. This deprives the Greek state of revenues, and the Greek people of more efficient services.

image-20150710-17439-1kdelo6.png

IMF
Greece finally seemed to have turned back up in 2014: having fallen by about 20% since its peak in 2008, real GDP grew, officially ending the recession; the government balanced its books before debt payments, and had earned a primary surplus in 2013; unemployment fell; the government was able to borrow on the regular markets, rather than via support packages.

Thus, one of the tragedies of the present situation is that protracted negotiations over the country’s bailout conditions may have just increased the overall cost of the transition process.

5. Greece is too big to fail
The idea that Greece is too big to fail and will have significant knock-on effects for global financial markets has been used in some of the brinkmanship at play in the country’s debt negotiations – including by former finance minister Yanis Varoufakis.

But, while the Greek debt crisis has increased uncertainty and any further default or uncontrolled exit from the euro will pose costs, the markets do not seem terribly roiled by the prospect of its default. This is not surprising: Greece makes up about 2% of Europe’s population and GDP; Europe’s economy is stronger than it was in 2010-2012.

An underappreciated aspect of the “too big to fail” idea is what it does to an economy’s prospects. Indeed, one of the leading explanations of Soviet economic decline is the “soft budget constraint”. Soviet firms tended to be much larger than their Western counterparts, giving each considerable power to renegotiate its production plans – without more resources, it could threaten to harm other sectors in the economy, which had few alternative suppliers to turn to.

This seems to be the concern expressed by many of the other European countries: at the eurozone’s inception, the open question was whether the Bundesbank’s credible, low-inflation, low-interest rate standard would prevail. Or whether the eurozone would end up converging on one of the less credible, high-inflation and high-interest rate standards. If the moving appeals of a country comprising 2% of Europe can successfully soften Europe’s budget constraint, then it can be expected that any larger country will be able to as well, if they can demonstrate a severe enough crisis.

All the major actors seem committed to trying to retain Greece’s membership in the eurozone. Were Greece to become the first country to leave the eurozone, however, it would give us invaluable real experience in a fairly controlled context; this would improve eurozone policy when faced with similar situations in the future.

"
 
Well, economists Stiglitz, Sachs and Piketty all think Greece has been shafted, more or less (all certainly said they'd have voted "No" in the referendum). Admittedly, none of them is an economics lecturer at Birmingham Uni like the author of the above article.
 
Well, economists Stiglitz, Sachs and Piketty all think Greece has been shafted, more or less (all certainly said they'd have voted "No" in the referendum). Admittedly, none of them is an economics lecturer at Birmingham Uni like the author of the above article.

But have they been 'shafted'? And who has been 'shafted'?

The Greek government's proposals.

https://www.scribd.com/doc/271121024/Prior-action-final-version-July-2015-pdf


VAT. Raising it when they said it would be bad for the economy.


But. "The increase of the VAT rate described above may be reviewed at the end of 2016, provided that equivalent additional revenues are collected through measures taken against tax evasion and to improve collectability of VAT. Any decision to review and revise shall take place in consultation with the institutions" ( So if tax evaders don't cough up the money they can withdraw the VAT hike).


Fiscal reform. Variety of measures including tax avoidance and raising corporation tax from 26% to 28%


"We will consider some compensating measures, in case of fiscal shortfalls: (i) Increase the tax rate to income for rents, for annual
incomes below €12,000 to 15% (from 11%) with an additional revenue of €160 million and for annual incomes above €12,000 to 35% (from 33%) with an additional revenue of €40 million; (ii) the corporate income tax will increase by an additional percentage point (i.e. from 28% to 29%) that will result in additional revenues of €130 million". (Taking money off landlords).


Pensions. Implement 2012 measures. Raise pension age to 67 by October 2015 to take effect in January 2016.


"The authorities will adopt legislation to fully offset the fiscal effects of the implementation of court rulings on the 2012 pension reform. In parallel to the reform of the pension system, a Social Welfare Review will be carried out to ensure fairness of the various reforms.The institutions are prepared to take into account other parametric measures within the pension system of equivalent effect to replace some of the measures mentioned above, taking into account their impact on growth, and provided that such measures are presented to the institutions during the design phase and are sufficiently concrete and quantifiable, and in the absence of this the default option is what is specified as above".
 
"Resignation to more austerity extends even to ‘no’ voters, people who only a week ago rejected more cuts and debts. “For the people who don’t have money, the VAT will be an issue,” says Giorgios Voutas, a 56-year-old no-voter who sells rice, nuts and spices in a market in central Thessaloniki. “But what I’m guessing is that the increase will be absorbed by us sellers – and we’ll try to make the money back by finding new wholesalers, or reducing the packaging.

As a no-voter, does he feel betrayed by Alexis Tsipras? The prime minister has agreed to more austerity, despite a mandate for the opposite from the electorate. “No way,” says Voutas, arguing Tsipras tried his best against an intransigent Europe. “The Europeans aren’t capable of surprising us with something good.”

But austerity doesn’t really make any sense, Voutas adds. “Would these European countries like their money back?” he asks. “In order to find the money to pay them we need investment and economic development – but when will we see all this?”

I suppose this Greek didn't know what he was getting into with Syriza.
 
It still baffles me people seem to think that getting their hands on the £50B ish of bailout cash will actually solve anything. It wont. It will just pay a few months pensions and state payroll and stuff, then run out, then the whole charade will start again.

Vault me. (said the same about 10 years ago). It is utterly unworkable, unless Greece either bails out of the Euro, or formally hands over its budget, spending, and economic policies (sic) to Germany and becomes a part of them.
 
It still baffles me people seem to think that getting their hands on the £50B ish of bailout cash will actually solve anything. It wont. It will just pay a few months pensions and state payroll and stuff, then run out, then the whole charade will start again.

Vault me. (said the same about 10 years ago). It is utterly unworkable, unless Greece either bails out of the Euro, or formally hands over its budget, spending, and economic policies (sic) to Germany and becomes a part of them.

Or the Troika agree to write off 60 billion Euros and reschedule the debt until 2057. Less debt means interest being paid and debt pay back 2057 throws it into the very long grass. The EU could buy Greek debt with EU QE money

If you are saying the Eurozone is unworkable then I think you are right and the charade will continue. Even if, as it seems likely the Troika let Greece off the hook. It will be some other country that gets into even more difficulty, Spain, France maybe.
 
If you are saying the Eurozone is unworkable

Thats exactly what I have said from day one. At some point, something like this was going to happen. You cannot have monetary union without a central economic policy. It cannot work for ever. At least not on the scale they tried it with.

Economic delusion.
 
Thats exactly what I have said from day one. At some point, something like this was going to happen. You cannot have monetary union without a central economic policy. It cannot work for ever. At least not on the scale they tried it with.

Economic delusion.

A Cypriot waiter summed it up before they joined, 'You cannot have Cypriot wages with German prices'. Prophetic words as the 2012 Cyprus crisis showed.

Seems to me that it was the Germans that pushed for a Euro. So as to stop them having to deal in all sorts of different currencies when trading their industrial goods. As well as having a strong currency to compete with the US. The Euro was always flawed from the start because of the motives for the Euro.
 
Reading Bruce's report, have to ask if there has been these capital inflows why is the government asking for 50 bill euros to cover the next 3 years and how will that be repaid? Some thing not adding up. Neither is there any mention of the black economy which is about 30% of all income and not declared for tax. In addition latest figures claim that in the last year 89% of tax due was not collected.

I suppose there are kinds of tales to be told about this crisis as well claims.
 
What a mess this is looking now. Grexit back in play and possibly favourite.

Maybe the Syriza gambit since last Sunday has been to acknowledge scale of Greek feeling toward staying in the Eurozone, go back into negotiations with the Euro Group, advance reforms to prove they pushed all the way to stay in the euro, but knew all along there'd be outright opposition to debt write off and a bailout so have Grexit enforced on them?

I cant see this log jam now being down to the EU/ECB looking to extract more reform. That just cant happen. And if they're insisting on outside bodies overseeing the reforms on the table right now it means they're effectively trying to depose the Greek Government to install a technocrat to power, as happened in Italy, which obviously Tsipras et al cant sign up to.

Fascinating what will happen now.
 
What a mess this is looking now. Grexit back in play and possibly favourite.

Maybe the Syriza gambit since last Sunday has been to acknowledge scale of Greek feeling toward staying in the Eurozone, go back into negotiations with the Euro Group, advance reforms to prove they pushed all the way to stay in the euro, but knew all along there'd be outright opposition to debt write off and a bailout so have Grexit enforced on them?

I cant see this log jam now being down to the EU/ECB looking to extract more reform. That just cant happen. And if they're insisting on outside bodies overseeing the reforms on the table right now it means they're effectively trying to depose the Greek Government to install a technocrat to power, as happened in Italy, which obviously Tsipras et al cant sign up to.

Fascinating what will happen now.

The Germans know they have been stitched up. The suppose great 'cave in' by Syriza is nothing of the sort as they have a virtual veto over everything they proposed. They can reverse all the proposals if it is not in the 'economic or social interests' of the Greek people. Syriza has played a blinder, proposing 'reforms' and when the Germans ask for more the response is 'why kick someone in the goolies when they are down and out, you nasty lot'. The Italians are the first to break rank and blame German intransigence. As Varoufakis warned the German game was to punish Greece and force it out of the Euro.

The Germans are clearly trying to depose Syriza with their outside body independently 'vetting' of reforms. Placing technocrats in Athens, like in Rome. The difference is that in Italy no one liked the government anyway. It will be a different kettle of fish in Greece, where a very hostile large section of the population have got the bit between their teeth for a fight.

But a Grexit will only push Greece further on the road to joining BRICS. And allow the Chinese to make more investments in Greek ports, airports, rail and roads. In the proposal document the bidder for privatised airports has already been accepted i.e the Chinese. Any further demands from the Eurozone for more privatisation will increase Chinese involvement in the Greek economy. The possibility of Greece having closer ties to Russia and selling off state assets to China is the reason the US are demanding a debt write off and rescheduling the debt by kicking it into the very long grass i.e 50 year government bonds. Washington will be working frantically tonight and tomorrow morning.

This crisis has all the ingredients for a break up of the Eurozone with a lot of recriminations.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Welcome

Join the Everton conversation today.
Fewer ads, full access, completely free.

🛒 Visit Shop

Support Grand Old Team by checking out our latest Everton gear!
Back
Top