FC Copenhagen suggest changes to Champions League which brings back qualification for finishing 4th

[Bruce Wayne]

But for the first 11 years as a knockout competition only 3 different teams all from different countries won it.

It was a new competition then. In the first year, only 16 teams participated, with no English or Italian team present.

 

[Deleted member 38674]

I think they still would, yes. The money in the top leagues is much greater, the exposure etc. Players move from United and Liverpool to Real and Barcelona because they see it as a step up, thinking that they wouldn't see MyPa to Ajax as a step up and so make the move is a little naïve.

I'm all for taking it back to Champions only, don't get me wrong. The horse has bolted though, there's no going back now. The Swedish league will never be able to compete with the PL and La Liga, as I said, the world has changed.

The stats being used are a bit one sided too. In the first 30 years of the European Cup it was won by teams from 7 countries. In the 27 years of the Champions League it has been won by teams from... 7 countries. 6 of them are the same countries. Before the infamous ban, English teams had won 7 of the previous 9 European Cups, and been beaten finalists in one of the others. There was a Spanish side in 9 of the first 11 finals etc etc. Let's not make out like teams from every country used to win the thing, it's always been dominated by the big leagues, with the occasional interloper.

I didn’t mention anything about winning the competition, just purely “competing”. Teams from those countries don’t even compete anymore and before the format shift they did, given how far they regularly got in the tournament.

I’m also not saying that Litmanen would have stayed at MyPa rather than going to Ajax, I’m just saying under the current format he has little choice if he wants to be successful. Modric may not have left Dinamo Zagreb for Spurs though, that’s a considerably smaller step up.

I still think UEFA could do more to even it out but it would need a commitment to fairness that I don’t believe they are willing to make.

 

[Lanolin]

I didn’t mention anything about winning the competition, just purely “competing”. Teams from those countries don’t even compete anymore and before the format shift they did, given how far they regularly got in the tournament.

I’m also not saying that Litmanen would have stayed at MyPa rather than going to Ajax, I’m just saying under the current format he has little choice if he wants to be successful. Modric may not have left Dinamo Zagreb for Spurs though, that’s a considerably smaller step up.

I still think UEFA could do more to even it out but it would need a commitment to fairness that I don’t believe they are willing to make.

No but you ignored the key part of my original post - globalisation.

50 years we couldn't send a scout over to Romania and hoover up the best teenagers there. Now we can. Those players would always have moved to bigger clubs in bigger leagues if it was possible, but they couldn't. Now they can, so they do. As I said, the world has changed, football's just changed with it. People are looking at it as if we can just close Pandora's box and see everything go back to how it used to be, but we can't.

 

[jaycee]

A team finishing 4th and closer to the relegation places than the Champions getting a place before a league winner is wrong in any way shape or form

 

[Deleted member 38674]

No but you ignored the key part of my original post - globalisation.

50 years we couldn't send a scout over to Romania and hoover up the best teenagers there. Now we can. Those players would always have moved to bigger clubs in bigger leagues if it was possible, but they couldn't. Now they can, so they do. As I said, the world has changed, football's just changed with it. People are looking at it as if we can just close Pandora's box and see everything go back to how it used to be, but we can't.

I'd say thats an exaggeration, personally. Why would the best teenagers from Romania want to leave to come to England and play for a Spurs, for example, if they can compete at the highest level with Steaua Bucharest or CFR Cluj for example?

Right now, it's easy to answer that question, because it's the biggest league in the world and Spurs compete in the CL. But if UEFA suddenly reduced our spots from 4 to 2, for example, and gave one of those two spots to the Champions of Romania, less money would be going into the Premier League and more money would go back into Romania, allowing for better training, better infrastructure, better wages etc - domestic leagues across Europe would improve.

In 5 years time, those new up and coming teenagers may reconsider moving abroad if they feel their ambitions can be met at home.

 

[anton66]

People want to see the best teams play each other not Fc Copenhagen Vs Barcelona in the final, with the winner known before a ball has been kicked.

Fed up with Barcelona,Real,rs,Psg.
I'd like to see in the final, Red Star Belgrade v Lech Poznan.

 

[havrey0123]

Fed up with Barcelona,Real,rs,Psg.
I'd like to see in the final, Red Star Belgrade v Lech Poznan.

And no one would watch it

 

[anton66]

And no one would watch it

Who's talking about football.

 

[Lanolin]

I'd say thats an exaggeration, personally. Why would the best teenagers from Romania want to leave to come to England and play for a Spurs, for example, if they can compete at the highest level with Steaua Bucharest or CFR Cluj for example?

Right now, it's easy to answer that question, because it's the biggest league in the world and Spurs compete in the CL. But if UEFA suddenly reduced our spots from 4 to 2, for example, and gave one of those two spots to the Champions of Romania, less money would be going into the Premier League and more money would go back into Romania, allowing for better training, better infrastructure, better wages etc - domestic leagues across Europe would improve.

In 5 years time, those new up and coming teenagers may reconsider moving abroad if they feel their ambitions can be met at home.

I don't know, why did Graeme Sharp, Andy Gray, Alan Hansen, Graeme Souness etc move from Scotland to England way before the changes you're talking about? Why were there are a number of Swedish players playing for the best Dutch and German teams of the early 70s? Why did Puskas and Di Stefano end up at Real Madrid in the 50s? It's almost as if players have always gravitated towards bigger clubs/leagues and more money, and it's just easier to do now, so you see more of it. I'm sure you're right though, Sky would be bidding billions for the rights to the Romanian league in no time if they knew the winners would get a bye into the group stages of the Champions League.

 

[Yarrgh]

Fed up with Barcelona,Real,rs,Psg.
I'd like to see in the final, Red Star Belgrade v Lech Poznan.

Come on Lech beat the rs.

 

[AmericasToffee]

How's about we make it for the champions of their respective leagues?

 

[AmericasToffee]

And no one would watch it

Speak for yourself. I'd watch

 

[ClausThomsen]

That was my point, but I don’t think it’s fair that a europe-wide “competition” appears to be utterly confined to teams from 5 nations. That doesn’t feel right to me, does it to you?

If UEFA made a commitment to take places off those 5 leagues and reintroduce group stage places for Champions of other nations, it would reduce the quality of the competition for a few years and arguably make it more of a monopoly for the best teams for a short period, but eventually it would improve.

For example, would Modric have left Dinamo Zagreb for Spurs if DZ were in the CL at the time? Would Zlatan have left Malmo, Lukaku have left Anderlecht, Alaba have left Austria Vienna, Shaqiri have left Basel, Lewandowski left Poznan, Nedved have left Sparta Prague, Berbatov have left CSKA Sofia, Arshavin have left Zenit, Litmanen have left MyPa or Shevchenko left Dynamo Kiev?

Perhaps they all still would, but if they didn’t need to to play at the highest level, if they didn’t need to join teams regularly finishing 4th in their own respective domestic leagues to play at the highest level, it would be very interesting.

It would obviously make our task of reaching that platform all the more difficult, so on that level I have mixed feelings but it’s got to be the fairest way. I don’t see why the likes of Spurs, Chelsea, Atalanta, Napoli, Bayer Leverkusen and Valencia were in this years competition.

A lot of players will go where the money is. Cenk Tosun, though obviously not in the category of player mentioned above, went from playing CL football to playing under Sam Allardyce at Everton.

Just playing in the CL may not feel like playing at the highest level if you're at a club that's finishing 4th in the group and getting battered every game. And if you take the bigger clubs out of the competition then it soon stops being the highest level of club football - several domestic clubs would have an overall higher standard of competition.

It's not fair but then the CL has never been about that. It's about money, glamour and getting as many of the worlds best and high profile players onto the same pitch as is reasonably possible in order to sell a product.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

A lot of players will go where the money is. Cenk Tosun, though obviously not in the category of player mentioned above, went from playing CL football to playing under Sam Allardyce at Everton.

Just playing in the CL may not feel like playing at the highest level if you're at a club that's finishing 4th in the group and getting battered every game. And if you take the bigger clubs out of the competition then it soon stops being the highest level of club football - several domestic clubs would have an overall higher standard of competition.

It's not fair but then the CL has never been about that. It's about money, glamour and getting as many of the worlds best and high profile players onto the same pitch as is reasonably possible in order to sell a product.

I suppose this does kinda get born out in the (somewhat tiresome) debate about Messi and Maradona, as in Diego's day, the European competitions weren't anywhere near as strong, and you could often reach the latter stages after playing a pub team or two en route, hence why the World Cup was seen as the pinnacle. Now, you're more likely to get the pub team in the World Cup than you are the Champions League.

 

[Lanolin]

A lot of players will go where the money is. Cenk Tosun, though obviously not in the category of player mentioned above, went from playing CL football to playing under Sam Allardyce at Everton.

Just playing in the CL may not feel like playing at the highest level if you're at a club that's finishing 4th in the group and getting battered every game. And if you take the bigger clubs out of the competition then it soon stops being the highest level of club football - several domestic clubs would have an overall higher standard of competition.

It's not fair but then the CL has never been about that. It's about money, glamour and getting as many of the worlds best and high profile players onto the same pitch as is reasonably possible in order to sell a product.

Pretty much nails it.