Being more direct is the way to go?

[marty mcfly]

Yes, we've been through the reason why people are wanting to be more direct (because they see players making costly mistakes caught in possession). The point though is that the figures don't stack up that we can get results by deserting a more patient build up game.

In other words, the solution is to get players back to form and not throw the system out.

But we need to be more flexible with the system to first get the players back to form.

 

[davek]

But we need to be more flexible with the system to first get the players back to form.

Flexible in the sense that if we have our confidence back and key players back who can move the ball around we should use it to our benefit against teams who compress space in front of us and who also press; but if other teams (as West Ham and City have done of late) fancy trying to take the game to us we counter them with pace and more penetrating forward passes.

 

[marty mcfly]

Flexible in the sense that if we have our confidence back and key players back who can move the ball around we should use it to our benefit against teams who compress space in front of us and also press, but if other teams (as West Ham and City have done of late) fancy trying to take the game to us we counter them with pace and more penetrating forward passes.

I totally agree Davek.

However playing like that requires both confidence and ability. Jags doesn't have either at the moment and Lukaku was and others still are suffering from a lack of confidence.

So continuing playing like that was only going to make things worse. Personally I think Stones has to play for us to even begin to attempt to play that way plus we really need more quality than McGeady, Jags and Naismith. With them in the team it just breaks down. But if we play more direct then their work rate can makeup for what they lack in other areas.

The problem with Martinez is that he doesn't recognize that when the players aren't capable or in form he needs to change it but hopefully he's seen the light.

 

[davek]

I totally agree Davek.

However playing like that requires both confidence and ability. Jags doesn't have either at the moment and Lukaku was and others still are suffering from a lack of confidence.

So continuing playing like that was only going to make things worse. Personally I think Stones has to play for us to even begin to attempt to play that way plus we really need more quality than McGeady, Jags and Naismith. With them in the team it just breaks down. But if we play more direct then their work rate can makeup for what they lack in other areas.

The opposition will determine how we set up. I cant imagine us wanting to go front to back too quickly in the next two league games. WBA and Palace would welcome that.

We have to do what we haven't been doing against these types of clubs: be on our toes, shift the ball around quicker but with less haste, and compete for second balls with the ferocity they do. You have to earn the right to play your football - something our lot haven't been prepared to do since the end of November. We are a superior football outfit with superior quality players. We have to make that pay against teams like those two. Dont match their style, just match their workrate.

 

[strummer]

Im not big on stats bit there has definitely been a change in tactics in the last 2 games which has brought the best out of lukaku. You can see his appetite for the game has come right back and we look a much better side because of it

 

[anton66]

A ball played forward in defense is positive and a backward defensive pass is negative? The stats do not highlight this so seem a bit irrelevant.

 

[Shagster]

Man city showed yesterday how to keep the ball using a similar formation to what we have been using mostly this season. Difference being they have the players in their attack/midfield to maintain possession in the opposition half just between the 4 of them, which allows the rest of the team to squeeze up. We don't have those players to maintain that possession so we cannot get the team up the pitch as quickly as we should be doing.

But we do have the players to suit the more direct approach - Kev/Rom/Seamus/Naisy all like the opposition goal in front of them rather than over their shoulders.

As many have said on here, it's about mixing it up.

FFS Martinez spent 3 weeks in Brazil watching top teams flip systems mid game to suit the situation!!

 

[Toffeelover]

The point made here is that the manager likes to play a more measured build up because he believes it gets the right opening to consistently get winning results. Well this season that is born out again

Here are some stats which are quite easy to understand in reference to the above quote.

PLD 21 W 5 D 7 L 9 GD -4 PTS 22

 

[marty mcfly]

The opposition will determine how we set up. I cant imagine us wanting to go front to back too quickly in the next two league games. WBA and Palace would welcome that.

We have to do what we haven't been doing against these types of clubs: be on our toes, shift the ball around quicker but with less haste, and compete for second balls with the ferocity they do. You have to earn the right to play your football - something our lot haven't been prepared to do since the end of November. We are a superior football outfit with superior quality players. We have to make that pay against teams like those two. Dont match their style, just match their workrate.

Well I hope we don't go back to pass, pass, pass. I still don't think we have the players and I disagree playing like that would play into their hands allowing them to press us, force the turnover high up and hit us on the counter. We need to work hard, press high and play more percentage football until teams stop pressing us. Only then will Jags have the space to be able to build it up slowly.

We simply aren't good enough to play our style nomatter what.

 

[marty mcfly]

Man city showed yesterday how to keep the ball using a similar formation to what we have been using mostly this season. Difference being they have the players in their attack/midfield to maintain possession in the opposition half just between the 4 of them, which allows the rest of the team to squeeze up. We don't have those players to maintain that possession so we cannot get the team up the pitch as quickly as we should be doing.

But we do have the players to suit the more direct approach - Kev/Rom/Seamus/Naisy all like the opposition goal in front of them rather than over their shoulders.

As many have said on here, it's about mixing it up.

FFS Martinez spent 3 weeks in Brazil watching top teams flip systems mid game to suit the situation!!

Exactly Nasri, Silva and Navas are on a different level to what we have there

 

[Simo]

The key yesterday was when city had the ball at the back, we played high and put them under pressure, particularly Naisy, ROM did too but needs to be on his toes more...any time that's got a couple of opposition down their throat will either pass back to keeper or look for an outlet. As has already been said we need players with confidence, where we draw them high by playing it around our defence and then using Barkley and Besic as an outlet to run through the mid and get them on the counter. For me Barkley is losing the ball too much at the minute but he is the key to us playing directly and laying off to ROM or Naisy.

 

[Titus Bramble]

What we need is the right balance of retaining possession and getting the ball forward quickly, whether it's a hoof or 1 or 2 quick passes along the deck.

I also don't want our defence/keeper to feel the have to pass it short. If in doubt, belt it.

 

[blueboy1945]

In ours.

Perhaps the opposition get as bored as we do and drop their guard.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I suspect the key is not to be one thing or the other, but rather to mix it up so that we're not quite so predictable to defend against.

 

[bicycleheader]

Once again, people wanted changes because what we were doing was no longer working. The fact it worked previously doesn't come into it because the reason for it no longer working was a change from the opposition. Thus meaning we needed to change to stay one step ahead.

Or the reason was the players were playing crap.

Too many people think they have the definite answer....