A proper Kirkby thread..

Neiler · July 5, 2008

davek said:
It'll be nice if the club can buy it back eventually, eh?

Yup thats the agreement, and a clever bit of buissness it was too, and yet the world hasnt come crashing down! Visa Vis financeing against future earnings so dont panic mate!

I imagine those for the new stadium will feel let down after this transfer window where we will spend well, it saddens me to say that!

GrandOldTeam · July 5, 2008

davek said:
Short term debt? Is that how you see it? £78M as it stands and rising with every passing day. We got a debt (sorry 'securitisation') of £60M via Bear Stearns when Kenwright took over - we're still servicing it and will continue to do so for the forseeable. But of course, the revenue from the new stadium will all sort that out wont it? All those people down on the seaon ticket waiting lists who'll boost our average attendance to 50,000...oh no, wait.....

You asked for statements that could be falsified - you got them, now you're shifting the goalposts.

No comeback on the SDG and Tesco admissions on transport and quality of design?

Short term in relation to remaining at Goodison.

davek · July 5, 2008

Neiler said:
Yup thats the agreement, and a clever bit of buissness it was too, and yet the world hasnt come crashing down! Visa Vis financeing against future earnings so dont panic mate!

I imagine some will feel let down after this transfer window, it saddens me to say that!

I for one wont feel let down. It's simple mathematics that even the brain dead can fathom - you're looking to pay your end of a new stadium and have to find the money = no 'frills' like big money signings for this and the next couple of seasons.

It isn't exactly rocket science.

Still, it wont stop people posting about a possible signing of Senna or Aurelio.

Neiler · July 5, 2008

davek said:
I for one wont feel let down. It's simple mathematics that even the brain dead can fathom - you're looking to pay your end of a new stadium and have to find the money = no 'frills' like big money signings for this and the next couple of seasons.

It isn't exactly rocket science.

Still, it wont stop people posting about a possible signing of Senna or Aurelio.

Well all the signs are that your wrong, so i would recomend you brush up on the old rocket sceince text books!

Either way it sounds as if your on to a winner, we dont sign anyone and you get to tell us we are all "brain dead" and try on the cool cats pyjamies for a bit.

And if we do sign some quality players well as a club making progress you would think you would be happy?

Chicken lickle the sky is falling down!

davek · July 5, 2008

Neiler said:
Well all the signs are that your wrong, so i would recomend you brush up on the old rocket sceince text books!

Either way it sounds as if your on to a winner, we dont sign anyone and you get to tell us we are all "brain dead" and try on the cool cats pyjamies for a bit.

And if we do sign some quality players well as a club making progress you would think you would be happy!

Chicken lickle the sky is falling down!

I would be happy if we made big signings.

But what are all these 'signs' I'm missing about signing players?

Reidy's Bottle Of Grecian · July 5, 2008

i think its widely accepted that the emirates is a world class venue that has been squeezed into a small space, how would the footprint of that fit into the various venues suggested i.e. over the footprint of goodison, in the loop etc etc , someone with the nouse to do this on google earth or somewhere please oblige, ive tried but am no tech nerd.

Neiler · July 5, 2008

Good man, can you point to any sign that we wont, im talking fact here not your usual wishy washey, makey upy stuff! Quataiton marks are ofter good i find!

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Moyes transfer budget, whatever it is, will not be affected by the fate of the propsed new stadium in Kirkby. It had been reported that if the Kirkby project was 'called in' then this would have an influence on the manager's transfer chest. [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Ian Ross, Everton’s Head of Public Relations & External Affairs, says: “This is completely untrue. These are absolutely separate issues. They always have been and they always will be. The Government’s decision (on the Kirkby project) won’t have any impact on the manager’s transfer budget.” [/FONT]

Everton CEO, Keith Wyness says: "The whole transfer market, each one is different in terms of the mood and tempo. Hardly anything has happened. There’s not much activity – there’s more managers moving than there are players right now. It’s a slow market. We know the manager and his targets but a lot of things have to happen to get deals for the types of players we are looking for. [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Every day we are on the phone.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The fans have seen over the last four years that we have delivered and there is an acceptance that we understand what we’ve got – but we have to improve on it and keep on going. But it is too early for getting anxious. It’s huge to be in Europe – we’ve been there three years out of four that I’ve been here which is isn’t bad. [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]It’s important to be in that draw and get more mentions all round the world.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]You have to be a winning team and we have been to a degree and that is very important."[/FONT]

Keith Wyness says: Bill Kenwright is chatting with David every day and we are well aware that we have got to build on the success we have had. As we have done in the last few years, we will support David to make the squad the best it can be. In the transfer window I am speaking to agents all the time. Nine out of ten don't come to anything, but you have to be speaking and know what is in the market place."

But then i know you beleive everyone in the club higher-archy is a liar so:

Moyes says “We do need to increase in numbers. Quality will always be first priority, but quantity is also required. I want us to be strong and I want us to progress and I think that we would need to have an even stronger squad from the start of this season.

Moyes says "I would say that maybe we don’t need more players, just more players with quality. But I am happy with the numbers here, just that one or two have not worked or offered enough to the squad, that has effected things. We have always been looking to add to the numbers, but mainly to the quality."

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Moyesy says: "When we took over at Everton it was to avoid being in the bottom six; now our buying is to be in the top six so our buying had changed a little bit. The players that we brought in to keep us out of the bottom six have gone on to prove that they can all be part of the top six. So we mustn’t look at that market and I am very keen to keep bringing in British boys. That’s why we put a lot of effort into scouting in the UK to see if we can find the right players.[/FONT]

Well call me an optimist, but all makes for happy play days to me, off to rocket sceince 101 for you!

BlackToffee · July 5, 2008

Reidy's Bottle Of Grecian said:
i think its widely accepted that the emirates is a world class venue that has been squeezed into a small space, how would the footprint of that fit into the various venues suggested i.e. over the footprint of goodison, in the loop etc etc , someone with the nouse to do this on google earth or somewhere please oblige, ive tried but am no tech nerd.

First it depends on how you define "World Class". The "mid type" stadium was actually comments from residents opposed to the stadium and some councilllors who voted 20 - 1 for the deal. Can someone explain what makes a stadium world class? Are we talking aethetics? Are we talking cost? Are talking material? are we talking fixtures in fitting inside? Or are we talking about a stadium which will enable international matches to be played in, which GP can just about do.

The mid level stadia issue is a smokescreen. On this basis, GP is a low standard rubbish stadia, but its not a description me, or anyone will sensibly give to it, even if true. In true, Kirkby stadia's is miles better than GP as it currently stand.

As for a stadia fitting into the loop, go to the kipper forum on Kirkby and you'll see almost every stadia in scale put in the loop including New Wembley. Guess what? None of them fit, or the fit is to tight as to probably break planning regulations.

For example, most seem to jut over the main road. And without a trace of irony, the no camp are lathering about how it will work at the loop. It won't simple as.

davek · July 5, 2008

Neiler said:
Good man, can you point to any sign that we wont, im talking fact here not your usual wishy washey, makey upy stuff! Quataiton marks are ofter good i find!

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Moyes transfer budget, whatever it is, will not be affected by the fate of the propsed new stadium in Kirkby. It had been reported that if the Kirkby project was 'called in' then this would have an influence on the manager's transfer chest. [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Ian Ross, Everton’s Head of Public Relations & External Affairs, says: “This is completely untrue. These are absolutely separate issues. They always have been and they always will be. The Government’s decision (on the Kirkby project) won’t have any impact on the manager’s transfer budget.” [/FONT]

Everton CEO, Keith Wyness says: "The whole transfer market, each one is different in terms of the mood and tempo. Hardly anything has happened. There’s not much activity – there’s more managers moving than there are players right now. It’s a slow market. We know the manager and his targets but a lot of things have to happen to get deals for the types of players we are looking for. [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Every day we are on the phone.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The fans have seen over the last four years that we have delivered and there is an acceptance that we understand what we’ve got – but we have to improve on it and keep on going. But it is too early for getting anxious. It’s huge to be in Europe – we’ve been there three years out of four that I’ve been here which is isn’t bad. [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]It’s important to be in that draw and get more mentions all round the world.[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]You have to be a winning team and we have been to a degree and that is very important."[/FONT]

Keith Wyness says: Bill Kenwright is chatting with David every day and we are well aware that we have got to build on the success we have had. As we have done in the last few years, we will support David to make the squad the best it can be. In the transfer window I am speaking to agents all the time. Nine out of ten don't come to anything, but you have to be speaking and know what is in the market place."

But then i know you beleive everyone in the club higher-archy is a liar so:

Moyes says “We do need to increase in numbers. Quality will always be first priority, but quantity is also required. I want us to be strong and I want us to progress and I think that we would need to have an even stronger squad from the start of this season.

Moyes says "I would say that maybe we don’t need more players, just more players with quality. But I am happy with the numbers here, just that one or two have not worked or offered enough to the squad, that has effected things. We have always been looking to add to the numbers, but mainly to the quality."

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Moyesy says: "When we took over at Everton it was to avoid being in the bottom six; now our buying is to be in the top six so our buying had changed a little bit. The players that we brought in to keep us out of the bottom six have gone on to prove that they can all be part of the top six. So we mustn’t look at that market and I am very keen to keep bringing in British boys. That’s why we put a lot of effort into scouting in the UK to see if we can find the right players.[/FONT]

Well call me an optimist, but all makes for happy play days to me, off to rocket sceince 101 for you!

Well researched, and I suppose they come under the description 'signs'. But I have to say that we've been seriously linked only with Ramsey and we are now heading toward the second week in July with a seriously depleted squad...so much so we're cancelling friendly matches! Those fine words have to be put into practice. My guess is that signings wont be a priority if Kirkby gets the go ahead.

davek · July 5, 2008

BlackToffee said:
First it depends on how you define "World Class". The "mid type" stadium was actually comments from residents opposed to the stadium and some councilllors who voted 20 - 1 for the deal. Can someone explain what makes a stadium world class? Are we talking aethetics? Are we talking cost? Are talking material? are we talking fixtures in fitting inside? Or are we talking about a stadium which will enable international matches to be played in, which GP can just about do.

The mid level stadia issue is a smokescreen. On this basis, GP is a low standard rubbish stadia, but its not a description me, or anyone will sensibly give to it, even if true. In true, Kirkby stadia's is miles better than GP as it currently stand.

As for a stadia fitting into the loop, go to the kipper forum on Kirkby and you'll see almost every stadia in scale put in the loop including New Wembley. Guess what? None of them fit, or the fit is to tight as to probably break planning regulations.

For example, most seem to jut over the main road. And without a trace of irony, the no camp are lathering about how it will work at the loop. It won't simple as.

Here's a question for you - do you believe Everton FC would be getting a fitting home by moving into the proposed stadium?

I dont. See the Emirates or the Millenium or the planned LFC stadium? - that's what we should be aspiring to. Cost? Yes, it'll cost. The fact we can't get it under the present oownership structure, though, doesn't mean we should abandon our standards and take any old crap that's put in front of us.

Reidy's Bottle Of Grecian · July 5, 2008

thats what i mean about emirates when i say "world class" i'm not arsed about athletics, 20/20 cricket etc etc, i want to us to have a top notch football stadium, if lcc wanted us to make it bigger to accomodate other sports and were going to fund the extra cost then fair enough but i dont want to be behind a running track, i want to be on the touchline, tuching the silverware as its paraded around, after all we dont want the toffeelady to need a slingshot with the mints.

like this for instance the sapporro dome
http://www.worldstadiums.com/stadium_menu/architecture/stadium_design/sapporo_dome.shtml
admittedly it has space around the pitch but you get the jist of what im saying, check out the stadiums on that site and you'll see that the kirkby design is pretty shoite in comparison.

Neiler · July 5, 2008

davek said:
Well researched, and I suppose they come under the description 'signs'. But I have to say that we've been seriously linked only with Ramsey and we are now heading toward the second week in July with a seriously depleted squad...so much so we're cancelling friendly matches! Those fine words have to be put into practice. My guess is that signings wont be a priority if Kirkby gets the go ahead.

I prefer the term quoates, in description: factual things people say :lol:

! Its the fifth of july, i wouldnt be entering a suicide pact just yet, we are playing another frienedly the same day as the other one has been cancelled, but you some up it up with the words "my guess" says it all really! Be good mate (y)

chicoazul · July 5, 2008

Both sides will move the goalposts as all of you internet debating melts do to make you look ace. Go you, and all that.

Who really [Poor language removed] cares anymore, its the gayest debate ever.

Just get it over and done with, Kirkby or no Kirkby so all the moral high ground grabbing beauts will go back under their rocks.

Duncan9 · July 5, 2008

Very good post Bainsey. Unfortunately having posted all of the lies, or some of them anyway, the people that are pro Kirkby then decide that as it is fairly stacked against them they will move the goalposts. Not by much but just enough to deflect the bleeding obvious !
Jesus wept ! When are some folks going to realise that Kirkby is not the place to go. I confess to having no immediate alternative but what will it take to make people understand this fiasco.

P.S. Please do not forget the "Exclusivity Agreement" that stopped anybody/everybody, other than Tesco, have any further input.

It beggars belief !

MaccaBill · July 5, 2008

Apparently :unsure:

there's a website called Toffeeweb!!! It's about Everton and it has all sorts of Everton related information on it.

Try page 2 of the linked document; it's a decent enough resume of 'then' versus 'now' although there appears to be a word missing before 'service' in reference to Headbolt Lane - the missing words is 'enhance', possibly.

I'll not call the list in the linked document an exposure of 'lies' as there appears to be some sort of semantic debate going on as to what constitutes a lie and what constitutes opinion. Well, if that other well-known liar, A Blair, can claim his Iraq decisons were 'in good faith', then anything's possible.

This is only Everton, it;'s not like it's life or death. (y)