Champions League revamp

[hktoffee]

I guess this stupid SL will have novelty value for a season or two. But what happens if the football is as boring as crap and your team is quickly out of contention? Meanwhile there is exciting football and real competition in the old EPL. I can see the SL turning into a football version of pro wrestling - scripted, fake, bizarro football.

Depends on the sponsors who provide the cash. If they’d pull out.

 

[Dom1878]

If the SL goes ahead it's impossible for the PL to continue with them as part of it.

We have to remember, those clubs will be replaced. Yes there'd be a hit on revenue (across europe), but it wouldn't be long until the PL is as powerful as ever. Then you'd have 12 clubs in this super league who play one superbowl and spend the rest of the time touring the world. They'll be taking no revenue from the Premier League at all.

 

[ForeverBlue92]

I guess this stupid SL will have novelty value for a season or two. But what happens if the football is as boring as crap and your team is quickly out of contention? Meanwhile there is exciting football and real competition in the old EPL. I can see the SL turning into a football version of pro wrestling - scripted, fake, bizarro football.

Is it a novelty mate and thats why the PL need some balls today as if they play their cards right, get the TV companies on there side, be innovative the PL could rival the super league maybe not right away but in 5-10 years absolutely.

Everton, Aston Villa, Leeds, Newcastle, West Ham, Leicester, Wolves just off the top of my head who could spear head a new league and take over from the current "big 6".

Even scrap the League Cup and make an Anglo Cup with the Scottish teams etc be innovative and creative whilst maintaining that authenticity of the English League and we would win long term 100%.

It all comes down to having the guts to take a short term hit on the finances for longer term gain.

 

[Martin Alvito]

Disagree mate.

The money will always follow the audiences. As will the players.

if you want integrity, you get involved lower down the pyramid.

That would argue in favor of the 14 and UEFA on different grounds.

Take the CART/Indy split. CART took the drivers and most of the sponsors and money. Indy had the crown jewel, the 500, and kicked the drivers that didn't join their circuit out of the 500. They ended up with some fairly ridiculous winners of the 500 for a couple of years (Buddy Lazier?), but in the end, Indy won because they had the 500 and the drivers came back.

I'm not making an argument about integrity. I'm making an argument about image, which is what matters to the sponsors - and as a consequence, to the players who take the sponsors' money.

If you have enough money, you can even tell the sponsors where to go. The Masters did it. The 14 now have the ability to give the six the boot, pass whatever rules they want to enable themselves to get the money to fight, and go to war. The only question is whether or not they collectively have the will.

There's ample reason to believe that they can win the fight, should they choose to join it. Which is exactly the problem, and why I believe that a parting of the ways is a real possibility - the outcome is uncertain. If we knew how the chips would fall, the 14 would muck their cards if they're going to lose, and the six would muck their cards if they're going to lose.

Your argument boils down to the notion that the 14 are so risk-averse that they'll capitulate. That's what Woodward et al are betting on. I'm not convinced. I think that by alienating FIFA, UEFA and the fans, the ESL changed the game to their own detriment. Whether or not that's enough for the fight to be joined is, to me, an open question rather than a foregone conclusion.

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

Relegate the ringleaders of this.

Man Utd, Liverpool and Arsenal need to go.

The others have just gone along with it for fear of missing out. They should be each given a 20 point deduction next season.

I think all the chairmen and CEO's of these clubs should be banned from football for life. They are the people who have driven this not the fans or players.

 

[Gilbert..]

I see that arsenal chump who thinks he's a tough guy posting about Everton.
Doing exactly what his yankee owner wants. Idiot.

 

[catcherintherye]

United and Liverpool have masterminded it. Barca and Real have to join as they can’t afford not to such is their economic position. That’s why I genuinely think it’s happening now because I don’t think those two clubs can even wait another season. The Italian clubs just want money that Serie A will never be able to give them.

Chelsea and City don’t need money though. They feel to me like the most likely two to break from it.

I'm with you, I think this will be very hard to row back from now. As Neville said last night, Glaziers don't row back from much and even FSG have gone further than they might have done and will know to row back now will probably mean to have to give the club up.

In situations like this as well, certain clubs will have to have given certain guarantees to related parties. It's quite likely contracts will have been signed. The 12 teams are not in it equally and it's obvious certain clubs have probably got entangled far more, to a point where they might be liable if it doesn't happen. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if someone has put up £3.5bn there will be an equivalent cost to be shared from the initial guarantors if it doesn't happen. Again we can move figures, but that would not surprise me at all. If you are a partner business with this, you want "skin in the game".

The things I've read from Barcelona is they were more none commital than Madrid. Perez spoke yesterday about convincing them. Laporta has been ambivalent on it. I don't think they are in as deep as say RM, Juventus, Liverpool & United (with possibly Arsenal) tagging along just behind. If it starts to look a bit shaky, don't be surprised to see certain teams waver a bit. Barca will probably go, but I am not sure they are quite as financially tied in.

As for Chelsea & City, this whole set up is designed to stop them dominating. So they'd be daft to sign up. Their USP is they can spend more than rivals. They will get that chance in the PL but not there. Nobody is watching Chelsea is they are perenially a bottom half team.

 

[little elfin]

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

This could be important

I can see the players being important here. What if they refuse to play in SL? They could hold a lot of very important cards here.

 

[daza_1973]

Excellent from BHA:

Brighton issue a statement on the ESL​

Ahead of today’s Premier League meeting involving the 14 clubs who haven’t signed up to be part of a European Super League, Brighton & Hove Albion has issued the following statement on behalf of Tony Bloom (chairman), Paul Barber (chief executive and deputy chairman), Dan Ashworth (technical director), and Graham Potter (head coach):

Brighton & Hove Albion are totally opposed to plans for a breakaway European Super League as it would destroy the dreams of clubs at every level of the domestic game.

These plans are the latest in an alarming and growing list of clandestine attempts from a small group of clubs whose actions would be wiping out close to 150 years of football’s tradition, competition, and sporting progress through merit.

The ups and downs of football – promotion, relegation, winning titles and cups, challenging for, or missing out on, a European place – are all part and parcel of the drama, jeopardy, joy and heartbreak that makes our game the most watched and most loved in the world.

These key attributes create significant value from which we feed a financial support structure which helps to sustain football at every level in our country and well beyond. By contrast, a European Super League would concentrate value for the benefit of a small number of clubs.

The efforts to create a closed-shop for all but the largest clubs demonstrate a clear lack of respect for the contributions of all clubs within the domestic leagues in this country and across Europe.

Plans for a European Super League also totally disregard fans, the lifeblood of our sport at professional levels, and fly in the face of the views and wishes of the overwhelming majority of football supporters of all clubs.

These clubs, like Brighton & Hove Albion, invest heavily to support their own dreams, and those of their fans, to play at the highest level they can, and to help create a sense of pride in their own clubs across the country.

Off the pitch, we remain custodians of our clubs on behalf of past, present and future generations of fans and the communities we all represent. This is a responsibility we believe we must all take very seriously.

It has been hugely encouraging to see universal opposition and widespread condemnation from across the game from various football authorities, fans, players, commentators, pundits and media, and all-party opposition in government.

We will continue to work with those groups, including the UK government and MPs of all political parties, football’s governing bodies and all of our colleagues across football to oppose and defeat these plans.

We are fully committed to a thriving domestic league and pyramid with the ultimate reward of European competition for achievements and success on the field. We remain open to a transparent, calm and rationale dialogue with all clubs to achieve this.

2 down 12 to go.

 

[tsubaki]

That would argue in favor of the 14 and UEFA on different grounds.

Take the CART/Indy split. CART took the drivers and most of the sponsors and money. Indy had the crown jewel, the 500, and kicked the drivers that didn't join their circuit out of the 500. They ended up with some fairly ridiculous winners of the 500 for a couple of years (Buddy Lazier?), but in the end, Indy won because they had the 500 and the drivers came back.

I'm not making an argument about integrity. I'm making an argument about image, which is what matters to the sponsors - and as a consequence, to the players who take the sponsors' money.

If you have enough money, you can even tell the sponsors where to go. The Masters did it. The 14 now have the ability to give the six the boot, pass whatever rules they want to enable themselves to get the money to fight, and go to war. The only question is whether or not they collectively have the will.

There's ample reason to believe that they can win the fight, should they choose to join it. Which is exactly the problem, and why I believe that a parting of the ways is a real possibility - the outcome is uncertain. If we knew how the chips would fall, the 14 would muck their cards if they're going to lose, and the six would muck their cards if they're going to lose.

Your argument boils down to the notion that the 14 are so risk-averse that they'll capitulate. That's what Woodward et al are betting on. I'm not convinced. I think that by alienating FIFA, UEFA and the fans, the ESL changed the game to their own detriment. Whether or not that's enough for the fight to be joined is, to me, an open question rather than a foregone conclusion.

fantastic post this, have some notional rep from me

 

[Papa Shango]

No but if one of them goes under football is over

Don't be stupid.

If one of them was to go under they would just reform and build it up again. It's happened before.

 

[jamieni]

The more I read about this the more I think the top 6 wouldn't be bothered if they were kicked out the PL anyway and if anything would prefer to focus solely on the Super League.

As others have said this would essentially in time become the Premier League with the Premier League the equivalent of the Championship.

The PL has to act NOW - suspend them from the upcoming 2021/22 season with immediate effect and advise if they dont withdraw within 14 days thats them done.

UEFA hopefully also kick them out of the CL/EL this week also.

The Super League is all important. The PL becomes a side show if they stay in it. Either way the PL is going to be devalued.

 

[Wat Tyler]

I know we don't like them, but at this time I'm separating the fans and players from the scheming and greedy owners, I think it's pretty damn clear the majority don't approve of this, and if at this time they wish to stand with all of us that disagree with this proposal they are welcome to.

Yes but there is an increasing amount of “you’re just jealous you aren’t in, and you broke away to form the PL.”

Thick horrible rats

 

[Tin-Tin]

Rumours on Spurs forum from ITK is that Chelsea ready to pull out, statements and announcement to go out later. Lets see if true