2020/21 Andre Gomes

[MACCA75]

Honestly people need to stop going on about the injury. He’s been back playing for a year.

He has quality but he’s just too slow. Can cope with him as a squad player but don’t want to see him starting many games next year.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Gomes was OK against WBA. Just wish he could shoot from outside the box. Mind you none of our players can, except maybe Siggy.

I believe in training he's one of the most cultured and assured in front of goal. We need to find a way to get him into forward positions more often. He has the quality to hurt teams as he's shown with a couple of very good assists in January.

 

[Efcjake]

I'd move him on if we can. He just doesn't offer much at all.

He was quite good in parts of his first season and nearly all our play went through him in Silva's first season.

He doesn't have that same composure on the ball that impressed us all in the beginning when he could shrug off or turn his way out of a challenge. He plays the easy ball a lot more often now, you rarely see him pinging the balls to the wing he was so good at before. That may be because we don't have any wingers on the pitch most weeks but even when we do I haven't seen him switch the play as often as he used to.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

Agree Delph needs to go, if we manage to shift him that is. We may be stuck until the end of his contract next summer. Realistically we have a similar problem with Gbamin. I'm still hopeful he may come good for us, and maybe even be the defensive midfielder we crave if it allows us to play with attacking full backs. But equally he may not, in which case he'll be very difficult to offload.

You and I disagree on Gomes. You think he's crap. I don't. I think he has a lot of very good qualities, had a very bad injury not too long ago, and needs to find more consistency. We've argued over him before, as we have Tom Davies, and I'd rather trust my judgment than yours tbh. Also, I just don't see anybody paying decent money for him, not when he's on such a high wage. Unless his form improves vastly in which case I would argue why would we sell him anyway. His form overall is much improved since the turn of the year and I feel there's more to come from him. Replacing him with a player of better quality will cost a lot of money.

We need to see how Gbamin progresses. If he doesn't, then we need to bring in somebody else to replace him and Delph, not Gomes.

I'm not saying never by the way. I just think what we are seeing is a development of the squad over a 2/3 year period. We have other issues that are more urgent and a limited budget with which to work. Maybe in 2 or 3 windows time I can see us bringing in an upgrade. Maybe Onyango or somebody else from the youth set up will have emerged by then.

A few points

regarding your judgment, you’re definitely in the minority when it comes to Gomes.

His injury was 17 months ago, how long is that going to be an excuse, you sound like sky amd VVD.

He’s a liability in a 2, slow, weak, gets robbed in possession and players walk past him, he hasn’t a clue how to defend.

Like some have pointed out. He’s got one goal and three assists in nearly 70 games. he doesn’t effect games enough for the manager to justify playing 3 midfielders, to give him protection

And Moshiri hasn’t hired ancelotti and paying him 11mil a season to
Worry about him wanting to spend 30/40 mil on a better midfielder.

 

[Rugby Toffee]

Way too slow for our game. A good player on the ball , but the amount of times he loses possession or gives away fouls will cost us.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

I believe in training he's one of the most cultured and assured in front of goal. We need to find a way to get him into forward positions more often. He has the quality to hurt teams as he's shown with a couple of very good assists in January.

Basically a couple of swinged in crosses

 

[blackie_jones75]

Gives me no pleasure in saying this but I thought he was shocking last night and could have cost us the game ... slow, weak, poor distribution and half arsed tackles...to name but a few things wrong with his game. Couldnt understand why Carlo didn't take him off and let's be honest he has been like this for ages now

 

[Barnfred 55]

Honestly people need to stop going on about the injury. He’s been back playing for a year.

He has quality but he’s just too slow. Can cope with him as a squad player but don’t want to see him starting many games next year.

Very easy to say he's been back a year, but it isn't as straightforward as that. Firstly, although he was only out a very short while (to what was expected) it was still an horrific injury that can often have lasting mental scars. Plus his recovery was staggered and interrupted by breaks. He came back quickly in March, then went into an enforced 3 month break. Back for 6 weeks and then another 4 week break. For me, we never saw the fit Gomes until after Christmas.

I'm not blaming the injury for his form now which i think, overall, is quite good. I'm saying it contributed to his poor form before Christmas. I think the injury is therefore very relevant to his form over this season.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Basically a couple of swinged in crosses

Ha ha. Stop it please.

Same with all those Digne swinged in crosses. Don't know what all the fuss is about me.

 

[Barnfred 55]

A few points

regarding your judgment, you’re definitely in the minority when it comes to Gomes.

His injury was 17 months ago, how long is that going to be an excuse, you sound like sky amd VVD.

He’s a liability in a 2, slow, weak, gets robbed in possession and players walk past him, he hasn’t a clue how to defend.

Like some have pointed out. He’s got one goal and three assists in nearly 70 games. he doesn’t effect games enough for the manager to justify playing 3 midfielders, to give him protection

And Moshiri hasn’t hired ancelotti and paying him 11mil a season to
Worry about him wanting to spend 30/40 mil on a better midfielder.

Ha ha

I was in a much much bigger minority with Davies. Hey Ho.

See above post re injury. If you don't get it, that's because you don't understand the recovery process of sports injuries. I can't help you there.

I wouldn't play him in a 2 by choice. When he plays in a 3 he links the play from midfield to front 3. Like he did at the start of the season when Allan and Doucoure and James were all fit and raring.

We've spent £60m on 4 players in the 3 windows since Ancelotti arrived. That suggests to me that we won't be splashing out £40m on a midfielder after we paid out for a full back, right winger, striker and possibly a keeper. But we'll see hey?

 

[Zatara]

If Gbamin gets fit would you be prepared to consider him. At the minute we don't know if he was ever good enough and even if he was the injuries may have taken there toll. On the other hand we paid upwards of £25 million for him and there was once a guy called Peter Reid who started his Everton career with injuries he turned out ok!!

Zat

Onyango is at least 18 months away from being ready for Premier or European football. So that would be 2 players we need to bring in. With the money Gomes is on we'd need to practically give him away. Nobody is paying money to take Delph of us and likewise Gbamin, at least until he has shown his fitness. We also need to bring in players better than Gomes. How much do you think that will cost. This is in addition to a right back, right wing, probably a back up attacker and quite possibly a keeper if we decide we've had enough of Pickford.

Agree Delph needs to go, if we manage to shift him that is. We may be stuck until the end of his contract next summer. Realistically we have a similar problem with Gbamin. I'm still hopeful he may come good for us, and maybe even be the defensive midfielder we crave if it allows us to play with attacking full backs. But equally he may not, in which case he'll be very difficult to offload.

You and I disagree on Gomes. You think he's crap. I don't. I think he has a lot of very good qualities, had a very bad injury not too long ago, and needs to find more consistency. We've argued over him before, as we have Tom Davies, and I'd rather trust my judgment than yours tbh. Also, I just don't see anybody paying decent money for him, not when he's on such a high wage. Unless his form improves vastly in which case I would argue why would we sell him anyway. His form overall is much improved since the turn of the year and I feel there's more to come from him. Replacing him with a player of better quality will cost a lot of money.

We need to see how Gbamin progresses. If he doesn't, then we need to bring in somebody else to replace him and Delph, not Gomes.

I'm not saying never by the way. I just think what we are seeing is a development of the squad over a 2/3 year period. We have other issues that are more urgent and a limited budget with which to work. Maybe in 2 or 3 windows time I can see us bringing in an upgrade. Maybe Onyango or somebody else from the youth set up will have emerged by then.

My midfield 3 next year if we can get a right winger is
Allan DM Doucoure CM James AM

If Gbamin gets fit him and Davies cover Allan and Doucoure, Sigurdsson covers James and Gomes is 7th choice used mainly in Europe where games are a little more his pace.

If James is still the main RW we need a first choice AM

Delph I would loan out if we can't sell even if we have to pay half his wages we need him out the club as he is a potentially toxic player.

Onyango it is too early for him to be in the 7 but when we have 12 subs in Europe might be worth giving him little bits of games if possible.

A few points

regarding your judgment, you’re definitely in the minority when it comes to Gomes.

His injury was 17 months ago, how long is that going to be an excuse, you sound like sky amd VVD.

He’s a liability in a 2, slow, weak, gets robbed in possession and players walk past him, he hasn’t a clue how to defend.

Like some have pointed out. He’s got one goal and three assists in nearly 70 games. he doesn’t effect games enough for the manager to justify playing 3 midfielders, to give him protection

And Moshiri hasn’t hired ancelotti and paying him 11mil a season to
Worry about him wanting to spend 30/40 mil on a better midfielder.

@messymascot
Id forgotten about Gbamin, we'll have to see how he progresses from rehabiliation.

James could come into the attacking midfield role but i didnt include him in the list because he would rotate across positions i think rather than be a set midfielder.

If we include them then:

Doucoure
Allan
Davies
Sigurdsson
James
Gbamin
Onyango

With one new signing as well...8 players for the central area.


@Barnfred 55

Onyango has been given minutes and been on the bench a few times now. Im not sure why he wouldnt be included in a squad? Should we also not include Nkounkou?

We have starters, rotation options and young backup players in a squad...

Delph, needless to say has to be moved on by hook or by crook...even if its a loan to just get him out the door till his contract expires.

Gomes, you ask "how much will it cost to sign a better player"....

Honestly, im with @Stephenlloyd on this one. Everything in his post is spot on.

I didnt really want us to spend as much as £18mil on him but £22mil was 'ok' if he improved in his second season...he hasnt.

I actually have nothing positive to comment on him and wince when i see him on the teamsheet...hes the epitome of a 'hollywood' type who loves pinging balls around and then moving around like a headless chicken.

As for your question, i think we'll sign a central midfielder this summer. I dont think we have much choice really as we dont have a real star in there for the long term like a Godfrey in defence or a DCL/Richarlison up top.

I also think we will sign a Right back and probably a right winger/forward.

Thats the 3 major signings before any large sales.

 

[messymascot]

@messymascot
Id forgotten about Gbamin, we'll have to see how he progresses from rehabiliation.

James could come into the attacking midfield role but i didnt include him in the list because he would rotate across positions i think rather than be a set midfielder.

If we include them then:

Doucoure
Allan
Davies
Sigurdsson
James
Gbamin
Onyango

With one new signing as well...8 players for the central area.


@Barnfred 55

Onyango has been given minutes and been on the bench a few times now. Im not sure why he wouldnt be included in a squad? Should we also not include Nkounkou?

We have starters, rotation options and young backup players in a squad...

Delph, needless to say has to be moved on by hook or by crook...even if its a loan to just get him out the door till his contract expires.

Gomes, you ask "how much will it cost to sign a better player"....

Honestly, im with @Stephenlloyd on this one. Everything in his post is spot on.

I didnt really want us to spend as much as £18mil on him but £22mil was 'ok' if he improved in his second season...he hasnt.

I actually have nothing positive to comment on him and wince when i see him on the teamsheet...hes the epitome of a 'hollywood' type who loves pinging balls around and then moving around like a headless chicken.

As for your question, i think we'll sign a central midfielder this summer. I dont think we have much choice really as we dont have a real star in there for the long term like a Godfrey in defence or a DCL/Richarlison up top.

I also think we will sign a Right back and probably a right winger/forward.

Thats the 3 major signings before any large sales.

I would probably keep James in the forward pool and bring in a new AM. Needs to be able to get 10-15 goals a season from open play plus assist. These players are rare but they are out there. Gomes we are stuck with, his wages and fee would put people off. However as I said above in Europe his skill set is more suitable. He played well alongside Gueye and Sigurdsson in a few games in his first season but that was playing as a CM in a pivot behind a 10. Mainly he's been played as an CM/AM in a 3 and he doesn't have the pace for that role. Gives away too many silly fouls.

 

[Zatara]

I would probably keep James in the forward pool and bring in a new AM. Needs to be able to get 10-15 goals a season from open play plus assist. These players are rare but they are out there. Gomes we are stuck with, his wages and fee would put people off. However as I said above in Europe his skill set is more suitable. He played well alongside Gueye and Sigurdsson in a few games in his first season but that was playing as a CM in a pivot behind a 10. Mainly he's been played as an CM/AM in a 3 and he doesn't have the pace for that role. Gives away too many silly fouls.

Id bin him off

The centre mid id want would be a centre mid who is a very good all rounder.

 

[LocalNative]

Some overreactions in this thread. Didn't have a great game but was constantly looking to play forwards all game which is something we've berated him for not doing previously.

Still probably the best passer in the squad after James and looks so much better when he doesn't have much defensive responsibilities (i.e when Allan came on). Not the answer but more than good enough to justify his place in the squad. Keep.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

Ha ha. Stop it please.

Same with all those Digne swinged in crosses. Don't know what all the fuss is about me.

The wolves one was his running away from goal and getting to the ball and swinging in to a dangerous area by wrapping his left foot around it

You called it a very good assist , that’s a siggurdsson and James ball through to Richarlison.