• Participation within this 'World Football' is only available to members who have had 5+ posts approved elsewhere.

ECHO Comment: "Fears of Witch-hunt Against Liverpool FC" part 3


davek said:
Perhaps, if you're a team called after a north end district, you're going to struggle to embed yourself in the south end? If you're called Liverpool, it's a little easier for south enders to stomach, I suppose...even if that club is based on the north end.

Its a little known fact that the south end had their own professional football club (well, just about south end: Wavertree). Liverpool Caledonian FC.
Click to expand...

I have some theories on this myself. Aside fromthe obviously religious divide point if you look at the two clubs, Everton had an enormous head start on Liverpool but Liverpool have benefitted from the last 40 years or so.

We had an established fanbase before they were formed, and the biggest in the division. Even quite early into their club, they wre watched by a couple of thousand, we were 6 or 7 times that number. Those initial fans, you'd imagine were based in and around the north end of the city. One of Evertonians strengths is the resilience, and that it's passed down from generation to generation. I think this big advantage remained all the way unto the 60's- which can be seen in the attendence figures for ourselves always being a lot harder.

I know a few blues who watched us in the 50's/60's and they were just dismissive of Liverpool really. They were half way up the division 2, with next to no support, while we were the best supported team in the country. So we started from a huge advantage point, but over time that has been eroded demogrphically.

Their success post the mid 70's onwards has probably opened up newer areas, and been easier for them to infiltrate and start gaining a support. As football grew in the 90's that process probably increased.

Maybe something in @roydo said a well about our ground being the nearest to the north end. I mean those things make a difference. All you would say though is than in those days, fans would tend to go to both teams on alternating weeks.
 

catcherintherye said:
I have some theories on this myself. Aside fromthe obviously religious divide point if you look at the two clubs, Everton had an enormous head start on Liverpool but Liverpool have benefitted from the last 40 years or so.

We had an established fanbase before they were formed, and the biggest in the division. Even quite early into their club, they wre watched by a couple of thousand, we were 6 or 7 times that number. Those initial fans, you'd imagine were based in and around the north end of the city. One of Evertonians strengths is the resilience, and that it's passed down from generation to generation. I think this big advantage remained all the way unto the 60's- which can be seen in the attendence figures for ourselves always being a lot harder.

I know a few blues who watched us in the 50's/60's and they were just dismissive of Liverpool really. They were half way up the division 2, with next to no support, while we were the best supported team in the country. So we started from a huge advantage point, but over time that has been eroded demogrphically.

Their success post the mid 70's onwards has probably opened up newer areas, and been easier for them to infiltrate and start gaining a support. As football grew in the 90's that process probably increased.

Maybe something in @roydo said a well about our ground being the nearest to the north end. I mean those things make a difference. All you would say though is than in those days, fans would tend to go to both teams on alternating weeks.
Click to expand...
There's some other dimensions to the early support: Everton had a state of the art stadium. It was probably the best in the country, and the club were always at the forefront of bringing in innovations. So there's a comfort aspect to greater attendance, as well as playing superior football and being more successful (the cup was probably more prestigious until the 50s/60s and Liverpool had failed to secure it until 1965). That would would have drawn in the so called 'flaneur' support who weren't that tribal but saw football attendance as part of the social week and an allotted part of their consumer spending.

That's a general point. But on the Everton north end stuff: mobility was an issue in that early support and it wasn't easy to move around a Victorian city in a horse drawn tram system that wasn't electrified extensively until the very late 19th century and early 20th century. Prior to electrification it would have definitely been an easier route to go from the docklands and out to Walton to watch Everton than travel up the notoriously difficult shelf of Everton overlooking the city and out to Anfield. The volume of tram traffic would have been a lot less on that route until the lines were electrified - many private tram companies wouldn't touch it until then because it wouldn't have been profitable. That part of town though (Everton/Anfield) even prior to electrification did have connections to other suburbs like Edge Hill and Low Hill and out past the town centre toward the south end. Could that have drawn into LFC a lot more support from that part of town than we got from there (or even required, given our established support base from the lower-lying docklands and other north end districts)?
 
Need a City win or draw today to keep this lot in a top 4 scrap. Anything other than a Liverpool win probably ends the title race and keeps them sweating with Chelsea us and Leicester around them. A win probably sets them up for top 4 as they’ll keep pushing for the title. If the title is gone they may focus on the CL and drop further points in the league which could open the door for us. Equally if the title is sewn up there’s more chance of City playing rotated teams in their two games against us as they also prioritise other comps. A good City win today please and the point last night will start to look very good especially with West Ham drawing and Arsenal losing.
 

Saint Domingo said:
Need a City win or draw today to keep this lot in a top 4 scrap. Anything other than a Liverpool win probably ends the title race and keeps them sweating with Chelsea us and Leicester around them. A win probably sets them up for top 4 as they’ll keep pushing for the title. If the title is gone they may focus on the CL and drop further points in the league which could open the door for us. Equally if the title is sewn up there’s more chance of City playing rotated teams in their two games against us as they also prioritise other comps. A good City win today please and the point last night will start to look very good especially with West Ham drawing and Arsenal losing.
Click to expand...

I never really feel massively confident with City going there. Logically we shouldnt either, they are set up to do better against "better" teams. The hope is City keep it to 0. If they do, at some point I sense Liverpool will over stretch and an opportunity will come. If they went for a shoot out, I'd fancy Liverpool.

Hopefully Pep is sensible enough, just to keep it tight. Given United have dropped points too, a 0-0 is a great result for City. A draw for Liverpool and they have to finally accept City are winning their (as in City's) title again.
 

Welcome

Join Grand Old Team to get involved in the Everton discussion. Signing up is quick, easy, and completely free.

Register

Shop

Back
Top