2018/19 Idrissa Gueye

[Daytripper]

He's superb at what he does well - as a defensive midfielder.

His limitations on the ball, while not as bad as some make out and the stats back this up, stop him from being a 'next level' player, as it were (though he'd actually improve PSG as they can't defend for toffee).

We aren't in a good enough position to let a player like that leave, imo.

Fair point, as I said I never quite got it with him or saw what others say with huge plaudits. As the saying goes “I don’t get it” or “I’m not feeling it”. Perhaps that says more about me in terms of football knowledge ha ha.

Maybe we need money to reinvest in the squad I dunno, all the talk before Jan from the likes of Brands indicated little to no activity but financial stuff is for other threads I guess.

 

[Lanolin]

Can you show us where your getting these stats from mate? Also can you explain what constitutes as a forward pass?

Also he is our only player to be a cm who has played the last two full seasons so, yeah stats will be a bit skewed.

Umm. I mean. I reckon you could probably guess?

 

[Papa Shango]

I say we sell him since we are in a state of transition and look for a long term signing. He isn’t ancient by any means, but his value will depreciate the longer we hold on to him.

Having said that, I love the guy and think he will dominate at PSG. If we were at the top competing, I’d say hell no to them. If the price is right, good luck and godspeed you lovely frandly man

This is very reasonable and pretty much spot on. More of this would be nice.

Instead he seems to be hes crap get rid or he is boss keep forever.

Every player has their price but it has to be worth our while and he will need replacing.

 

[BlueToff]

Can you show us where your getting these stats from mate? Also can you explain what constitutes as a forward pass?

Also he is our only player to be a cm who has played the last two full seasons so, yeah stats will be a bit skewed.

Opta. I have a log in through the company I work for. I'm not sure I can screengrab as obviously it's a closed system, so not going to be sharing on here and getting in trouble!

I'm not sure on the definitions of a forward pass precisely, but at a guess it will be when the ball's trajectory travels ahead of the player (in any direction) that has passed it. I'm not being pedantic here or taking the p, I just think it's as simple as that.

And well, Schneiderlin played most of last season. As did Davies.

 

[BlueToff]

Fair point, as I said I never quite got it with him or saw what others say with huge plaudits. As the saying goes “I don’t get it” or “I’m not feeling it”. Perhaps that says more about me in terms of football knowledge ha ha.

Maybe we need money to reinvest in the squad I dunno, all the talk before Jan from the likes of Brands indicated little to no activity but financial stuff is for other threads I guess.

Fair enough. I readily admit he's very frustrating at times. But he more than makes up for it, imo, with what he's good at.

Now I also agree that in an ideal world we need a Doucoure/Ndombele (other players are available) powerhouse to come into the side, and give us real dynamism, but you don't have to sell a player to upgrade on them, especially not when we have such tosh on the books as we do already. In fact, good squads build on the good players they have and build competition that way, surely?

 

[Zezti]

His shooting shouldn't even be something he is judged on. That said it is no worse than the vast majority of players who play his role.

If we are talking context we also need to take into account the fact that he sees a ridiculous amount of the ball as he always shows for a pass. The more a player sees the ball the more chance there is for a player to misplace a pass.

If he attempts it, he gets judged on it. And some of his attempts are now only visible to the Hubble deep Space Telescope. Silva has said he wants goals to come from all positions so we can assume he encourages Gomes and Gana to shoot when they can.
I do rate Gana though. He's great at what he does and we will not find it easy to get another player in who can break up play as well as he can, but he does have his limitations.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

100 succesful passes v Lincoln. 11 failed passes.

Also our highest passer (both for successful and forward passes) in the last two seasons.

Your having a laugh quoting pass stats. I watch football with my eyes, he was getting destroyed on Twitter after the Lincoln game.
On a serious point would you really keep him if PSG offered 35mil.

 

[BlueToff]

This is very reasonable and pretty much spot on. More of this would be nice.

Instead he seems to be hes crap get rid or he is boss keep forever.

Every player has their price but it has to be worth our while and he will need replacing.

Honestly, if it was the summer, and we knew that he wouldn't fit in or whatever, and that there'd be time to get a replacement in, then I'd be a lot more open to it.

But not now. It's two steps back to take one forward - well, not even take one forward if the quality isn't available, which it rarely is at this time of year.

Thing is, we also have people saying we need another midfielder as it is - which is true. Now, surely if Gana goes, that means we need two. So again, it's not getting us anywhere.

They may be crap, and unwanted/crocked, but we could get Schneiderlin and McCarthy (theoretically) out of the door without suffering anything in terms of lack of numbers or players, because they offer nothing as it stands (I still hold slim hope for James Mac).

But advocating selling one of our only good midfielders is baffling. Because it just leaves us back at square one. And that's not a good place to be halfway through a season that is still very much in the balance.

We're four points off seventh, have a good draw in the cup and have 5 big homes games to come that Gana would be crucial in.

 

[BlueToff]

Your having a laugh quoting pass stats. I watch football with my eyes, he was getting destroyed on Twitter after the Lincoln game.
On a serious point would you really keep him if PSG offered 35mil.

How am I having a laugh?

I agree with you that he made some bad errors the other day, I can remember three off the top of my head. But it is an actual fact that he made 100 successful passes, with only 11 failed ones. I don't care what Twitter says, that is - to quote Rafael - a fact. Angry Da bot 2000 on Twitter doesn't alter that.

And as it stands, yes, I would, right now. Because I don't see what £35m gets us at this point in the season.

In the summer, I'd be a lot more open to it. But at this stage I don't think £35m gets us the quality (which we would need to be able to guarantee, btw) two players that we would need in midfield. We already need one, as it is, so we'd need another if Gana went.

A player like Doucoure would be ace. He'd guarantee quality, and in an ideal world would come in to complement Gana and Gomes. But Watford wouldn't sell, not to us, not halfway through the season. They might to a massive club, but only for silly money, because he's on a huge, long-term contract there. And they know they'd get £40m-50m anyway come the summer, no problem. Same applies for Ndombele at Lyon. Obviously there are other players, but there's not many that fit the profile and quality which we'd need to bring in to guarantee a smooth transition halfway through the campaign. If we pulled off a signing like that, it'd be a major coup and surprise at this stage in the season.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

I just don't agree with selling a key player halfway through the season. And halfway through the season is not the time to look for a long term signing.

The money isn't even a factor.

Doucoure would be ace, for example, but Watford can and will get £40million for him in the summer. It will make absolutely no difference to them. So they wouldn't sell.

We also have five fixtures at home against the rest of the big six coming up. Based on the Spurs game, we absolutely need Gana in there to have a chance of going up against them and getting a result.

He's superb at what he does well - as a defensive midfielder.

His limitations on the ball, while not as bad as some make out and the stats back this up, stop him from being a 'next level' player, as it were (though he'd actually improve PSG as they can't defend for toffee).

We aren't in a good enough position to let a player like that leave, imo.

Apart from when he let doucoure stroll of the back of him and have a free run into our 6yard box and score. While gana jogged away ball watching. But yes he’s a world class defensive midfielder, the best in the league I believe, better than Fernandinho I’ve read in here.

 

[Osamabindiesel]

I just don't agree with selling a key player halfway through the season. And halfway through the season is not the time to look for a long term signing.

The money isn't even a factor.

Doucoure would be ace, for example, but Watford can and will get £40million for him in the summer. It will make absolutely no difference to them. So they wouldn't sell.

We also have five fixtures at home against the rest of the big six coming up. Based on the Spurs game, we absolutely need Gana in there to have a chance of going up against them and getting a result.

Maybe it’s just me being a bit pessimistic about the season. Personally, I wouldn’t be outraged if we sold him for the right price. I do agree that he is a big part of the team as it currently stands, and it would be mad if we didn’t have a replacement ready (similar to the Lukaku situation).

Still, I think it’s important that Marco creates an identity for this team as soon as possible. If that means replacing Gana with a more well rounded player, so be it.

 

[Bluewolf]

Opta. I have a log in through the company I work for. I'm not sure I can screengrab as obviously it's a closed system, so not going to be sharing on here and getting in trouble!

I'm not sure on the definitions of a forward pass precisely, but at a guess it will be when the ball's trajectory travels ahead of the player (in any direction) that has passed it. I'm not being pedantic here or taking the p, I just think it's as simple as that.

And well, Schneiderlin played most of last season. As did Davies.

That's what I thought so passing sideways to the fullback would constitute as a forward pass technically, no? If said full back was a foot in front of him but 10 yards to his side.

That's fair enough with the stats but I've been having a look at gana's stats myself and it shows that he only plays 0.4 key passes a match, 0.1 through balls a match and 0.1 crosses per match.

So he only plays a key pass every two and a half games and only plays a through ball and a cross every 10 games.

Also gana played 33 games last season the same at Tom but has player more then double both Tom and schnidelin this season. So of course his stats are going to be skewed.

Who played more forward passes per game this season keane or gana?

 

[BlueToff]

Apart from when he let doucoure stroll of the back of him and have a free run into our 6yard box and score. While gana jogged away ball watching. But yes he’s a world class defensive midfielder, the best in the league I believe, better than Fernandinho I’ve read in here.

Literally four defenders all left Doucoure unmarked.

Gomes did exactly the same against Spurs - let Alli run right past him. Do you want him sold? Digne left Rondon free v Newcastle, what about him?

And who has said he is world class? I never have once used that term. There are very few truly world class players. Fernandinho is one of them - but again a different type of player to Gana. More of a player who relies on positioning and reading of the game and has that elegance and precision on the ball that Gana doesn't.

 

[BlueToff]

That's what I thought so passing sideways to the fullback would constitute as a forward pass technically, no?

That's fair enough with the stats but I've been having a look at gana's stats myself and it shows that he only plays 0.4 key passes a match, 0.1 through balls a match and 0.1 crosses per match.

So he only plays a key pass every two and a half games and only plays a through ball and a cross every 10 games.

Also gana played 33 games last season the same at Tom but has player more then double both Tom and schnidelin this season. So of course his stats are going to be skewed.

Who played more forward passes per game this season keane or gana?

Well, on the forward pass point, the same applies to every player. Gomes does loads - loads - of the passes to the fb's, is he negative? It's still moving the ball forward... although I understand your point.

And yes, he's not great with the key passes/chances created etc. I won't dispute that. Our issues stem from him having to act as a creative fulcrum. We signed Gomes to try and counter that, and it worked in our good run. Gomes has hit some issues -due to several reasons - and now the onus has switched back to Gana. I'll readily accept he isn't good enough in that regard.

But it doesn't negate from what he is good at, and what he is good at is crucial to how Silva wants to play - which is give the front five, plus the full-backs complete freedom to push on.

And not sure on your last point, will have to check if I get the time.

 

[barneygumble]

Is he a gonna then?