The Crowd

[nsno-chris]

It’s the WOOLS fault

 

[BillLovesRoo]

Why is Anfield so noisy then?

Thomas Cook

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

Why is Anfield so noisy then?

Being comfortably top of the league and looking like champions-elect will have that effect.....

 

[stanleypark]

The atmosphere and crowd at Goodison has been amongst the worst in the league for some time now. During the 80s, 90s, even during the Moyes days Goodison was always known as a bear pit, we were the team to avoid in the cup draw, the great Sir Alex Ferguson said it was a nightmare coming to Goodison. That crowd in the 80s won us the Bayern Munich game - where we were 1-0 down at half time might I add, the players weren't booed off and the crowd wasn't toxic towards our own players once we went behind - and in the 90s as well with the famous final game against Wimbledon. It just doesn't happen anymore, and it frustrates me so much to see the soul slowly being sucked out of our great club, if it hasn't already.

I am sick to the back teeth of matchgoers having this mentality of "sit back and wait to be entertained", and seeing shouts of "We'll wait until they start performing on the pitch before we sing". That's not being a supporter, it's being a CUSTOMER, simply another sheep feeding Farhad Moshiri's coffers. As long as people continue to adopt this "theatre mentality" then nothing will change. Having a roaring atmosphere from the off gives those players the motivation to go an extra mile and really push themselves for the cause, we'll get breaks of the ball we otherwise wouldn't have gotten, we might get some luck from the referee, opposition players will flap it and play worse. That never happens at Goodison anymore - if it's silent then that extra bit of hidden motivation isn't there, opposition players aren't intimidated, and the "home advantage" we should have isn't there. It's like we play every game away, with the home fans sucking the confidence and motivation out of our own players if they don't perform. This wholly flawed way of thinking needs badly binning off.

For example, look at Rangers in the recent Old Firm derby victory. Ibrox was absolutely bouncing and their players responded by pouring in more passion and guts than they've showed all season, while Celtic players completely flapped it. I can name millions of other games that have been won solely because of the fans as well. Goodison doesn't even get up for big games anymore, it's always "EVERTON EVERTON EVERTON" being sung every so often, or "EEEEVERTON, EEEEVERTON" meekly being blared once we win a corner. A large number of the matchgoing crowd at Goodison will say our players "aren't arsed", when the club's own fans aren't even "arsed" themselves. Why should those players go that extra mile on the pitch for so-called "fans" who turn their back on them when they're in need of a lift? If we actually tried to generate a 'bear pit' atmosphere and performances were the same then fair enough, but we haven't done that whatsoever for ages now. We put in our best performance at Anfield in years this season despite the result, yet our end could hardly be heard all game. It's all a bit hypocritical if you ask me.

If you *only* want entertainment and high quality football then shouldn't you be watching the likes of Barcelona, Man City, dare I say it the RS? You go the game to get behind your team - win lose or draw - and if you're not going to do that then why even go? Why even follow the team if you're not going to get behind them, whether it's keeping them flying when they're doing well already or picking them up when they need a lift? I do think about if the matchgoing crowd ever wonder how Sunderland and other lower league fans get by. What a bunch of weirdos, singing and backing their team when they've been relegated twice in a row! How could they possibly be entertained by League One football, outside the so-called "best league in der werld"?!

Another point, where I may delve slightly off-course. I feel like ever since Moshiri has come in, our fans now feel a greater sense of entitlement and this notion has popped up that we have a God-given right to turn teams over simply because we have spent alot of money, when that's not how it works whatsoever, no team has any divine right to turn anyone over no matter how much money they have. I see shouts such as "he's on X a week, he cost X million so I expect to see this", again it doesn't work like that. Value in football is almost always vastly overinflated, it's the worst market in the world with many factors affecting a player's value - a transfer fee or a wage is never indicative of a player's ability. Sandro Ramirez is on more than most of the Tottenham squad for goodness' sake. That's the fault of the balloons who sanctioned his purchase. It's about spending your money wisely like we did in the Moyes days, not lazily splashing stupid amounts of cash on players not worth that amount (Mo Salah less than Sigurdsson anyone?). So far Moshiri has not done anything remotely similar to spending wisely at all, sanctioning the purchase of hundreds of millions of pounds' worth of FOTM managers and mid-table level players. The expectations of the crowd are currently outstripping the actual level of the team as a result of this way of thinking that more money = better, and that combined with said players who are largely already average on paper receiving only abuse from the crowd for not performing to the unrealistic expectations, means we are going to continue to get worse. Negativity breeds negativity and apathy breeds apathy.

Back to the main point, Goodison just doesn't feel magical anymore. I always used to go the match and it felt special, it felt like my second home, nowadays that feeling is completely gone. The ground is full of negativity and vitriol, sometimes even when we're winning. Away fans outsing us week in week out, it's become both embarrassing and sad at the same time. "Sing when you're winning" doesn't even apply to us because we don't even sing when we are winning, it's that poor.

The problem with our crowd is that we have forgotten what Everton is. We have lost our identity, and we're not getting it back unless we all start to work together as supporters in order to remember who we are again.

I apologize for this post being so long. It just frustrates me and saddens me at the same time to see the atmosphere around the club in such a sorry state, and people who are trying to get everyone to work together just being ignored or shot down. I do hope something happens in the future but for now I can't see any light at the end of this frustrating tunnel.

That's smalltime you happy clapper. Sit down and watch the match, my toes are curling wen you sing cringeworthy songs. Kopite behaviour that. Singing is manufactured support I pay my money and I'll boo if I want
Yours
Mr Simpleton

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

That's not being a supporter, it's being a CUSTOMER

Yeah well that's what the majority of a football crowd is these days. It's what our club decided they wanted when they priced out half our fanbase and facially exploited those of us who are still stupid enough to pay for the grossly overpriced tickets and everything else that goes with it. The powers that be at the club decided they wanted customers rather then fans and they got them. Congratulations! They alienated a good section of our support who would just of been happy to be at the match, supporting the side and made following the club a major financial decision/burden. It could be so easily fixed with fairer ticket prices and a less corporate match experience that the club has pushed for so long.

Everything about the club and match day experience is so forced, corporate and cringe. Again, that was the club's decision to make things this way. The club could fix the atmosphere overnight if they wanted to with the endlessly suggested singing section, I'd move into it tomorrow if I could. They won't though, because they don't care.

Nothing will change on any level at this club from the match day atmosphere to the hideous, endless garbage on the pitch and the powers that be are happy with that.

 

[Winslow89]

Yeah well that's what the majority of a football crowd is these days. It's what our club decided they wanted when they priced out half our fanbase and facially exploited those of us who are still stupid enough to pay for the grossly overpriced tickets and everything else that goes with it. The powers that be at the club decided they wanted customers rather then fans and they got them. Congratulations! They alienated a good section of our support who would just of been happy to be at the match, supporting the side and made following the club a major financial decision/burden. It could be so easily fixed with fairer ticket prices and a less corporate match experience that the club has pushed for so long.

Everything about the club and match day experience is so forced, corporate and cringe. Again, that was the club's decision to make things this way. The club could fix the atmosphere overnight if they wanted to with the endlessly suggested singing section, I'd move into it tomorrow if I could. They won't though, because they don't care.

Nothing will change on any level at this club from the match day atmosphere to the hideous, endless garbage on the pitch and the powers that be are happy with that.

Was having a read of this earlier on for average ticket prices: https://www.premierleague.com/news/941050

I'd have argued your point there on the cost of a ticket, if I hadn't read that

 

[ArtetaMoney]

I’ve found that most of the people who moan about the fans not being noisy enough, or getting on the backs of the players; are the ones who sit at home watching the match on a stream. Moaning to their missus when we are playing poorly and turn it off before the match is over.

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

Was having a read of this earlier on for average ticket prices: https://www.premierleague.com/news/941050

I'd have argued your point there on the cost of a ticket, if I hadn't read that

The price of attending a premier league match at Goodison speaks for itself. The premier league and clubs can try and spin things however they want but the facts are out there. If a Dads his two kids with him to the match he's looking at £76 (adult £38 and juniors £19 each) for the three of them and £114 If mum goes too for a catogry B Premier league match at Goodison in the family enclosure. That's the cheapest you can get for a catogry B game so we're talking about such giants as Wolves and Bournemouth here. That's before mum and dad have spent a penny on a programme or drinks and snacks. That's not a cheep commitment, hell doing that regularly is a massive commitment to great swathes of our fanbase. Not everyone can afford to drop cash like that all the time so when they do, they have a right to expect somthing from the club that's ripping them off and then having the gall to portray themslevs as nice guys helping fans attend the match for buttons. Following the club in a major financial decision and one that many people can't justify.

Hell, even with boring sods like me who are lucky enough to be able to just fork out the £485 upfront (renewal is coming up soon, yay!) for my season ticket it works out at about 25.50 per game for 19 games of football. That's before I talk about the cost of going away ect. It's not just the match ticket, it's the whole cost of the day.

Look I'm not saying we get ripped off worse then anyone else because we clearly don't. Hell most Premier League clubs rip off their fans even more but we're still getting horribly ripped off and I'm not going to pretend that being slightly less ripped off is as brilliant deal. Nor am I saying that the prices we pay justify the lack of atmosphere at Goodison because it seems to me that if you be paid you might as well make the best of it and get involved trying to make the atmosphere better even if what we're seeing on the pitch is trash. I don't think the prices are the biggest contributing factor to the lack of atmosphere but you'd have to be crazy to not see that it's defiantly played a big part in it.

 

[dannyboy]

I’ve found that most of the people who moan about the fans not being noisy enough, or getting on the backs of the players; are the ones who sit at home watching the match on a stream. Moaning to their missus when we are playing poorly and turn it off before the match is over.

Which is a fair comment. It does sound dreadful though and I always watch to the end. Even stick around for the post match interviews.

 

[ArtetaMoney]

Which is a fair comment. It does sound dreadful though and I always watch to the end. Even stick around for the post match interviews.

Would you feel like singing at the games you’ve watched over December, if you were there? Barring the Derby and Burnley where we actually played well.

 

[dannyboy]

Would you feel like singing at the games you’ve watched over December, if you were there? Barring the Derby and Burnley where we actually played well.

I'd likely be sat in silence like everyone else. It doesn't hide the fact that it's awful. What gets me is the absence of any noise whatsoever. Even if I could, I wouldn't buy a season ticket because it just looks like a boring experience.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

Why does one affect the other here though you could argue the season ticket holders at Liverpool are the ones actually making the noise?

84% is high but we’d cap it eventually IF we enjoy any kind of relative success/building of the brand worldwide. At the end of the day, season ticket holders aren’t good from a club’s commercial perspective but if we capped it at 50% now, would we still “fill Goodison?

As I said, The thread is on atmosphere and the crowd, it would be remiss to not discuss the significant change in dynamic from season ticket holders.

If the consensus is the atmosphere isn't what it was, then there's a debate as to whether a significant (talking 12k) increase in fans being season ticket holders is a factor. These fans, myself included tend to "go through the motions" with perhaps less sense of occasion. Take Leicester, there were a few empty seats because season ticket holders decided not to attend/couldnt resell. There was also over 1,000 tickets before the game on StubHub.

I think apathy/self loathing from mid table obscurity and the over commercialism of Premier League football are bigger reasons but each play a part.

 

[PhilM]

I'd likely be sat in silence like everyone else. It doesn't hide the fact that it's awful. What gets me is the absence of any noise whatsoever. Even if I could, I wouldn't buy a season ticket because it just looks like a boring experience.

In reality, I believe that the atmosphere you experience varies greatly depending on where you sit in the ground and the people who you sit with - like a community.

Some parts of the ground can still be very lively, albeit not all the time, while others are consistently sedate if not sterile. I guess that happens everywhere though.

I've been in the Street End for donkeys years and while I can see a decline even in the past five years, it's still enjoyable. It can be lively, a laugh but also intense.

The Park End on the other hand? In all seriousness and ignoring the typical ol' jokes, it takes a lot to get them on the seat, so perhaps it's spreading throughout.

In reality, if the football improved and we started challenging again then the crowd would get better, whereas we're now accustomed to football that isn't inspiring.

 

[marsh]

SELL

 

[dannyboy]

In reality, I believe that the atmosphere you experience varies greatly depending on where you sit in the ground and the people who you sit with - like a community.

Some parts of the ground can still be very lively, albeit not all the time, while others are consistently sedate if not sterile. I guess that happens everywhere though.

I've been in the Street End for donkeys years and while I can see a decline even in the past five years, it's still enjoyable. It can be lively, a laugh but also intense.

The Park End on the other hand? In all seriousness and ignoring the typical ol' jokes, it takes a lot to get them on the seat, so perhaps it's spreading throughout.

I had my season ticket in the Street End for 10 years and whenever I moved to another part of the ground for the odd cup game or to sit with a mate I was absolutely shocked by the lack of anything happening so I very much believe you.

I suppose it was only inevitable that atmosphere would spread to the Street End eventually. It is sad to see/hear, hopefully if we get back to competing and having something to play for it'll improve.

A weird observation I make is how good celebrations in the Street End used to look regardless of the game. Limbs absolutely everywhere. Looks nothing like that now.