Ronald Koeman discussion

[Kenshin]

Give it two or three more league games and we'll likely be in the bottom three. Couple that with a Europa league and Carabao cup spanking and you would expect some executive action. We can expect it but we won't see it for some reason.

By my calculations since Shakespear was appointed at Leicester they have amassed a point more than Everton.

Leicester sack Shakespeare... obviously not happy being stuck down at the bottom and prepared to wield the axe! Take note Mosh...

I made a thread a couple of weeks back talking about this but essentially when you look at palace, at Leicester, you see the club looking at what is on the pitch, the results and saying this isn't good enough for us. This is what I don't get about Everton, why don't we ever judge things as being not good enough?

I mean we have 4 big games over the next 2 weeks , 5 if the Europa game is in 2 weeks, and genuinely looking at Burnley, at the Cypriots, at Brighton, can you see us either changing or getting results? Why is this good enough for Everton but not for Leicester? Even the fact that we are happy to go out of cups by giving someone a chance despite all of this. We gave Martinez 2 cup finals , fair enough. Except all we had to do in one of them was not concede 3 in 20 minutes. And we did, we went into the second one and the team literally had to stop playing for the manager to even stand a chance.

We all know koeman will be sacked sooner rather than later, why go out of tournaments in the process to justify it?

 

[Saint Domingo]

Leicester sacked the manager who kept them up with the great escape that summer, they then sacks title winner the season afterwards, now they sack the guy who rescued them from relegation last year and was also part of the title success. It's called ambition without sentiment. Even Watford do it and look at the results, it may be chaotic but they've been promoted, stayed up, and now want to push onwards. Spurs did the same with Redknapp, Sherwood, AVB, until they got a manager who meets their ambition. Liverpool sacked their greatest ever player and the manager who almost delivered the title as soon as their trajectories levelled off. Klopp is now under arguably more pressure than Koeman is! Our board sit on their hands hiding behind the convenient mantra of 'Everton don't sack managers' because they have absolutely zero desire for us to improve as a football club in any aspect.

 

[Prevenger17]

Leicester sacked the manager who kept them up with the great escape that summer, they then sacks title winner the season afterwards, now they sack the guy who rescued them from relegation last year and was also part of the title success. It's called ambition without sentiment. Even Watford do it and look at the results, it may be chaotic but they've been promoted, stayed up, and now want to push onwards. Spurs did the same with Redknapp, Sherwood, AVB, until they got a manager who meets their ambition. Liverpool sacked their greatest ever player and the manager who almost delivered the title as soon as their trajectories levelled off. Klopp is now under arguably more pressure than Koeman is! Our board sit on their hands hiding behind the convenient mantra of 'Everton don't sack managers' because they have absolutely zero desire for us to improve as a football club in any aspect.

A compelling point tbf

 

[Osamabindiesel]

Leicester sacked the manager who kept them up with the great escape that summer, they then sacks title winner the season afterwards, now they sack the guy who rescued them from relegation last year and was also part of the title success. It's called ambition without sentiment. Even Watford do it and look at the results, it may be chaotic but they've been promoted, stayed up, and now want to push onwards. Spurs did the same with Redknapp, Sherwood, AVB, until they got a manager who meets their ambition. Liverpool sacked their greatest ever player and the manager who almost delivered the title as soon as their trajectories levelled off. Klopp is now under arguably more pressure than Koeman is! Our board sit on their hands hiding behind the convenient mantra of 'Everton don't sack managers' because they have absolutely zero desire for us to improve as a football club in any aspect.

It's pretty embarrassing dawg. I think Moyes (who tbf had a decent reign) set a low standard for EFC. We were so patient with the man and they expect us to feel the same with other managers. Times have changed. We have amassed a fair amount of talent. We should be competing at the very least. It's time to drop that mentality of 4th is winning the league.

 

[brieverton]

Agree lads, its only Good Old Everton here, scared of change yet again.

Nobody wants to see a manager sacked, and there isn't generally a good time to do it, but anyone with half a clue can see Koeman has reached the end here.

It is a positive thing to say "this is not good enough and not what we expect." It's an attitude that demands more from everyone and puts a marker down for a new manager, let alone the one that gets fired.

 

[kenada_blue]

I made a thread a couple of weeks back talking about this but essentially when you look at palace, at Leicester, you see the club looking at what is on the pitch, the results and saying this isn't good enough for us. This is what I don't get about Everton, why don't we ever judge things as being not good enough?

I mean we have 4 big games over the next 2 weeks , 5 if the Europa game is in 2 weeks, and genuinely looking at Burnley, at the Cypriots, at Brighton, can you see us either changing or getting results? Why is this good enough for Everton but not for Leicester? Even the fact that we are happy to go out of cups by giving someone a chance despite all of this. We gave Martinez 2 cup finals , fair enough. Except all we had to do in one of them was not concede 3 in 20 minutes. And we did, we went into the second one and the team literally had to stop playing for the manager to even stand a chance.

We all know koeman will be sacked sooner rather than later, why go out of tournaments in the process to justify it?

They didn't have a £6mill a year plus manager with additional payouts for sacking

 

[faddy the blue]

I can understand the logic behind sacking managers if you're convinced you have a better option lined up and have a better plan short term and long term to succeed. I honestly don't see how sacking a manager is always better for the club.

Take a look at Leicester, won the title, got to CL then their struggles were on the cards just like we did in CL under Moyes. So they go ahead and sack the man who got them their cos they wanted to look like some "big shot" ambitious club. Who did they go for? Oh yeah Craig Shakspear! The man they thought would be better cos he knows the club. They gave him money to spend and still they are lying in bottom 3. One of their big signings, Adrien Silva is in a limbo and I'm sure their fans would blame Shakspear for that too. Now they have sacked the manager who they gave a permanent deal in June to again look like "ambitious". Can someone tell me how sacking a manager like Ranieri and replacing him with Shakspear was ambitious? And their fans will be happy to see the club sack the manager. Cos that's what modern fans want. Just sack the bloody idiot and we'll be alright. Who will they now get in? Allardyce maybe? And how far can anyone else take them? Maximum 11th or 10th I bet. Is that ambitious enough for them? Or do they think they automatically deserve to be among the top 8 cos they won the title by some heavenly intervention a couple of years ago? If they just wanna avoid relegation and be around 10th then the same feat they can achieve by going on a 3 or 4 match unbeaten streak and pick up some form eventually. But no, modern fans want to call for the head without digging in with the team in tough times.

Going by that logic, thinking about replacing Koeman with Unsworth is suicidal. I bet he will be gone within the 6 months of his tenure. All his reputation with U23 will be tarnished cos the man has 0 experience managing a 40k stadium, players on huge salaries and transfer fees and keeping up with the PL pressure. Point is, impulsive sackings are not always for the BETTER. If you want to sack a manager, give him reasonable amount of time and then when you do, be 100% sure about the man you want to bring in, back him 100% for a certain period of time (not 4 months or 6 months) to see if he can deliver. And while doing that, the board and DoF which generally hide behind the curtains in tough times need to take some responsibility.

 

[MickA]

They didn't have a £6mill a year plus manager with additional payouts for sacking

What additional payouts?

 

[fuko~]

I can understand the logic behind sacking managers if you're convinced you have a better option lined up and have a better plan short term and long term to succeed. I honestly don't see how sacking a manager is always bettee for the club.

Take a look at Leicester, won the title, got to CL the their struggles were on the cards just like we did in CL under Moyes. So they go ahead and sack the man who got them their cos they wanted to look like some big hot shot club. Who did they go for? Oh yeah Craig Shakspear. The man they thought would be better cos he knows the club. They gave him money to spend and still they are lying in bottom 3. One of their big signings, Adrien Silva is in a limbo and I'm sure their fans would blame Shakspear for that too. Now they have sacked the manager who they gave a permanent deal in June to again look like "ambitious". Can someone tell me how sacking a manager like Ranieri and replacing him with Shakspear was ambitious? And their fans will be happy to see the club sack the manager. Cos that's what modern fans want. Just sack the bloody idiot and we'll be alright. Who will they now get in? Allardyce maybe? And how far can anyone else take them? Maximum 11th or 10th I bet.

Going by that logic, thinking about replacing Koeman with Unsworth is suicidal. I bet he will be gone within the 6 months of his tenure. All his reputation with U23 will be tarnished cos the man has 0 experience managing a 40k stadium, players on huge salaries and transfer fees and keeping up with the PL pressure. Point is, impulsive sackings are not always for the BETTER. If you want to sack a manager, give him reasonable amount of time and then when you do, be 100% sure about the man you want to bring in, back him 100% for a certain period of time (not 4 months or 6 months) to see if he can deliver. And while doing that, the board and DoF which generally hide behind the curtains in tough times need to take some responsibility.

Yes, we may sack a good manager but if the players and fans lost their confidence on him, how long and how he can rebuild their confidence?
Until we are in champion league and he bring back us to premier?? Just Like Martinez, I agree to sack him even I like his attacking style.
Once he lost the dressing room, he should be sacked as soon as possible and this is football.

 

[RomanReigns]

Koeman is lucky

 

[Rudolf Hucker]

Why is he still here?

 

[Efcjake]

Davies is a first team player and I can only assume that Kenny isnt doing it in training cos Cuco is RANK and Holgate will never be a RB as long as he lives.

Not a centre back either.

 

[Goat]

Not a centre back either.

Needs to fill out a little bit more, still think hes got the potential to be a CB, but currently hes not 1.

 

[Kenshin]

I can understand the logic behind sacking managers if you're convinced you have a better option lined up and have a better plan short term and long term to succeed. I honestly don't see how sacking a manager is always better for the club.

Take a look at Leicester, won the title, got to CL then their struggles were on the cards just like we did in CL under Moyes. So they go ahead and sack the man who got them their cos they wanted to look like some "big shot" ambitious club. Who did they go for? Oh yeah Craig Shakspear! The man they thought would be better cos he knows the club. They gave him money to spend and still they are lying in bottom 3. One of their big signings, Adrien Silva is in a limbo and I'm sure their fans would blame Shakspear for that too. Now they have sacked the manager who they gave a permanent deal in June to again look like "ambitious". Can someone tell me how sacking a manager like Ranieri and replacing him with Shakspear was ambitious? And their fans will be happy to see the club sack the manager. Cos that's what modern fans want. Just sack the bloody idiot and we'll be alright. Who will they now get in? Allardyce maybe? And how far can anyone else take them? Maximum 11th or 10th I bet. Is that ambitious enough for them? Or do they think they automatically deserve to be among the top 8 cos they won the title by some heavenly intervention a couple of years ago? If they just wanna avoid relegation and be around 10th then the same feat they can achieve by going on a 3 or 4 match unbeaten streak and pick up some form eventually. But no, modern fans want to call for the head without digging in with the team in tough times.

Going by that logic, thinking about replacing Koeman with Unsworth is suicidal. I bet he will be gone within the 6 months of his tenure. All his reputation with U23 will be tarnished cos the man has 0 experience managing a 40k stadium, players on huge salaries and transfer fees and keeping up with the PL pressure. Point is, impulsive sackings are not always for the BETTER. If you want to sack a manager, give him reasonable amount of time and then when you do, be 100% sure about the man you want to bring in, back him 100% for a certain period of time (not 4 months or 6 months) to see if he can deliver. And while doing that, the board and DoF which generally hide behind the curtains in tough times need to take some responsibility.

Then again, in our case specifically. We are paying koeman 6 million a year to manage this team. At one point do you think we call time on koeman when that high salary manager is not trying to change anything? We are struggling to beat the teams both ends of the league for the most part and come Thursday we will do it again. My point is, how long do you keep behind a manager doing that?

 

[Eggsyblueskin]

I can understand the logic behind sacking managers if you're convinced you have a better option lined up and have a better plan short term and long term to succeed. I honestly don't see how sacking a manager is always better for the club.

Take a look at Leicester, won the title, got to CL then their struggles were on the cards just like we did in CL under Moyes. So they go ahead and sack the man who got them their cos they wanted to look like some "big shot" ambitious club. Who did they go for? Oh yeah Craig Shakspear! The man they thought would be better cos he knows the club. They gave him money to spend and still they are lying in bottom 3. One of their big signings, Adrien Silva is in a limbo and I'm sure their fans would blame Shakspear for that too. Now they have sacked the manager who they gave a permanent deal in June to again look like "ambitious". Can someone tell me how sacking a manager like Ranieri and replacing him with Shakspear was ambitious? And their fans will be happy to see the club sack the manager. Cos that's what modern fans want. Just sack the bloody idiot and we'll be alright. Who will they now get in? Allardyce maybe? And how far can anyone else take them? Maximum 11th or 10th I bet. Is that ambitious enough for them? Or do they think they automatically deserve to be among the top 8 cos they won the title by some heavenly intervention a couple of years ago? If they just wanna avoid relegation and be around 10th then the same feat they can achieve by going on a 3 or 4 match unbeaten streak and pick up some form eventually. But no, modern fans want to call for the head without digging in with the team in tough times.

Going by that logic, thinking about replacing Koeman with Unsworth is suicidal. I bet he will be gone within the 6 months of his tenure. All his reputation with U23 will be tarnished cos the man has 0 experience managing a 40k stadium, players on huge salaries and transfer fees and keeping up with the PL pressure. Point is, impulsive sackings are not always for the BETTER. If you want to sack a manager, give him reasonable amount of time and then when you do, be 100% sure about the man you want to bring in, back him 100% for a certain period of time (not 4 months or 6 months) to see if he can deliver. And while doing that, the board and DoF which generally hide behind the curtains in tough times need to take some responsibility.

Well said.