Goals on Sunday

ijjysmith · February 7, 2017

ianefc said:
@mikeh72 dont you dare make @ijjysmith physically sick.

To be fair it was more the words of a Jason Derulo fan rather than @mikeh72

MikeH72 · February 7, 2017

ijjysmith said:
To be fair it was more the words of a Jason Derulo fan rather than @mikeh72

Oh god. That's just made me physically sick.

Mikey_Fitzgerald · February 7, 2017

ijjysmith said:
In other news, we'd have lost in Kiev anyway, but he didn't exactly help did he the massive bag of toilet.

I honestly think that if he doesn't play, we go through, or at the very least the game is closer than what it was

ijjysmith · February 7, 2017

Mikey_Fitzgerald said:
I honestly think that if he doesn't play, we go through, or at the very least the game is closer than what it was

I reckon the weaknesses/bottlers would still have been there sadly. But yes, we would have had a much better hope.

ianefc · February 7, 2017

Mikey_Fitzgerald said:
I'm happy to give Martinez credit for the good things he did.

Shouldn't take long.

Gwladysstreetlad · February 7, 2017

evertony said:
He was unable to take a job in that period because he was in a legal 'battle' with his former employer.
I think we can work out you preferred Moyes to Martinez. I preferred the latter to the former.

I'll never understand why anyone would prefer Martinez to Moyes in a million years. Moyes took us from the dross of the 90's and they yearly relegation battles and made us the best of the rest. He built two very good sides during his time here and left players that are still in the squad today. He had a positive impact at this club that lots of people seem to have forgotten, because of the stupid way he handled himself after getting the Utd job. He overstayed his time here by about three years imo and is clearly limited, nevertheless his time here was good for us and he left us in a much better place then we were when he joined us.

Martinez inherited the good side Moyes left us with and after fulking a single good season by shocking club's with new tactics from the old guard reverted to type. Twelve home league wins in two years under the fraud tells its own story. Oh he reached the least sixteen of the Europa League? So what?! Moyes did it to and unlike Martinez we go out in embarrassing style. We reached two semi-finals? Again Moyes did that a few times and even bettered it once. What's that I hear? Something about 72 points?! It was just fifth bottom line and again Moyes did it a few times and bettered it with fourth in 04-05. Moyes only had us finish in the bottom half of the table twice in his 11 full season's here Martinez did that twice in three seasons. None of the above are actual achievements but if your going to compare who's non-achievement is better then Moyes wins hands down.

The bottom line is this, Moyes can here and left us in a healthier position when he left. Martinez came here and left us in a worse position when he left. You do the math on who was better for us.

ianefc · February 7, 2017

Gwladysstreetlad said:
I'll never understand why anyone would prefer Martinez to Moyes in a million years. Moyes took us from the dross of the 90's and they yearly relegation battles and made us the best of the rest. He built two very good sides during his time here and left players that are still in the squad today. He had a positive impact at this club that lots of people seem to have forgotten, because of the stupid way he handled himself after getting the Utd job. He overstayed his time here by three years imo and is clearly limited, nevertheless his time here was good for us and he left us in a much better place then we were when he joined us.

Martinez inherited the good side Moyes left with and after fulking a single good season by shocking club's with new tactics from the old guard reverted to type. Twelve home league wins in two years under the fraud tells its own story. Oh he reached the least sixteen of the Europa League? So what?! Moyes did it to and unlike Martinez we go out in embarrassing style. We reached two semi-finals? Again Moyes did that a few times and even bettered it once. What's that I hear? Something about 72 points?! It was just fifth bottom line and again Moyes did it a few times and bettered it with fourth in 04-05. Moyes only had us finish in the bottom half of the table twice in his 11 full season's here Martinez did that twitch in three seasons. None of the above are actual achievements but if your going to compare who's non-achievement is better then Moyes wins hands down.

The bottom line is this, Moyes can here and left us in a healthier position when he left. Martinez came here and left us in a worse position when he left. You do the math on who was better for us.

I can't see how the bottom paragraph can be argued with.

ianefc · February 7, 2017

ijjysmith said:
To be fair it was more the words of a Jason Derulo fan rather than @mikeh72

Fortunately for us all, Martinez would soon find himself 'Flying solo'

nsno-chris · February 7, 2017

Gwladysstreetlad said:
I'll never understand why anyone would prefer Martinez to Moyes in a million years. Moyes took us from the dross of the 90's and they yearly relegation battles and made us the best of the rest. He built two very good sides during his time here and left players that are still in the squad today. He had a positive impact at this club that lots of people seem to have forgotten, because of the stupid way he handled himself after getting the Utd job. He overstayed his time here by about three years imo and is clearly limited, nevertheless his time here was good for us and he left us in a much better place then we were when he joined us.

Martinez inherited the good side Moyes left us with and after fulking a single good season by shocking club's with new tactics from the old guard reverted to type. Twelve home league wins in two years under the fraud tells its own story. Oh he reached the least sixteen of the Europa League? So what?! Moyes did it to and unlike Martinez we go out in embarrassing style. We reached two semi-finals? Again Moyes did that a few times and even bettered it once. What's that I hear? Something about 72 points?! It was just fifth bottom line and again Moyes did it a few times and bettered it with fourth in 04-05. Moyes only had us finish in the bottom half of the table twice in his 11 full season's here Martinez did that twitch in three seasons. None of the above are actual achievements but if your going to compare who's non-achievement is better then Moyes wins hands down.

The bottom line is this, Moyes can here and left us in a healthier position when he left. Martinez came here and left us in a worse position when he left. You do the math on who was better for us.

Nail, head

Mikey_Fitzgerald · February 7, 2017

ianefc said:
Shouldn't take long.

First season was good

We played some good football for a while there

Winning at Old Trafford

Out playing Arsenal at Goodison

Two semi finals and a Quarter Final

More emphasis put on youth development than under Moyes, with more younger players getting a chance in first team action

Signed Lukaku

Gave John Stones a platform whereby we could sell him for an arse load of money

Had much more ambition than Moyes, always looked up rather than down

Brought Howard Kendall back into the fold whilst there was still time and showed a genuine respect for the clubs history and standing

Of course the negatives eventually outweighed the positives and it was quite right that he got sacked, but I'm not going to pretend he didn't do good things while he was here. I don't hate Martinez in any way, although I'm delighted he no longer manages us because he was taking us in only one direction and it wasn't upward

bicycleheader · February 7, 2017

ianefc said:
I can't see how the bottom paragraph can be argued with.

I don't think the bottom paragraph negates other reasons to prefer one coach over the other.

Not getting into the whole argument and I think they were both ultimately just OK, but a supporter could acknowledge one manager left us in a worse state yet still believe they were better overall?

Mountfield1985 · February 7, 2017

Gwladysstreetlad said:
I'll never understand why anyone would prefer Martinez to Moyes in a million years. Moyes took us from the dross of the 90's and they yearly relegation battles and made us the best of the rest. He built two very good sides during his time here and left players that are still in the squad today. He had a positive impact at this club that lots of people seem to have forgotten, because of the stupid way he handled himself after getting the Utd job. He overstayed his time here by about three years imo and is clearly limited, nevertheless his time here was good for us and he left us in a much better place then we were when he joined us.

Martinez inherited the good side Moyes left us with and after fulking a single good season by shocking club's with new tactics from the old guard reverted to type. Twelve home league wins in two years under the fraud tells its own story. Oh he reached the least sixteen of the Europa League? So what?! Moyes did it to and unlike Martinez we go out in embarrassing style. We reached two semi-finals? Again Moyes did that a few times and even bettered it once. What's that I hear? Something about 72 points?! It was just fifth bottom line and again Moyes did it a few times and bettered it with fourth in 04-05. Moyes only had us finish in the bottom half of the table twice in his 11 full season's here Martinez did that twice in three seasons. None of the above are actual achievements but if your going to compare who's non-achievement is better then Moyes wins hands down.

The bottom line is this, Moyes can here and left us in a healthier position when he left. Martinez came here and left us in a worse position when he left. You do the math on who was better for us.

Arr lad.

It was going so well until you said "math" instead of maths. Unliked.

TheGhostOfBolasie · February 7, 2017

flibbyflob said:
I see your McGeady and raise you Alcaraz.

I genuinely wonder what was going through his head when he took over Everton and decided to make his first signings virtually the complete spine of the Wigan team he'd just relegated.

Robles - Offered nothing for 3 years, is looking decent now however.
Kone - A joke of a signing, nobody wanted him then he got injured to add insult to injury, now we can't even give him away.
Alcaraz - Horrified at the thought of our interest being genuine at the time, then he almost single-handedly knocks us out of the Europa League.
McCarthy - Fair enough was good in first team, average to poor in seasons two and three.

Gwladysstreetlad · February 7, 2017

Mountfield1985 said:
Arr lad.

It was going so well until you said "math" instead of maths. Unliked.

Great post lad, have a like.

On second thoughts, you've typed "Arr" as though it's an actual word. Unliked.

ianefc · February 7, 2017

bicycleheader said:
I don't think the bottom paragraph negates other reasons to prefer one coach over the other.

Not getting into the whole argument and I think they were both ultimately just OK, but a supporter could acknowledge one manager left us in a worse state yet still believe they were better overall?

There is no way that Martinez was better than Moyes, whether it be his average league finish, his highest league finish, his signings overall, his starting position to ending position, how he did with the amout of money annually afforded, combining 'high' league positions and cup runs in the same season and more progress in cups.

Martinez basically added a polished attack whilst Moyes' defence was sensational for him in season 1 (16 clean sheets) the as with Wigan it collapsed.

I genuinely feel that strongly about it, I see it as out of order to label Martinez and Moyes in the same catergory, like you said, they were both 'Ok'