Ronald Koeman discussion

[brieverton]

Oh dear, it sounds like someone is still hurting -

Koeman took a backwards step - Le Tissier
Ahead of Ronald Koeman’s return to Southampton, the views of Southampton legend Matt Le Tissier.

When asked if Koeman was right to swap St Mary’s for Goodison, he said:

I said at the time that I was surprised that he almost made a backwards step. I think it’s going to be tougher for him at Everton than he thought. No disrespect to Everton but I thought he could have got a bigger move given the great work he did at Southampton.

Having said that, I think it would be too early for him to regret moving. There’s still plenty of time for the investment, assuming it is there. You can understand why he went, with there being more money for him to attract players.

I‘d expect them to invest in January and the summer as I think he wanted to assess his squad first. If he doesn’t spend big then I think that might be a sign that he has been sold down the river a bit.

It’s been a decent start but he’s come across plenty of bumps in the road.

Le Tissier is just playing to the gallery there but in all honesty we are ripe to be assessed like that until a decent wedge gets spent on transfers.

He just summarised the current state of flux more or less.

Lots to be proved, both internally and to the world outside.

 

[davek]

Oh dear, it sounds like someone is still hurting -

Koeman took a backwards step - Le Tissier
Ahead of Ronald Koeman’s return to Southampton, the views of Southampton legend Matt Le Tissier.

When asked if Koeman was right to swap St Mary’s for Goodison, he said:

I said at the time that I was surprised that he almost made a backwards step. I think it’s going to be tougher for him at Everton than he thought. No disrespect to Everton but I thought he could have got a bigger move given the great work he did at Southampton.

Having said that, I think it would be too early for him to regret moving. There’s still plenty of time for the investment, assuming it is there. You can understand why he went, with there being more money for him to attract players.

I‘d expect them to invest in January and the summer as I think he wanted to assess his squad first. If he doesn’t spend big then I think that might be a sign that he has been sold down the river a bit.

It’s been a decent start but he’s come across plenty of bumps in the road.

Ha Ha. Backwards step. French-lite tit.

Funnily enough the term 'backward's step' has been knocking about my head - and it's related to my growing conclusion about us bringing him in.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Funnily enough the term 'backward's step' has been knocking about my head - and it's related to my growing conclusion about us bringing him in.

Leave it mate, leave it ffs

lol

 

[Brendan Janus]

Le Tissier is one ugly bugger !!

 

[toffeeblue9]

Ha Ha. Backwards step. French-lite tit.

Funnily enough the term 'backward's step' has been knocking about my head - and it's related to my growing conclusion about us bringing him in.

lol

 

[davek]

We're doing a bit better than the last two seasons.


2016/17
P 12
W 5
D 4
L 3
GF 16
GA 14
POINTS 19
POSITION 7TH

2015/16
P 12
W 4
D 5
L 3
GF 20
GA 16
POINTS 17
POSITION 9TH

2014/15
P 12
W 4
D 5
L 3
GF 22
GA 19
POINTS 17
POSITION 9TH

Benchmark season is 2013/14. I think we should always relate any given season to the one we piled up the most points in.

2013/14
P 12
W 5
D 6
L 1
GF 17
GA 13
POINTS 21
POSITION 7TH

 

[davek]

Leave it mate, leave it ffs

lol

Not having that faux Frenchman have a pop at us.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

Benchmark season is 2013/14. I think we should always relate any given season to the one we piled up the most points in.

2013/14
P 12
W 5
D 6
L 1
GF 17
GA 13
POINTS 21
POSITION 7TH

Laughed a lot at this.

Amazing - last season you constantly, and consistently insisted this season was NEVER the benchmark for Martinez or ANY Everton manager lol

 

[Mountfield1985]

Benchmark season is 2013/14. I think we should always relate any given season to the one we piled up the most points in.

2013/14
P 12
W 5
D 6
L 1
GF 17
GA 13
POINTS 21
POSITION 7TH

Haha no chance Dave. You don't get to set an arbitrary benchmark of Martinez' one good season, just so you can turn around in a few months and say "Look! Koeman is worse than Martinez!"

Martinez inherited a really solid team who finished 6th. Koeman has inherited one of the most unbalanced Everton squads i've ever seen in my lifetime, on the back of two 11th place finishes and the worst home record in our history.

1st season Martinez vs. 1st season Koeman is not a fair comparison.

 

[Blue Cheese]

I feel like I'm going off koeman a little more each day and half the time not his fault, mind you I seem to be falling out of love with football more n more these days.

 

[davek]

Laughed a lot at this.

Amazing - last season you constantly, and consistently insisted this season was NEVER the benchmark for Martinez or ANY Everton manager lol

I cant remember that. Why would I argue that the best season recorded in the PL shouldn't be the one we measure others by?

I always maintain that its importance is that it is there to be surpassed - an incentive that will almost certainly get us a CL position.

 

[caught]

no but it would increase the bill, which in turn would theoretically increase the league placing if statistics are correct.

This is all i'm saying, yes better players get paid more and that is why they finish higher, but the way the argument was presented in the first instance (by zat) was just going by the basic wage bill = success argument. Which i was just suggesting how that isn't true as a ruling.

No mate, because our wage bill might increase in monetary terms but, in your example, would not increase relative to other clubs because we wouldn't be the only club giving salary rises (unless we were insanely stupid).

Player retention through competitive salary increases happens at every club, so to build a hypothetical argument based on it happening at Everton in isolation falls down pretty quickly.

Your point only works in the example of a club that pays above normal market wages to players of lesser ability, which we've seen on occasion (QPR come to mind), which accounts for the imperfect correlation in tables depicting wage-to-league placing. Normally, though, this doesn't happen.

 

[davek]

Haha no chance Dave. You don't get to set an arbitary benchmark of Martinez' one good season, just so you can turn around in a few months and say "Look! Koeman is worse than Martinez!"

Martinez inherited a really solid team who finished 6th. Koeman has inherited one of the most unbalanced Everton squads i've ever seen in my lifetime, on the back of two 11th place finishes and the worst home record in our history.

1st season Martinez vs. 1st season Koeman is not a fair comparison.

Mate, do you really think that I felt Koeman surpassing 72 points was ever a serious proposition? There's no way he could do it. First of all: yes, morale had to be rebuilt. Second (and more importantly) you have to have a managerial mindset that goes for three points week in week out...and that isn't Koeman - just as it wasn't Moyes.

I've said before that realistically that mark wont be hit again until we have an owner who'll throw another £100M at the first team squad.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

I cant remember that.

Really mate?

Really?...

Why would I argue that the best season recorded in the PL shouldn't be the one we measure others by?

Exactly. That's what loads on here were bemused at when you did nothing but harp on about Martinez being judged unfairly on his debut season - a one off you said.

Now, here you are advocating that season as the benchmark for Koeman.

Quick reminder;

I said 60 points should be the realistic target, which it was.

72 points should never be our benchmark. It was an insane performance and never to be repeated until we get mega cash in.

Yes, I do. What I dont appreciate is the belief that a season that has us at midtable and doing very nicely in both cup competitions is evidence that this manager has to go.

Now if that isn't entitlement, I dont know what is.

I repeat an obvious and inconvenient truth on this issue: Martinez is being asked on here to get over a massively higher bar than any other Everton manager that we we've had for decades in order to maintain his position.

It's not on and I doubt very much whether anyone in a decision making capacity at Goodison feels it is either. The twitters and bloggers (who went missing after the Chelsea game) and the numb nuts 'media experts' looking to make a few quid with a controversial statement on our manager (dossers that they are) are irrelevant.

 

[caught]

wow