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Alan Whittle
Player Valuation: £70m
True dat.
Barnfred 55
Player Valuation: £80m
In order.
1. Hazard
2. Pedro
3. Costa
4. The whole Everton team
5. Koeman
Yes we were poor. A bad day at the office I hope. But that Chelsea performance was the best I have seen against Everton by any team in recent years. They would have wiped the floor with anyone yesterday.
Heres the reality of the situation. Man for man they have better players than us all over the park. Yesterday their players to a man performed at the top of their game. 3 or 4 were unplayable. Ours did not. They also showed much more desire. Had our players performed better and shown the same desire we would still have liost 3/4.
I actually believe our performances against them last season hurt them more than we realised and yesterday exorcised a few demons for them. Lets hope we are good enough to return the compliment at home.
Blue Cheese
Mental Patient, GOT Ward
Although, I realise people can and do go overboard after a defeat. When you concede 5 the 'brain dead' as you call them have every right to be upset. Why if you cared about your club would you not be bothered about getting trounced 5-0.
Honestly, I'd be shocked if you're not arsed to be honest. Chelsea were excellent , so what, 5 goals conceded is unacceptable against anybody. So go and happy clap down your local sunday league; let us brain dead give a shiz.
Please consider the context: my post was in direct response to a forum member who did not want Martinez sacked because he thought the fraud was a good manager, and thinks Koeman is a lesser manager despite having a better managerial record elsewhere and better results with us.
You are quite right to say yesterday was a poor showing all round, and that our early-season spurt seems to have stalled. I wasn't suggesting Martinez is a viable yardstick, I was pointing out that some of the anti-Koeman platoon are simply just blindly pro-Martinez.
Mr Cheese, I am upset, but knee jerk reactions never help, we have FFS a Koeman out thread already, this is what I believe is brain dead.
Every manager gets it seriously wrong, which we certainly did and like you I was cheesed off with the players, but it certainly shows we need to re build and clear out and re invest.
This season and probably next will see a overhaul of the whole squad, starting in January, and I am also sure Koeman will get it wrong again during the rebuild.
Now we need to regroup and put this behind us and get behind what we have at the moment, the next six games are huge and having the boo boys take over certainly won't be the 12 th man for the players..
Blue Cheese
Mental Patient, GOT Ward
You only need see who started the thread to know it's fishing haha, you have been here long enough now.
Personally, you may have noticed but I don't deal with defeat very well, that isn't to say I can't see the bigger picture but by god I will fume over a defeat, it's in my genes.
It's going to be a long haul but lying down and rolling over for the big boys, no, i can't be having that, it's embarrassing.
GwladysBlue
Player Valuation: £70m
24 seconds between their first two goals and that's from an Everton kick off.
The mentality of this squad is a disgrace.
Moyes' drummed it into some of these bottlers that we're not meant to compete with these teams and it has stuck.
The mentality of this squad is a disgrace.
Moyes' drummed it into some of these bottlers that we're not meant to compete with these teams and it has stuck.
I like you don't take defeat well at all, but what would be worse is if he doesn't learn from this huge screw up, as I said the next six games are huge.
One thing he does need to take on board fast is where previous managers have fell over and continue to play out of form players, as soon as I seen Jags back in the team I knew it wasn't going to be a good day as he has lost his confidence at the moment and is a liability.
I think it was @Zatara who brought this up, don't normally agree with the lad but this time I think he was 100% spot on.
Yes it was a good performance by Chelsea as it was by Man City against us. How much of that is down to how easy it is to play against us with our set ups in the said matches.. We didn't press as a team because we don't know how to. With only a few players pressing and the others sitting behind the ball can actually be detrimental by allowing more space for the opposition. Our players can't seem to grasp the full concept of pressing and are use to sitting and jockeying. Better teams will batter us as they have players to move the ball quicker and into the spaces vacated by our poor pressing. We are shooting ourselves in the foot with poor pressing and making the better teams look like they are playing the game of there lives while in reality we are helping them look good.
Gladystweet
Player Valuation: £50m
I blame it on the......
We share where we are because of the Board, they picked the last managers, they allowed them to bring in the players we now have.
Moyes gave us limited success without any actual success, if you understand me. We got complacent and accepting that we were competing in the "middle league" of the Premiership.
They brought in Martinez and the first season dazzled them, but they then presided over a significant decline in everything at the club. The two 11th place finishes flattered us.
Hopefully bringing in Moshiri and Koeman is the start of the road back, but if anyone thinks we can go from the level to which we have sunk to be top 4/5 then I believe they are being unrealistic at best.
We need a complete overhaul, we have players in our squad who aren't good enough for the Premier League let alone good enough to compete. We need 5/6 players who can play to a system of the managers choosing.
I am happy with Koeman at the moment, I think he is what we need for now. He needs time to bring in the players who can play the game he wants to play. He inherited a squad of average wingers.
I do have one niggling doubt in regard to his decision making and that is he decided to come here in the first place. Unless he was promised the funds to put things right. As with all Evertonians, I live in hope.
Moyes gave us limited success without any actual success, if you understand me. We got complacent and accepting that we were competing in the "middle league" of the Premiership.
They brought in Martinez and the first season dazzled them, but they then presided over a significant decline in everything at the club. The two 11th place finishes flattered us.
Hopefully bringing in Moshiri and Koeman is the start of the road back, but if anyone thinks we can go from the level to which we have sunk to be top 4/5 then I believe they are being unrealistic at best.
We need a complete overhaul, we have players in our squad who aren't good enough for the Premier League let alone good enough to compete. We need 5/6 players who can play to a system of the managers choosing.
I am happy with Koeman at the moment, I think he is what we need for now. He needs time to bring in the players who can play the game he wants to play. He inherited a squad of average wingers.
I do have one niggling doubt in regard to his decision making and that is he decided to come here in the first place. Unless he was promised the funds to put things right. As with all Evertonians, I live in hope.
Barnfred 55
Player Valuation: £80m
Agree on the pressing mate. If you want to know how to press a team then watch Chelsea yesterday. they did it to perfection and high up the pitch too.
I knew we were going to struggle yesterday as soon as Geuye was ruled out, and having both McCarthy and Besic injured didn't help. Also, as soon as Koeman decided to go with 3 at the back (actually 5 at the back) we were always going to be doing the pressing too close to our own box in my opinion. I think individually, the players did give it a go. In particular both Ross and Cleverly were running around like headless chickens for the whole game. But there didn't seem to be any structure or pattern to the pressing. Compare that with Chelsea who seemed to hunt in packs. I know this pressing game is still a work in progress for us, but it is becoming extremely worrying how long it is taking for Koeman to get his message across. As mentioned, it didn't help that our 3 best exponents weren't available yesterday. I hope he manages to get it sorted before the derby because if he doesn't, that could turn into another embarrassment.
Having said that I still think you saying Chelsea put in a good performance is doing them a disservice. As good as City were the other week this was much superior. Sometimes we are too caught up in our own team, understandably, that we don't give the opposition enough credit. I remember watching Arsenal against Barca in the knockout stages of last seasons Champions league. They lost 5-1 on aggregate and, as a neutral, I actually thought Arsenal put up a good show in each game. But they came up against 3 of the 5 best players in the world and, as a group, Messi, Neymar and Suarez were amazing in those two games. I remember Arsenal fans being extremely critical of their team at the time and I'm thinking, what the heck can you do against that? You just have to accept that there's a gulf between the teams.
I felt the same watching us yesterday. Everything their front 3 tried came off. That tit Luis was splaying balls out of defence that Koeman in his day would have been proud of, and I don't think I've seen a better full back display than Alonso's in many a year. I don't think that carthorse Cahill lost a single 1-1 challenge against Rom. If that had been the other way around we would have been praising Williams, not saying Costa was poor.
As a fan I was both embarrassed and angry watching that performance yesterday. To a man, we were poor, but Chelsea were every bit as excellent as we were poor. I don't agree with everything Koeman says but his assessment yesterday was spot on; the only positive we can take from the game was that there were only 3 points at stake.
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