ijjysmith
Calm
Oh, I don't disagree (a rarity for you and me!), but deep down do you actually think Roberto will be sacked before the end of the season?
Not that you think he should. DO you think he will be? By our board?
Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)
- Thread starter Fat Stan
- Start date
- Status
Oh, I don't disagree (a rarity for you and me!), but deep down do you actually think Roberto will be sacked before the end of the season?
Not that you think he should. DO you think he will be? By our board?
bluewally
Player Valuation: £8m
So United were terrible and beat us but we deserved to win.
I really shudder when I see what is considered a good performance after 2 years of Bobby managing expectations downwards
F
Ferdia Holland
Guest
Totally understand, sorry about that.
II McColl II
Player Valuation: £6m
hanging on to whatever slither of hope he has left, he knows its only a matter of time till media scrutiny follows the fan scrutiny and he will be out on his arse. This is a clear attempt of getting players in line and passing blame on to them on the pitch.
Making a player apologise for something that was "misinterpreted" is not only wrong but wreaks of what baines said was true otherwise he wouldnt force an apology.
Making a player apologise for something that was "misinterpreted" is not only wrong but wreaks of what baines said was true otherwise he wouldnt force an apology.
bluewally
Player Valuation: £8m
And so out of character with the past 2 seasons and the matches since that you'd have to say the players took control.
kithnou
Player Valuation: £70m
Final few lines say it all...http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/spor...leighton-baines-wasnt-misinterpreted-11151658
Everton's Leighton Baines wasn't misinterpreted and shouldn't apologise as Martinez plays the blame game
David Prentice on why Roberto Martinez is wrong to point the finger at Leighton Baines and the Echo
- 12:05, 7 APR 2016
- BY DAVID PRENTICE
Roberto Martinez speaks to Leighton Baines.
Roberto Martinez has blamed referees this season, he has blamed bad luck and he has blamed his players – now it appears to be our turn.
Leighton Baines delivered a typically honest assessment of Everton's insipid defeat at Old Trafford on Sunday .
“I just don't feel as though the chemistry is quite there with the team on the pitch at the moment, and it hasn't been for a while,” he said.
The Echo's headline was hardly misleading: “Chemistry not there – and hasn't been for a while.”
Baines added: “We are maybe leaning too heavily on individuals to come up with something.
“We're in games, we were in the game on Sunday and had a couple of chances, but we're not performing as a team to the level we know we can or we should be. Results have an impact on that because chemistry and confidence go hand in hand.
“Look at the teams who are having success this year and you'd say they have chemistry.
“If I had to say one thing, I just don't know if it's there with us at the moment, for whatever reasons.”
The comments weren't analysed. They weren't “interpreted” by us. They were delivered as an accurate representation of an honest footballer's thoughts following another disappointing defeat.
Yet Roberto Martinez declared today that Leighton Baines has been “misinterpreted” – and has “apologised”.
Leighton Baines in action at Old Trafford
These are Martinez's words – produced verbatim to avoid confusion
“I think there are two aspects of that. First it's very disappointing when you see a misinterpretation of certain words that a player says and really this has been taken out of context in the way that it's come out.
“And the other aspect is that someone of the experience of Leighton Baines knows he has to take responsibility for those words – I have had a chat with him – those words have given the opportunity to be maybe attracting a meaning that is not right, not correct and obviously for that he has apologised and taken responsibility for that for leaving those words open.
“But that's what we expect from a senior figure at Everton, we expect him to take responsibility, to make sure that we speak on the pitch and the way to do that is against Watford.
“I wouldn't say we rely on one or two individuals, I think the way we are as a team we rely on the technical ability of the whole team, the way that we can get high up the pitch and create chances.
"The place to talk is on the pitch" - Martinez
"I don't think we are a team that relies on one or two individuals. Of course we rely on individuals because the team is made of individuals and we have 15 or 16 individuals who have had impressive campaigns, probably the best campaigns of their young careers in some cases.
Roberto Martinez (R) Manager of Everton passes the ball to Leighton Baines (L) at Carrow Road
“But those quotes have been taken out of context and that's disappointing on one side but on the other side obviously Leighton takes responsibility for putting himself in a position which has given the wrong words and allowed the wrong interpretation and for that, as I said, he has apologised and is ready to move forward. And as any senior player the place to talk is on the pitch.”
So what was the “misinterpretation?”
Clearly a lack of “chemistry” amongst a group of players reflects badly on a manager.
"Is there chemistry? If so it's not being reflected on the pitch" - Prentice
Did Baines choose the wrong word? If so, he did so three times.
Did we “misinterpret” Baines? Have our readers “misinterpreted” Baines' meaning?
Or is Roberto Martinez seeking another avenue to apportion blame?
Is there chemistry on the pitch? If so it is not being reflected in Premier League results.
Leighton Baines
So many questions, but we can safely assume that Leighton Baines will probably not be made available for interview to answer them on Saturday at Vicarage Road.
Martinez added: “We have a very close group. We know each other. We have been through many many situations over the years now. We are developing a really strong mentality and I don't think that's going to be tested by comments in the outside.
“We are always quite open and always very clear but it's important for our fans more than anything to understand that certain words can be taken out of context.
Leighton Baines and Aaron Lennon come out for the warm up before the Premier League match between Manchester United
"In the same way that Leighton has apologized for leaving that open and the fans know that an outstanding group of top ambassadors for our football club are not performing well or getting the results for this football club and that's something we want to change quickly.”
So what was the actual “context” Baines' words were taken out of?
Everton correspondent Phil Kirkbride spoke to Baines in a tunnel at Old Trafford.
He asked: “Is it difficult not just to look at the semi-final as the season now and is it difficult to, I don't want to say is it difficult to motivate yourselves for league games, but the season is effectively the semi now isn't it?
Everton's Leighton Baines
Baines replied: “It is yeah, but the motivation should be in trying to get your name there for it, shouldn't it? It's like (pause of several seconds), I just think, you know, I don't know, I just don't feel like the chemistry is quite there on the pitch within the team at the moment and it hasn't been for a while. We are sort of leaning maybe a bit too heavily on individuals to come up with something.
“We're in games. We were in the game all the time today and had a couple of chances but we're not performing as a team to the level we know we can or we should be.”
Phil then added: “Talking about chemistry do you sense that around in the week or is it just when you get on the pitch recently it's just not clicking?”
Leighton Baines: always honest and candid
Baines added: “I think it's the start and obviously results have an impact on that because chemistry and confidence can go hand in hand in a way. You start winning games. I mean look at the teams who are having success this year. You would say they've got chemistry, you know?
“If I had to say one thing it would be, I don't know if it's there at the moment for whatever reason.”
All commendably honest and candid. All accurately reported.
Yet Baines, we are told, has apologised.
That's disappointing. Baines has been “misinterpreted” before. A typically honest interview he gave cost him his place at a World Cup in South Africa.
But we don't believe he has been on this occasion.
Has Romelu Lukaku been made to apologise?
Perhaps there should have been other apologies forthcoming.
From Romelu Lukaku for undermining his team-mates by saying “it would be nice to play in the Champions League from next season.” Clearly that won't be with Everton.
From Roberto Martinez for the worst run of home results in living memory.
Or is it, as often seems to be the case from managers under pressure, someone else's fault?
"Perhaps there should have been other apologies forthcoming.
From Romelu Lukaku for undermining his team-mates by saying “it would be nice to play in the Champions League from next season.” Clearly that won't be with Everton.
From Roberto Martinez for the worst run of home results in living memory.
Or is it, as often seems to be the case from managers under pressure, someone else's fault?"
The Esk
Player Valuation: £70m
No problem mate. Post lots and enjoy your time here
F
Ferdia Holland
Guest
I never said it was a good performance, i said it wasn't a terrible one, but in my opinion it should have been enough to win that game. Jags hit the crossbar, and hit his shot straight at De Gea, Lukaku was an inch from tapping the ball home, we could have gotten 3 goals easily from them and had we scored them, then would you have been saying it was a terrible performance? Winning 3-1 in Manchester?
kithnou
Player Valuation: £70m
I'll just go to bed then
AndyC
Player Valuation: £70m
Steve, I kind of get your point, but would suggest this...
The manager, whoever he/she might be is employed to manage a team, a group, a collective with the aim of scoring goals, not conceding goals, hopefully winning more games that he/she loses and aiming to win trophies and put smiles on the faces of his employers and the clubs supporters.
Supporters are individuals, lots of them I'll grant you that, but we are all individuals. We pay for the privilege of watching our heroes play and hopefully accomplish the primary aim of the club - to win... and paying customers have the right to complain when things go wrong just as much as a duty/obligation to applaud when things go right.
Nobody would argue that at times, going forward, we look scarily good, at times breathtaking as the first half away at Norwich clearly showed.
Nobody though could surely argue that defensively, we've largely been poor since the opening day of the season and the capitulation against West Ham and the non-performance vs Arsenal were just about the straws that have broken many camels backs.
The managers use of substitutions, have at times, been almost as baffling as the apparent lack of communication and cohesiveness within the defence.
What it boils down to in answer to your question is... I'd defy anyone to 'manage circa 35,000 supporters" and attempt to dismiss/sack us... whereas a person employed to be a manager who fails to manage in a business littered with failed managers getting sacked certainly should not be surprised that the failings of almost two complete seasons are being dissected by those who pay.
Last edited:
The words Baines actually said, which he has now quoted here were meant as an honest interpretation of how things can improve. I'd agree with him. The tone of the headlines and the presentation implied more to fit into a mood and to gather more attention to their rag.
I can easily see Baines then taking it upon himself to apologise and mean it, whether to the whole team or not.
Only then fair that to answer a question about it Martinez explains what has happened rather than fuel it further.
Maybe naive on his part with this atmosphere but still a reasonable approach.
You don't all have to consistently look for issues to make your points surely. And as someone who is on the fence it makes me less inclined to listen
F
Ferdia Holland
Guest
I wouldn't disagree with that, the manager can say whatever he wants before a game, but that hunger the players showed in the Chelsea game comes from within, you have to want it. All I can say is I hope these cup performances continue. I'd take 10th place, and an FA Cup as a decent season, something we can work on.
- Status
Welcome
Join Grand Old Team to get involved in the Everton discussion. Signing up is quick, easy, and completely free.
Shop
