Roberto Martinez discussion

davek · January 21, 2016

AaronTheBlue said:
But there is something structurally unsound with how he manages his side defensively, and his refusal to drop a goalkeeper due to personal affection.

But you've seen the defensive improvement against Spurs and Man City (in two games against them). Then individual error's against Chelsea (Jagielka/Howard, a fluke deflection and a linesman error) intervened.

It's nuts to read off the last game and say the lessons recently learned have been lost.

Kev The Rat · January 21, 2016

Byram has come out and said that Bilic was a big reason that he signed for West Ham - what does that say about Martinez? I keep saying that he only appears to be able to sign players he has either worked with or had on loan (Besic and Mori aside)

MikeH72 · January 21, 2016

davek said:
He sees it. I dont think right now he's prepared to deal with it. Which is a fault, obvioulsy. But it's not the same as saying something is seriously out of whack with the team.

But surely he would have seen it last season as well, and actually the previous two years as that waste of space in goal has been crap for so long now? If he saw it last year, why didn't he try to fix it in the summer?

It does make me start to question whether RM is intimidated by Howard's ego and personality in the dressing room. He's self-styled himself as some sort of Everton icon, and he'd kick up a massive stink if he was dropped. What an odious tit, seriously. Proper boils my urine thinking about him

craigw · January 21, 2016

I wanted him gone big time a few months ago. But accepted him because I knew we would not sack him. I have come around quite a bit. I still find a few of his ways annoying. He will never win me around totally. He has done a number of good things. Signings. And there are much worse managers in the PL.

Minimeister · January 21, 2016

Kev The Rat said:
Byram has come out and said that Bilic was a big reason that he signed for West Ham - what does that say about Martinez? I keep saying that he only appears to be able to sign players he has either worked with or had on loan (Besic and Mori aside)

Do you actually like any part of our club whatsoever? You are by the far the most negative poster I have ever seen on any forum anywhere. If you're not having a go at the club you're liking posts off others having a go at the club. It's embarrassing to be fair but I guess that kind of posting is allowed like. *Ignore*

davek · January 21, 2016

mikeh72 said:
But surely he would have seen it last season as well, and actually the previous two years as that waste of space in goal has been crap for so long now? If he saw it last year, why didn't he try to fix it in the summer?

It does make me start to question whether RM is intimidated by Howard's ego and personality in the dressing room. He's self-styled himself as some sort of Everton icon, and he'd kick up a massive stink if he was dropped. What an odious tit, seriously. Proper boils my urine thinking about him

That's not true though. Howard was still performing well intermittently last season. This season he's been alarmingly bad consistently.

I agree on the team politics stuff though. Martinez has to bite the bullet in the summer and get him out.

ijjysmith · January 21, 2016

Kev The Rat said:
Byram has come out and said that Bilic was a big reason that he signed for West Ham - what does that say about Martinez? I keep saying that he only appears to be able to sign players he has either worked with or had on loan (Besic and Mori aside)

That doesn't really make sense though does it? If he's worked with them then they clearly like him to have come in the first place. Same with the loans.

Really reckon you're making too much out of missing a championship right back who'd never have played for us anyway.

MikeH72 · January 21, 2016

davek said:
That's not true though. Howard was still performing well intermittently last season. This season he's been alarmingly bad consistently.

I agree on the team politics stuff though. Martinez has to bite the bullet in the summer and get him out.

Was he? Are you sure about that? Because apart from Wolfsburg at the start of the season, I can't actually think of another good game he had. By all accounts, last season was probably his worst for us, he should have been leathered into touch last summer

LouReedwalkonthewildside · January 21, 2016

Kev The Rat said:
I keep saying that he only appears to be able to sign players he has either worked with or had on loan

Don't really see what point your trying to make here.

davek · January 21, 2016

mikeh72 said:
Was he? Are you sure about that? Because apart from Wolfsburg at the start of the season, I can't actually think of another good game he had. By all accounts, last season was probably his worst for us, he should have been leathered into touch last summer

He was injured at Christmas last season and we went into a dive results wise. He returned in late February and it coincided with us getting back on track a bit.

There was nothing there that suggested he was the answer to our problems, but less to suggest Robles was too. We did very well in the Spring and that took the emphasis off the GK situation. It's come back with a vengeance now though, and Robles is a better choice now.

chippy1722 · January 21, 2016

We have no idea how things are going to go. i understand people see some of the football we play and the squad we have and are optimistic of the future, people expect things to suddenly click and we rise up the league.
I don't like it when I read the old Phil Neville/Jagielka rallying cry after a draw/defeat, as if suddenly we will start winning.

We had a very good first season under Martinez, an average second, and now league wise an average third season, for me, we are where we are and apart from maybe getting around 8th I don't expect it too change, the last season and a half puts us around 8-12th, its not a bad run, its a lot of games and the points/place speak for themselves.

I do have hope that things will change but it's not a right we have over the other teams around us, people expect us to win and the teams above us to drop points, what if they improve their squad, sort out the mistakes they make and improve or stay where they are too.

MikeH72 · January 21, 2016

davek said:
He was injured at Christmas last season and we went into a dive results wise. He returned in late February and it coincided with us getting back on track a bit.

There was nothing there that suggested he was the answer to our problems, but less to suggest Robles was too. We did very well in the Spring and that took the emphasis off the GK situation. It's come back with a vengeance now though, and Robles is a better choice now.

But we were already playing crap and he was costing us points, that Palace game where he jumped about a foot wide of the ball and let Campbell score a header, that Hull home game when he got beat at his near post. The upturn in form was nothing to do with Howard, he didn't win us any of those points with his saves when we happened to be under the cosh. I'd have remembered it.

Anyway, in the summer he simply HAS to bring a new keeper in. A new number 1 keeper, and shunt this star jumping quilt out the door. If he doesn't, then a lot of people will start to lose faith in him

Ihaters · January 21, 2016

chippy1722 said:
We have no idea how things are going to go. i understand people see some of the football we play and the squad we have and are optimistic of the future, people expect things to suddenly click and we rise up the league.
I don't like it when I read the old Phil Neville/Jagielka rallying cry after a draw/defeat, as if suddenly we will start winning.

We had a very good first season under Martinez, an average second, and now league wise an average third season, for me, we are where we are and apart from maybe getting around 8th I don't expect it too change, the last season and a half puts us around 8-12th, its not a bad run, its a lot of games and the points/place speak for themselves.

I do have hope that things will change but it's not a right we have over the other teams around us, people expect us to win and the teams above us to drop points, what if they improve their squad, sort out the mistakes they make and improve or stay where they are too.

Agree with most of that, but 11th is not average.. 5th to 8th was average, anything else is a drop to below average and the points/places do indeed speak for themselves.

bicycleheader · January 21, 2016

TheHumbleEgg said:
It's been suggested that he needs to address the GK situation, yes? He was looking to do that 1 year ago. Apols, I shudda just posted the link, the quotes read kinda vague.

My point being if it was an issue then and remains so now, why?

yeah, its just i dont think the quotes do say he was looking at the keeper situation. thats not how id read them

davek · January 21, 2016

Ihaters said:
Agree with most of that, but 11th is not average.. 5th to 8th was average, anything else is a drop to below average and the points/places do indeed speak for themselves.

How is 11th in a table of 20 not average?

We all agreed that Everton getting 6th/7th/8th was punching above our weight. Now it seems it's 'average'.

There's some massive shifting about of goalposts to suit here.