Roberto Martinez discussion

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davek said:
Where did I call it an achievement?

It's a level of attacking play that we haven't seen at Goodison since Kendall was here first time around. Am I wrong in that assertion? If I am, I'd like you to point to another manager who's had us playing such attractive football.
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Is that 'attacking/attractive football' bringing results?

No.

Does it look like bringing results anytime soon, going on our last 6-7 games?

No.

I'm not remotely arsed about the plaudits you seem to desperately crave. We had that under Kendall v2.

I'd much rather we were George Graham's (Boring, boring) arsenal & winning a few matches with our defender's arms almost permanently raised, than RM's Everton - getting beat at home by the likes of loysturr & stoke, but having nice things said about our approach.

Bollocks to what others think of us or our football, the overwhelming majority of us demand results. RM's football isn't bringing us that many, is it?

And that's the bottom line.
 
davek said:
Yes, and on that point it's clear for anyone not swayed and buffeted off course by the odd strong wind that we are playing at a level of football unimaginable when Moyes was here and in a style that, if persevered with and strengthened, can bear fruit. Moyes was here for 11 seasons; Martinez has been here 2 and a half. Martinez has done things for this club Moyes could never have done if he'd been here 20 years.

Anyone seriously comparing Moyes favourably with Martinez needs locking up for their own good. They dont have a clue.
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The Lady doth protest too much, methinks.
 

neil999 said:
if we get a new keeper in jan, would those wanting Martinez gone give him a chance to see what difference it makes?
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i would give him this month to sort himself out tactics/ keeper wise, and see if he can bring anybody in, because we not far off being half decent, if he continues in the same way and is stubborn and sits on his hands and carries on the same way , i will want him gone at the end of the season.
 
Barratt makes a good point in the times today

9 off 4th, 9 off the relegation spots

Crossroads

Season is certainly not over, but recalibration needed. Overcoming 9 points to 4th is not impossible but it means hard decisions need to be taken. Maybe not be everyone's favourite team but with rom running at people we will score
 
orly said:
More absolute drivel.

I've already explained the tosh about the attendances in another thread. It's utter bilge.

The united game was 4 December 2013 - over two years ago. Even you can see we've gone backwards since then. And what makes this example even funnier is you've shown us the last time we've beaten a top side away. He's going to have to break his run spectacularly to beat City in the semi.

Moyes wouldn't have done it away at a big side like Martinez vs United?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/9307308.stm

Here's where we win 2-1 away at a City side with Tevez and Yaya Toure. He brings Saha on for Coleman in the 79th minute. Anichebe got sent off around the hour mark. But if you know your history, hey.

Couldn't beat the worse RS side since the 60s? The Hodgson side was laughably bad. You must have had your hands over your eyes when we've been beaten two years on the trot at home to Palace... and Stoke... Cracking draw down at Norwich though.



Oh really? I wouldn't look at his years at Wigan or the last 18 months here then, save yourself some disappointment.

Here's the season where, shock of shocks, we managed to play european football and not finish bottom half

5 Everton 38 19 8 11 55 33 +22 65

So that's a total of six less goals scored and six less conceded (and seven points less) than the Halewood Globetrotters team you're still holding wistfully onto. We also managed the semi-final of the league cup (this season's highpoint so far) and last 16 in Europe. Out first round to Oldham the blot on the copybook. But hey, you're right, Moyes never really went for it.


The last few years of Moyes' reign were a miserable time - not necessarily because of results, more a bad combination of beauts like him, Steve Round and Phil Neville being in it for their own self-aggrandisement. He'd given up caring.



Jesus absolute wept. If the players are going to coach themselves better, what on earth are we employing him for? Oh yes that's right, so we can fete him over the goals scored chart.



Martinez hasn't won at Chelsea, had us 4-0 down after 50 minutes against Liverpool and hasn't won at Arsenal. His away record against the so-called 'big sides' [spit] is weighted very, very heavily on that United result.



And yet, remarkably, you've forgotten how bad it was for most of last season, particularly the bit where we managed 21 points from 19 games. Look at this corker of a run

20/12/2014 15:00 A Southampton FC 0:3 (0:1)
26/12/2014 15:00 H Stoke City 0:1 (0:1)
28/12/2014 16:15 A Newcastle United 2:3 (1:1)
01/01/2015 15:00 A Hull City 0:2 (0:2)

We played some cracking football in those four. There's also a sublime midseason run where we manage 3 wins in 18 games.
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Haha. I never knew Moyes was so good. Bad me. Arsenal 6-2 defeat at home. Cracker that was. Oh and let's not forget the 4-0 defeat by Bolton. Yes yard dog Nolan being made to look like a proper footballer. Let's never forget the crap LFC team that defeated us at Wembley after we took the lead and did what? Hold on to what we had and defend. That worked a treat didn't it. The organisation that day at a free kick was so good they never scored. Oh wait they did. Oh and Distin's panicked at the sight of Suarez and 'lost it' and tried a terrible back pass - great craft on the ball instilled in a player by Moyes. I think I'm warming to this great defensive coach Moyes.

Jesus wept. I'm going to have to look at those stats again I must have missed the bag full of trophies Moyes won. Oh and the 5-0 away defeat at Benfica and the 5-1 defeat at Bucharest after taking the lead. He didn't have a clue what to do when they scored. Yes we also had some good results in Europe.

You may not have read this Romelu Lukaku trained up to three hours a day during ...

Lukaku alongside the coaching staff worked on his game during the summer. Dock Martinez some wages. Lukakau should be doing that should he? He should only do it with permission from the manager. Beckham practised on his own as did Georgie Best. They had the desire to improve. But no, not for you, such initiative. To quote, "If the players are going to coach themselves better, what on earth are we employing him for", Bad Georgie for wanting to use your own initiative and get better. And become one of the greatest footballers that graced the bogs of pitches in the 60s and 70s. By the way Delofeu's improvement - nothing to do with his own desire to get better. And nothing to do with Martinez I suppose.

Get players like that who don't want to work on their game on their own initiative and you get players that can't think for themselves and solve problems on the pitch. In fact that would my criticism of our players, not reading the game and changing. But we haven't got a Howie kendall or a Peter Reid/Ratcliffe.

I will repeat for you. Moyes held this club back and didn't achieve as much as he should have with the squad and the resources at his disposal. A sign of which was the pathetic rolling over/never turning up at Arsenal/Manu/LFC and Chelsea. Instil fears/negativity into players heads and they will react like rabbits in the headlights. Oh and for every City victory there is a defeat. The Balotelli one when 10 behind the ball and hope for the best. Ok until 20 minutes to go and then bang 2-0 defeat. Really loved those away days.

Barkley is a prime example of a player that has improved so much because of Martinez and his beliefs.

I for one, like the thousands of Evertonians that have either returned to the fold or are new supporters - something you pooh pooh - can't wait for the next game. Anticipation of watching an Everton team managed by a manger that is trying to return us to some semblance of the school of science way of playing football.
 

edge said:
i would give him this month to sort himself out tactics/ keeper wise, and see if he can bring anybody in, because we not far off being half decent, if he continues in the same way and is stubborn and sits on his hands and carries on the same way , i will want him gone at the end of the season.
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This.

RM is a half-match manager. One thing you could say about moyles @davek , is that he more often than not got us going after Christmas, so in essence was a half-season manager.

Will RM?

If RM doesn't improve results between now & the end of the season then you'll have no defence left for him whatsoever. Not that there's much for you to defend the now, like.

Oh, and a cup final isn't anywhere's near enough, neither. Trophy (Preferably the FA) and a minimum of 6th, or I hope he's gone in May.
 

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