Roberto Martinez discussion

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If any player wants to leave then its up to the manager. Why not look at the positives that this summer he has a chance to punt 5 of Moyes signings and this jan 3 more...

Get them off the wage bill and make the squad more of his own...

@davek do you think Galloway is ready now at left back to play consistently? I think he still needs to be put in and taken out to build his experience myself with a game at CB in the cup and a couple more end of the season (as he got a LB last season) to see if he can be considered 4th choice CB next season.

As for silverware, im torn between a cup and top 4. Cup would be brilliant of course but top 4 would really take us to a new level...do i think we will get either, not likely but in 2 seasons id expect to be challenging for both.


Del-boy said:
The issue is though will these young talented players hang around for a few more seasons till roberto gets it right?

Of course they won't, then we are back to square one.
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Martinez choosing to start Howard every game is wasting any chance we have to do something with the young talent in this squad while they're still here.
 
Lowste said:
Our jewels may move on, but sadly for a club like us that is inevitable.
We have players to cover the losses of Stones, McCarthy we will struggle with the loss of Lukaku...saying that people said that with Linekar, and the following season we won the league.
Over the favourites I guess you mean Howard, I wouldn't disagree. If you mean Barry at this moment there is no better than him.
Tiredness unsure over this as we have scored a fair few late goals and always look like having enough at the end of games to get something
Over getting the best out of the players, if honest I think people think the players we have our better than they actually are. I will say they have potential, but we need to be careful that we build this team up as something it isn't.
This isn't jumping on the defending RM boast, simply what I see...I guess you will say I as blind as a bat
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The condition of the club when Lineker was moved on by the manager is a whole lot different to the condition if Lukaku pushes for a move against the managers will to lose him mate.
 
Del-boy said:
The issue is though will these young talented players hang around for a few more seasons till roberto gets it right?

Of course they won't, then we are back to square one.
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Even if we got into the CL they would be off, simply as the clubs these are destined for override any of what we could ever offer
 
It would be a massive blow. However same as Linekar it would be an enormous fee and the manager could continue his rebuilding process.

bluestevon said:
The condition of the club when Lineker was moved on by the manager is a whole lot different to the condition if Lukaku pushes for a move against the managers will to lose him mate.
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Lowste said:
Our jewels may move on, but sadly for a club like us that is inevitable.
We have players to cover the losses of Stones, McCarthy we will struggle with the loss of Lukaku...saying that people said that with Linekar, and the following season we won the league.
Over the favourites I guess you mean Howard, I wouldn't disagree. If you mean Barry at this moment there is no better than him.
Tiredness unsure over this as we have scored a fair few late goals and always look like having enough at the end of games to get something
Over getting the best out of the players, if honest I think people think the players we have our better than they actually are. I will say they have potential, but we need to be careful that we build this team up as something it isn't.
This isn't jumping on the defending RM boast, simply what I see...I guess you will say I as blind as a bat
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Our views are different my friend and only time will tell.
At least you see the manager is not the messiah which is refreshing .
 
Coffee and TV said:
Martinez choosing to start Howard every game is wasting any chance we have to do something with the young talent in this squad while they're still here.
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Would add something to that as well mate, actually choosing to play Howard gives the entire rest of the team a pass when we ship soft goals, he is rightly or wrongly the convenient and easy scapegoat (one that he has earned the right to be labelled as though), remove him and we could not only see a boost in the defences confidence but also them realising that they are equally culpable and they may start to bloody well play a bit better
 
bluestevon said:
Would add something to that as well mate, actually choosing to play Howard gives the entire rest of the team a pass when we ship soft goals, he is rightly or wrongly the convenient and easy scapegoat (one that he has earned the right to be labelled as though), remove him and we could not only see a boost in the defences confidence but also them realising that they are equally culpable and they may start to bloody well play a bit better
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Yeah good point.
The defence looked more solid against boro with joel in goal
 

Lowste said:
Just using it as an example, nothing else....a bad example yes:)
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I know what your trying to sya mate, the club is bigger than any one player, sometimes losing a top player can actually improve the team etc as the focus shifts onto others, but myself think right now after basically 20 years of utter dross strikers we will rue the day we didnt make more of having him here
 
deipnosophist said:
good post mate, your reasoned words belie your youth. Me?, I'm a bit more year-wise grizzled and disillusioned.
A post match Martinez comment : "After we conceded the first goal I thought we had a very good reaction. We scored the goal and from that point on it was almost like trying to get restarted every time."
What does this even mean? The man speaks in gobbledygook.
As some bloke on another forum wrote :

Listening to Martinez is like listening to re-runs of Kung-Fu:

’So, Grasshopper, what have we learned from this experience?’

’I have learned from this experience that I need to learn...’

’Excellent, Grasshopper. And will you learn?’

’No, master.’

’Excellent, Grasshopper. It shows you have learned.’

Funny as it is, that's Martinez speak...he's fast become a phenomenal manager in a good moment of his own parody
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Short answer is that in my eyes, Martinez has talked a lot of crap. But that's nothing new in a football manager, to put a positive spin on what happened in an attempt to try control the headlines. The day of straight talkers appears to be gone, this managerial double speak is endemic in the game.
The issue would be if he believed what he said, and was the same in the dressing room as he is in the media. That's something which from my understanding is not true, that he is prepared to be ruthless and make tough decisions behind the fluff. He has shown he can learn and make the changes needed to improve the team. When he stops learning from his mistakes, that's when I'll have a serious issue with him.

Ultimately for me, we live in a world where everyone is on a short time frame. What we are expecting the manager to do however, is overachieve relative to our peers.
Whilst hard before, this has been made even harder due to the influx of tv money that has evened the playing field for everyone. However we have got a good young squad with youthful key performer, as a result of Martinez's plan. While last year was awful, and this season we aren't where we should be, I think we can have a little patience, at least until the end of the season. Then have a look at how we've done. Anything less than European qualification of some kind is a failure with this team we have.
Top 8 with a cup, or Top 6. That is what we need to achieve.
 
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daz4matty said:
Yeah good point.
The defence looked more solid against boro with joel in goal
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Just human nature, if you don't have confidence in something then your either more nervous or knowing no matter what you do then the good work can be and likely will be undermined than you can actually start to lose a bit of drive to do your own best
 
bluestevon said:
Just human nature, if you don't have confidence in something then your either more nervous or knowing no matter what you do then the good work can be and likely will be undermined than you can actually start to lose a bit of drive to do your own best
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I agree with you and having howard in goal breeds nervousness.
Martinez has got to be strong and pick joel for newcastle.
 

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