John Stones transfer saga

[jazzy]

Because this is not a kindergarten mate it's a professional sports club, he's contracted and well paid at that so he meets his obligations.

If he doesn't like it he can kick a ball around in some corner of Finch Farm all by himself.

(PS this is how I would play it, I doubt the club will although I am always hopeful)

Paul I agree that someone needs to teach modern day footballers a lesson but Everton do not have the resources to do this in the way you suggested.

 

[blue4eva77]

We're in a strong position because of the simple fact that Stones is on a long-term contract. He can protest as much as he likes but unless Chelsea meet our valuation, we're under no pressure to sell.

So a club who are quite clearly brasic and in desperate need for new faces, should turn their noses up at the chance of cashing in on an asset who doesn't give a rats arse about Everton Football Club ?

He's now a player who isn't arsed about Everton. I can't imagine him playing for us again after this. We run the risk of losing team morale and playing a player who won't give 100%. It makes no sense in keeping him.

We are under pressure to sell as his valuation will only decrease due to to the whole saga threatening to divide a dressing room. What is the point of trying to build a team for the future if one of those key players wants to leave ? We also cannot build that team because as stated, we are brasic.

He needs to go and he needs to go ASAP.

 

[mightymoyes]

The problem we have is that we couldn't keep Stones even if the board wasn't partly behind it because Stones and his agent knows we have no one who could come in and replace him in the first team, they have us over a barrel with that and that's partly down to Martinez.

I've said it from the start Martinez should send Mori back on his way to Argentina and get Van Dijk or Evans in, someone who Stones and his agent would know could come in and keep Stones out the team If he kicked up a fuss if we said he's staying put, they know full well some Jarg argie defender isn't gonna go straight into the starting 11.

you are seriously over-rating them 2 mugs

 

[Eric Djemba-Djemba]

While he was here he was also loved by the fans and had an excellent goal return for a defender, too.

Double figures in 07-08 was incredible for a CB.

 

[Steeplejack]

Greetings chaps, I am a total neutral observer. I used to be a season ticket holder at Wigan and feel your anger. I have read every page of this thread and can relate to a lot of it a la Whelan. I don't really know where to start with this one. I suppose the top and tail of the situation is that clubs like Wigan and Everton are just part of the cycle that ensures the best players end up at the top clubs. There are just different levels of 'club progression' in terms of players using them as stepping stones, (stepping Stones, how very apt) clubs like Wigan who see players like McCarthy, Kone and Robles leave was angering but not shocking. They were leaving for a bigger club. The same with the flatulent speaking contradiction that is Roberto Martinez and his love with players showing 'maturity' 'positives' 'working hard to bring players in with the right mentality' cobblers. Waiting around for months then signing players for the reserves. Anyhow, i am digressing down the Martinez route a bit here.

Personally, i had been going to watch Wigan Athletic ever since i was old enough to go on my own, about 20 odd years worth from the old Springfield Park days to the heights of the Premier League and what a journey it was. Dave Whelan bought us in 1995 and said Premiership in 10 years. Of course it sounded stupid, almost as stupid as him telling everyone he broke his leg every 5 minutes so his mate Jim White can comment on it. The business plan was brilliant. 10 years work, hundreds of millions in profits. he spent about 15m on the squad from the old 3rd Division to us getting to the Premiership. He got the council and other investors to fund the stadium build then he sold the old ground to Dorbcrest homes (which he holds a stake in) he then bought Wigan Warriors and sold their ground to Tesco for 40 million thus enabling him to let both clubs RENT the stadium from his holding company 'Whelco Holdings' I am telling you this as it adds weight to his merciless crusade to become mega rich and reading some posts about Kenwright sounds very similar. He promised Paul Jewell 50m to spend in the first season and the players from the Championship who took them up 1m each. They all got a holiday to Barbados and Jewell spent about 5m. Even making a media bulging 10m bid for Michael Owen when he was at Real Madrid. He hired a team of successful and shrewd managers to sign players for peanuts and sell them for fortunes. Chimbonda, Baines, Palacios, N'Zogbia, Cattermole, McCarthy, McCarthur, Moses, Bullard, Valencia etc etc. Add that to the 8 Premiership seasons of sky money and i work out he took nearly 700m whilst investing about 100m back. Not a bad business plan eh? I stopped going When he sold the team under Steve Bruce's nose. About 8th in the league at that point, Zaki was on fire, N'Zogbia, Valencia, Cattermole, Palacios. It was some bloody team that then after christmas it was all disbanded and not replaced. That was when i decided i wouldn't be going again.

That is where i sympathize with some of you who have said the same thing. As football fans you pay a lot of money to be entertained and wanting your club to show some backbone and ambition but some owners just don't want progression. They are simply happy to just sustain league status and gobble up Sky money every season but STILL EXPECT you to pay hundreds of quid every year to see your team win a handful of games. Not value for money especially at a history laden side like Everton, you have the right to expect ambition and cannot understand how you have been left behind in regards to the top 6ish in the league. You are quite similar to Aston Villa in many ways, original members, never relegated (i think) and have both flirted with the top 6 for a few seasons before dropping back to mid-table - relegation flirters. I really do believe we need a salary cap in football now. A worldwide one, say £20,000 a week per player. Every club can afford that amount and it would give everyone a more level playing field. That would eliminate a lot of this player power and desire to leave and i guarantee the shape of the top 6 would change on a seasonly basis and it would increase revenue of every single club as well as making football a hell of a lot more entertaining. The industry is on it's arse, Chairmen and board members are greedy for cash and it's the fans who pay for it. The only way to win is to vote with your feet. Players like Stones are living in an age where they are very very easily influenced by the media and money (to be fair who wouldn't be) the days where players like Big Dunc, Unsworth and Dave Watson fought for the shirt are long gone. You get the odd one but in general those days are gone. Football fans in general need to make a stand against this top 4 domination and billionaire takeovers. My granddad often tells me of the days where any team in the league could win it, it was all about how they were managed and the players they had bought that particular season. A bit like the Championship is now. It's all well and good Chelsea and Man City having this outrageous spending power but where will they be when the owners have had enough (which they will eventually) Abramovich has shown signs of it. They will fall out of existence, or near enough. Doesn't matter how hard they try, they will never have the global branding of Man Utd, Barcelona, Real Madrid so they will never get rich from merchandising. Sport goes around in cycles and they will hit a brick wall eventually.

What i can't understand about Everton is they have made substantial amounts on player transfers over the years, Barkley and Stones to be the latest ones. Taken Sky money every season for 23 years on the trot, you fill your ground every game yet Bill Kenwright claims you are in debt. How can that be? I just don't get it. I get that you may have been in debt in the early 90's but the rate the Sky money rocketed from 98' there is just no way it can be as bad as he makes out. A club with so much debt surely wouldn't sanction the 15m transfer of Fellaini or the £20+m transfer of Lukaku. Something doesn't add up.

 

[caught]

The board need to decide what is more important: money or dignity. If it's money, they squeeze Chelsea for every penny by rejecting their next bid. Tell Stones they'll allow him to leave if their valuation is met and leave the ball in Chelsea's court.

If we wish to keep our dignity there's only one option: kill Stones, stuff him (apparently Kone trained as a taxidermist in the 60s), and mount him where we'd normally display a mural. Nil satis...

 

[Goat]

The problem we have is that we couldn't keep Stones even if the board wasn't partly behind it because Stones and his agent knows we have no one who could come in and replace him in the first team, they have us over a barrel with that and that's partly down to Martinez.

I've said it from the start Martinez should send Mori back on his way to Argentina and get Van Dijk or Evans in, someone who Stones and his agent would know could come in and keep Stones out the team If he kicked up a fuss if we said he's staying put, they know full well some Jarg argie defender isn't gonna go straight into the starting 11.

LOL

Unreal mentalism.

 

[The Esk]

I dont see how that follows. In my view, Martinez has the strategy of trying to build a new team on the basis of younger players. But he has to be realistic that the industry will cut across that at times. It doesn't negate the plan. It just throws a spanner in the works - it's something he'll have known could happen on occasion (indeed he constantly refers to the interest of other teams in our players, and that's one small step away from offloading one every now and again). My gripe is that this hasn't been wrapped up a month or more ago - and also that, given that it wasn't, the board needed to sanction at least some cash to get the ball rolling on that transfer hit list we have outwith any incoming cash for Stones.

As for Everton denying his transfer request to retain credibility: maybe they will, but it'll be a pyrrhic victory. Two things will happen: 1/ we'll go with what we have, to coin a phrase. There'll be no marquee signings of players who can give us creativity; 2/ we'll be stuck with a disgruntled player (and even if he got his head down and grafted away he'll be a run of poor form away from being hounded at this club. This club's fans wont accept what he did. Not a chance).

I am sure you are right Dave in terms of the final outcome but whichever happens the club is weakened.

From a loss limitation point of view I still believe my strategy would be the correct one but I am sure it is entirely hypothetical anyway.

 

[Deleted member 28206]

Dont get me wrong, I know why he wants to move and I honestly dont blame him, just something smells really rotten about the whole thing.

Everton, that. That video that did the rounds over the weekend of Jon woods saying he and Bill didn't wanna sell him left it all up to Stones really.

 

[Tubey]

They definitely are orchestrated, but by the agent and buying club. Game is rife with it. Blaming our board for the transfer request is incorrect in my opinion.

Sorry mate but that is woefully naive.

 

[Barkley1878]

you are seriously over-rating them 2 mugs

We ain't getting anyone better as a 3rd choice CB, unless you think Ramos or Dragovic will come in for £15 mil+ to sit on the bench.

My point is those 2 know the country and it's culture, Evans knows the prem and woukd slot in right away should Stones kick up a fuss ala Lescott and VVD suits martinez's system.

Fact is its utterly deluded to expect some bloke to come in from a pub league on the other side of the world and slot into our first team within 1-2 weeks it's a non starter- something John Stones and his agent will know only too well.

 

[oldblue]

Because this is not a kindergarten mate it's a professional sports club, he's contracted and well paid at that so he meets his obligations.

If he doesn't like it he can kick a ball around in some corner of Finch Farm all by himself.

(PS this is how I would play it, I doubt the club will although I am always hopeful)

says it perfectly. It is time to recognise we are watching spoilt multi-millionaires being guided by vultures with no long term vision for the game or even the player. Time for a stand. West Brom may be doing the same. The game will be better for it and I guarantee we will feel better for it and maybe transfer windows will be a civiised circus in future.

 

[Steve Wigan]

Wolves are rejecting £10 million offers for players like Benik Afobe.
£33 million in comparison is a bargain for Stones

It would be 33m less 15% to Barnsley , and possibly agents fees. We would finish up with less than 30 m, by a long way. It has to be £40 m at the very least, but preferably turn down the request, which is no Stones wanting to leave, its a 21 year old Stones being confused and pressured by Chelsea and the media.

 

[terraloon]

All true mate.

its a short term view that is dictated by who has the most money at the moment.
we are a big club ,if we had a decent financial backing , we would be bigger than Chelsea . they are only 'big' because of finance, historically they are not that big. if we keep our talent and build on it we could be a team to fear in the next few years.
if we sell our best players though , its admittance that we are not going anywhere , and this is as good as it gets ....a best of the rest outside the top 6 selling club.

See this is where facts tend to get in the way of emotion

I don't want to get into the whole debate about what makes a big club but did you realise that Chelsea are 5th in the all time league attendance averages . Only topped by Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal & Spurs

 

[bluesb1970]

Sorry mate but that is woefully naive.

As opposed to thinking that a billionaire club come to an agent and promise the world and turn the players head from a club that won't win anything (potentially in the players career). The players and agent have forced the issue. That's not naive?