2015 post UK election discussion

[marty mcfly]

Again, it's been utterly disproven - there is no trickle down effect and there hasn't been for the hundred plus years this theory has knocked about.

Everything you just said is the textbook theory that has absolutely no basis in real practice anywhere in the world.

What has worked is tax breaks for small businesses, driving up the core of an economy which in turn generates a strong economy from the bottom up, not top down. I'm not advocating "socialism" here - I'm saying that the very rich getting richer results in absolutely nothing other than the very rich getting richer.

btw - It hasn't been totally disproven.

The problem is that the super rich are international citizens. They don't really care about their own coutry and as a result take the money and invest it where it makes a better return.

i.e. Developing economies.

It's actually working but just on a global scale so we don't see much benefit.

 

[Tubey]

btw - It hasn't been totally disproven.

The problem is that the super rich are international citizens. They don't really care about their own coutry and as a result take the money and invest it where it makes a better return.

i.e. Developing economies.

It's actually working but just on a global scale so we don't see much benefit.

They don't invest it mate - they hoard it.

You jokingly made the Scrooge McDuck comment - essentially, yes, that's what happens.

 

[marty mcfly]

And pay less as a proportion of their income than the poor do. There's something like an 8% gap I believe, can't think exacts at the moment as I'm shattered.

Point being, tax system is already unfair in terms of net to the poor.

I agree. Muhammed might have had a point when he said that tax should basically be a 1/3 of your assets every year. Nice and simple.

However the poor barely pay any tax at all and are infact normally large net benificaries.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Next time they will have to employ Darren Brown

Or just not use Russell Brand?

 

[Seanjd]

And I think we've ascertained that the British public are thickies who can't be trusted with anything.

You cannot deny that the press have an enormous influence in voters. That's how this election was won.

 

[Groucho]

Or just not use Russell Brand?

Personally, I'd like to see Tommy Cooper......

 

[Woolly Blue]

They don't invest it mate - they hoard it.

LOL

 

[Tubey]

I agree. Muhammed might have had a point when he said that tax should basically be a 1/3 of your assets every year. Nice and simple.

However the poor barely pay any tax at all and are infact normally large net benificaries.

That's not true mate.

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/jun/16/british-public-wrong-rich-poor-tax-research

8% more of their income than the rich do. It's comparatively less but personally well more.

My argument is - and I think it's a fair one - is that the rich and poor should pay broadly the same in respect to their incomes. In austerity, if the poor pay 43%, the rich should too.

 

[Seanjd]

btw - It hasn't been totally disproven.

The problem is that the super rich are international citizens. They don't really care about their own coutry and as a result take the money and invest it where it makes a better return.

i.e. Developing economies.

It's actually working but just on a global scale so we don't see much benefit.

So it's not working. If we don't see the benefit in this country, then it's not working. We are talking about trickle down in this country, aren't we?

 

[marty mcfly]

I said anywhere in the world. United States, Australia, anywhere you care to mention. It has never worked - it's a theory. The minute the rich get money, they just get more money.

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/jul/21/offshore-wealth-global-economy-tax-havens

The US went from nothing to the biggest super power in the world with those policies. Only recently the success (in terms of election) of progressive policies have [Poor language removed] it.

While China throw of their old communist roots and go from strength to strength.

 

[orly]

They don't invest it mate - they hoard it.

Oh Tubes come on ffs

 

[Tubey]

LOL

It's true, read on... http://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/jul/21/offshore-wealth-global-economy-tax-havens

I'm just stating a fact - again, look at the practicalities of trickle down economic theory and you'll see what I mean. The rich simply get richer.

 

[Tubey]

Oh Tubes come on ffs

lol

It is what happens!

http://www.theguardian.com/business/2012/jul/21/offshore-wealth-global-economy-tax-havens

I'm not making that up - and by the way, that's been true for over 100 years in different mechanisms. Trickle down theory is well known to be exceptionally flawed.

 

[Seanjd]

I agree. Muhammed might have had a point when he said that tax should basically be a 1/3 of your assets every year. Nice and simple.

However the poor barely pay any tax at all and are infact normally large net benificaries.

I would argue that the large net beneficiaries of the tax system are those who avoid it. The rich. Not the poor. What do they get out if it?

 

[marty mcfly]

So it's not working. If we don't see the benefit in this country, then it's not working. We are talking about trickle down in this country, aren't we?

Well - It is developing markets for us to sell into but yea we're not seeing the full benifits.

It also doesn't help importing a load of cheap labour which is also the main reason it's not helping here.

Insourcing and Outsourcing are the two issues we should be looking to tackle.