Messiah comes to mind
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Messiah comes to mind
Don't look to the stars to blame
Look to are selves first -Shakespeare
In fairness @nsno-chris has very specific tactical issues with the boss, and isn´t slow to point them out, but I don´t think he takes every opportunity to throw blame at Martinez. I don´t agree on much of what he says, but he has some points.
I don´t think over analysis is quite necessary right now. It comes down to what you would have thought when he took over, "would you allow him a poor season whilst settling in, so long as we are not deep in a relegation battle?". I think most would have reasonably said yes, and others would have gladly taken a poor league finish this season so long as we do well in the Europa/FA cup (preferably win a trophy). This could still be the case.
However IMO many have lost the plot with the inability to handle a bad losing streak and poor football. As if, what we see now in these few months, is what we will always see from a Martinez team. Last season would obviously suggest its possible that no, things can be better and could be again this season. Your team playing crap and losing happens in football, I don´t think sacking a manager or heaping pressure on him and the players is necessary at this moment in time given the context of the situation. It´s amazing reading the posts and seeing the mentality of some people finding a negative in every single little thing around the club. No idea why you´d want to pass your time that way, must be exhausting.
As for the football itself. Yeah its pretty much total dross and not very entertaining but having watched Barcelona for many years, including the last two seasons as a season ticket holder, I can tell you that a tikitaka style or a variation on it will generally bring you results but if any or all of confidence, form, morale and motivation is missing then it will bore the pants off you. This for me explains the difference between last season and this. I don´t think it is tactical, I think it is mental. Its possible the preseason was part of a plan to ease the players in, to have us fitter for the latter stages of the season (as Guardiola did) but this plan may have backfired when individuals started having brainfarts and handing goals to the opposition from the start of the season, and our key defensive three (Jags, Distin and Howard) suddenly decided to hit all-time lows in performance levels. I think from there the confidence has disappeared in a downward spiral, with every little ray of light or possible step back up killed by another dumb error.
Anyway, just my take on it. Just back in the office today after two weeks back home, and I am bored off my head here.
If you thought he was messiah then good for you
CrabbyPaddy
Player Valuation: £8m
Bobby has my support. He is trying to implement a style that will take us to the next level, and consistently challenge for Champions League qualification (and possibly the league if we develop correctly).
DM will always have my respect, as he stabilised the club, and took us to a level we never thought was possible (given our previous predicament). But he didn't have either the ability, or the mentality to take us to that next level.
Martinez is trying to do that. I'm not saying for one second that he is the right man to do so, but he is trying and we will find out in due course. I think, as Evertonians it's about time we took a gamble, because I'm sick of mediocrity. We're one of the big clubs, so lets start thinking like one.
Maybe things won't work out, and I will happily eat a large slice of humble pie, with cream on top. We can then go back and hire a DM archytpye who will stabilise us for a few seasons, and hope to [Poor language removed] some Sheik with more money than sense arrives and takes us to that next level. I know many will probably disagree with a lot of this, and that's fine. I'm just giving my take on the matter.
Our last manager stabilised us without taking risks. But I like risks, and I like Martinez.
DM will always have my respect, as he stabilised the club, and took us to a level we never thought was possible (given our previous predicament). But he didn't have either the ability, or the mentality to take us to that next level.
Martinez is trying to do that. I'm not saying for one second that he is the right man to do so, but he is trying and we will find out in due course. I think, as Evertonians it's about time we took a gamble, because I'm sick of mediocrity. We're one of the big clubs, so lets start thinking like one.
Maybe things won't work out, and I will happily eat a large slice of humble pie, with cream on top. We can then go back and hire a DM archytpye who will stabilise us for a few seasons, and hope to [Poor language removed] some Sheik with more money than sense arrives and takes us to that next level. I know many will probably disagree with a lot of this, and that's fine. I'm just giving my take on the matter.
Our last manager stabilised us without taking risks. But I like risks, and I like Martinez.
I do agree with your point regarding the fitness, i remember reading a while ago somehting along the lines of: he doesn't believe in fitness during preseason as it will come naturally to the players (for the life of me i cannot find the article).
You know my views on the tactics from our previous back-and-forth after the palace game, in my view nothing has changed. Teams are still setting up the same, the ones we win, we stagger through.
I will disagree on the tika-taka stuff though, Guardiola has admitted himself that he doesn't believe in it if there is no purpose, we don't have a purpose. Its a case of keep the ball for the sake of it, this over playing is then causing errors and leading to mistakes which is costing us points. My main gripe is that he his unwilling to accept this.
i will never view my points about the manager or players whilst in or around the ground, thats something i don't believe in. While i'm there they have my full support, on a forum, i will share my views, if people disagree then fair enough
Would be interesting if you could find that article Chris regarding not believing in pre season as that would be concerning. I wouldn't believe anything Guardiola says regarding passing for the sake of it, his Barca team absolutely bored the life out of me half the time and that comment I think was to appease Bayern Munich fans at the time ( if I remember correctly though I may be wrong ). Your right about the passing backwards and to the keeper and it causing all kinds of problems and I don't think anyone will disagree with that. Last season we were more fluent in our passing it around ( Hull goal last game of the season is a great example ) but for me it all boils down to confidence. Players are taking 3 touches instead of 1, they are looking for the safe pass instead of a game changing pass. People slagging off Barry, last season if you watched his play he would come deep for the ball and pass it first time without even looking such was his confidence in who and what was around him. He's out of form, he's taking touches, getting caught, over thinking things. He's a seasoned pro and it's not because he's finished, it's because his confidence is shot.
Maybe we should revert back to basics but then that would be Martinez moving away from his beliefs and win or lose he's going to stick by them. If it costs him his job at least he will say he did it his way otherwise of he doesn't believe in his convictions then how are the players supposed to believe in them.
royalblue66
Player Valuation: £70m
If I remember right, he didn't try to change things in his last few months at Wigan, perhaps someone can enlighten me ?, I am not against Martinez btw, but I am getting concerned that he won't try changing the way we are playing,to my way of thinking,the last few games should have been played with a lot more commitment.
One worried Blue.
One worried Blue.
My point is, there is supposed to be a purpose but it isn´t happening on the field so they take easy options, make poor passes or just go backwards. And also, as @banno mentioned, he does tweak things but generally within the main framework. However, nothings working right now. But anyway, with that we will just get back into our "its the tactics - its the players!" argument.
Glad to hear you don´t join in the boo brigade. I think its more likely we will get our break that turns our season in an away game, as the pressure must be high on the players at Goodison right now. Every error and backpass with a soundtrack of groans and moans and boos.
HA ha ha certainly not. He was a steady eddie and certainly happy staying that way. Risk free manager who steadied the ship and actually believed that was success for a club like Everton. Many fell for it aswell.
Further Harm
Player Valuation: £500k
I originally didn't want Martinez because of what happened at Wigan, but last season was great for the most part and he won me over. I can't quite believe people are calling for his head already...over the last year we've won more games than we've lost so the recent dip in form is not really enough to start talking about getting someone else in.
Furey1878
Player Valuation: £70m
Let's have it right, even if this was Martinez's first season, and we were struggling and playing crap with no prior knowledge of how well we can play under him, I'd still think sacking him was the wrong move. Everton's not in the financial position to buy players for instant success, or to hire/sack managers whenever things take a bad turn. Any manager this club hires deserves a fair bit of time to establish their style, to which I said at least 2 seasons when we first hired Martinez. And with the relative success of 13/14, he's certainly bought himself more time in my book.
kenada_blue
Welcome to Barcelonaton FC
In a nutshell.
In the presser yesterday the best thing he said was that we've always played football the right way. 60's, 70's and the winning side in the 80's - we've had a strong technical way of playing. That's what he wants to carry on.
The 90's killed us. Instilled a fear of relegation and poor football that we've forgot who we were.
Moyes made us solid and competitive again. But we need to stop worrying about worse case scenario that the 90s brought and look forward.
Toffeelover
Player Valuation: £80m
I think many should go and read the Echo article.
I would ask is Finch farm a laboratory and is he using Everton FC as an experiment?
I would ask is Finch farm a laboratory and is he using Everton FC as an experiment?
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