Why do Evertonians expect success?

[BoysInBlue]

Moyes has been a great manager for us. I think most accept that.

However, we have got to the point now where something has to give. Moyes' frustrations are clear for all to see, and it is affecting the way he does the job. Whatever political games he is playing with his contract (all the wait and see business) have backfired spectacularly. We are not in a healthy situation right now. In 3 or 4 games time we will be lucky to still be in the top 8, as I can't see us beating City or Spurs, and Stoke will be a horrible game. If Wigan draw Millwall/Blackburn in the semi draw, 6th will no longer get Europa, only 5th will. If that happens, it is highly unlikely we'll be in Europe at all next season.

Suggesting 'life after Moyes' is for the best at this point is not at all a reflection on how highly regarded we should hold him.

It's just the end has been reached. The fans are restless. His substitutions are scrutinised every game, many being rejected by the fans. As is his reluctance of putting trust in the younger players, and over-reliance on the 30+ gang.

Fresh ideas are needed and might invigorate the club a bit. Real change won't happen until the board sell of course, but in the meantime, a fresh voice might give us the impetus to do something good.

 

[Pomp]

Always amazes me the way people airbrush the 17th place Moyes inspired finish in 03/04 out of history completely.

Lowest points tally EVER in Everton's top flight history or some ****, but lets just airbrush it out

 

[micknick]

Whatever mate. Everton were never "relegation fodder" and it's exaggeration to suggest anything of the sort. We finished 16th the season before Moyes came and we were 17th when he took over. His biggest achievement was the 7th place finish in his first full season, but after that he nearly took us down himself and was completely rescued by the sale of Wayne Rooney, when he then had funds to improve the squad - which he did well.

So without the Rooney money (and later, the Lescott money) we'd have been relegated long ago. Always amazes me the way people airbrush the 17th place Moyes inspired finish in 03/04 out of history completely.

If you want to go back to pre Moyes thats fine. Think you need to take those rose tinted glasses of that period off though pal.

Oh yeh the Lescott money- a player that he signed and made a £19m profit on. Thought we reinvested that pretty well to be honest.

 

[tommye]

Oh yeh the Lescott money- a player that he signed and made a £19m profit on. Thought we reinvested that pretty well to be honest.

bily x
heitinga
distin




i suppose one and a bit out of 3 is ok for plucky little everton

 

[micknick]

It's just as frustrating for me mate. If they're hardly sides to be compared with why shouldn't we expect some success?

They didn't fluke them cups either, they won them. Does your arguments no favours denigrating other sides achievements.

What argument no favours? Im just saying that Moyes HAS done a good job and if he leaves, he leaves us in a far better state than when he took over. That is not to be denied. I dont agree with all the slating hes been getting and Im not just talking about the game yesterday.

The point about other sides is that what I am dealing with in 'discussing' it with people. yes they won a cup- brilliant, They are completely funked now though and if we went down which i think is a MASSIVE possibility with a poor manager in place we would go into completely obscurity because we wouldnt be able to buy our way back.

 

[Tubey]

If you want to go back to pre Moyes thats fine. Think you need to take those rose tinted glasses of that period off though pal.

Oh yeh the Lescott money- a player that he signed and made a £19m profit on. Thought we reinvested that pretty well to be honest.

Which is why I never slate Moyes transfer record. Ever.

And I'm not saying that Everton under Smith or Royle were great, far from it; I'm just saying we weren't relegation fodder and we weren't saved by Moyes. We were saved by the emergence of Wayne Rooney and the windfall from it.

The rose tinted glasses are firmly with you I'm afraid. Moyes has done a "par for the course" job treading water but he's achieved the very bare minimum I'd expect from a manager given the head start he had with the Rooney sale and 11 full years to develop a club.

And in terms of actually achieving something substantial, he's not done it. He's a failure, end of story.

 

[Brennan]

Which is why I never slate Moyes transfer record. Ever.

And I'm not saying that Everton under Smith or Royle were great, far from it; I'm just saying we weren't relegation fodder and we weren't saved by Moyes. We were saved by the emergence of Wayne Rooney and the windfall from it.

The rose tinted glasses are firmly with you I'm afraid. Moyes has done a "par for the course" job treading water but he's achieved the very bare minimum I'd expect from a manager given the head start he had with the Rooney sale and 11 full years to develop a club.

And in terms of actually achieving something substantial, he's not done it. He's a failure, end of story.

So you don't think finishing top 7 consistently with a budget of about £1.5m PA is a substantial achievement ? Because i do.

 

[Reidy's Bottle Of Grecian]

did the o.p. say he thinks we are on a par with Newcastle ? I couldn't concentrate after that for thinking what an idiot he must be or how it can all be disregarded as a wind up.

 

[steken1]

What argument no favours? Im just saying that Moyes HAS done a good job and if he leaves, he leaves us in a far better state than when he took over. That is not to be denied. I dont agree with all the slating hes been getting and Im not just talking about the game yesterday.

The point about other sides is that what I am dealing with in 'discussing' it with people. yes they won a cup- brilliant, They are completely funked now though and if we went down which i think is a MASSIVE possibility with a poor manager in place we would go into completely obscurity because we wouldnt be able to buy our way back.

argument as in point, stance I know it's not an argument.

 

[Tubey]

So you don't think finishing top 7 consistently with a budget of about £1.5m PA is a substantial achievement ? Because i do.

Nope I think that's bare minimum, because even if we have a shocker of a season I don't think we'd finish outside the top 10, such is the standard of the league around us.

I don't buy into the "Magnificent 7th" being a marketable achievement. It just means we're not Wigan.

 

[micknick]

Which is why I never slate Moyes transfer record. Ever.

And I'm not saying that Everton under Smith or Royle were great, far from it; I'm just saying we weren't relegation fodder and we weren't saved by Moyes. We were saved by the emergence of Wayne Rooney and the windfall from it.

The rose tinted glasses are firmly with you I'm afraid. Moyes has done a "par for the course" job treading water but he's achieved the very bare minimum I'd expect from a manager given the head start he had with the Rooney sale and 11 full years to develop a club.

And in terms of actually achieving something substantial, he's not done it. He's a failure, end of story.

Haha end of story. Thats just like- fact.

If you dont think consistently getting us up in the reaches of the leagues big spenders with next to money every season is an achievement then we are going to have to agree to disagree.

Yes the Rooney money helped no denying that and the transfer record of bringing players in and selling at a huge profit cannot be denied. But even with that Money we have been massively out spent by a vast majority of the league.

By relegation fodder I mean scraping to stay in the league- go have a look at the 90's records of the league and apart from the 6th place finish its scary reading.

I really hope we make a good appointment and get someone that can get the best out of players and has an eye for transfers that Moyes does because with the current board is an absolute necessity for the job

 

[Brennan]

Nope I think that's bare minimum, because even if we have a shocker of a season I don't think we'd finish outside the top 10, such is the standard of the league around us.

I don't buy into the "Magnificent 7th" being a marketable achievement. It just means we're not Wigan.

But we wouldn't finish outside of the top 10 as a result of the squad Moyes has assembled.

 

[micknick]

Nope I think that's bare minimum, because even if we have a shocker of a season I don't think we'd finish outside the top 10, such is the standard of the league around us.

I don't buy into the "Magnificent 7th" being a marketable achievement. It just means we're not Wigan.

Hahaha! Brilliant bare minimum. Sorry Tubes but youve let yourself down there

 

[Brennan]

Haha end of story. Thats just like- fact.

If you dont think consistently getting us up in the reaches of the leagues big spenders with next to money every season is an achievement then we are going to have to agree to disagree.

Yes the Rooney money helped no denying that and the transfer record of bringing players in and selling at a huge profit cannot be denied. But even with that Money we have been massively out spent by a vast majority of the league.

By relegation fodder I mean scraping to stay in the league- go have a look at the 90's records of the league and apart from the 6th place finish its scary reading.

I really hope we make a good appointment and get someone that can get the best out of players and has an eye for transfers that Moyes does because with the current board is an absolute necessity for the job

Yep.

I disagree with Neiler all the time but he had it absolutely spot on when he said we as a club rely on Moyes and his transfers to stay where we are.

Many were calling for Rodgers to come in, had he replaced Moyes at the end of last season we'd have Fabio Borini instead of Mirallas and Oviedo. It's already easy to see the resale value Mirallas has, if he carries on playing well he'll be a £15m player and no mistake.

 

[Tubey]

But we wouldn't finish outside of the top 10 as a result of the squad Moyes has assembled.

Which is based on reinvested funds and a nous in the transfer market, not because of his tactical efficiency. In fact, it's despite it.

We got the influx in funds at the right time which allowed us to solidify whilst the bottom half of the league remained in flux.

An "achievement" would be going above and beyond what is expected. Moyes has assembled a good, solid side due to how good he is in the market, but that's of no use at all if he bottles it every single time he is asked to do something important with that squad.