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Ihaters
Player Valuation: £35m
How does it matter if you drop points from behind or in front?
Ihaters
Player Valuation: £35m
Yeah but we're not good against 4 specially selected teams at their ground you see.. And we havn't won a cup yet so it doesn't matter.
EFC Si
Player Valuation: £25m
He's got red hair but we don't care.........................................................because our league position won't improve no matter what manager we have until we can afford to buy some playeerrrrs.
During that 25 year gap between titles, 1967 through 1993, United lifted the European Cup and the European Cup Winners Cup.
They won the F.A. Cup on at least four occasions that I can think off (including beating us in '85).
And they won the League Cup once.
We have now gone 26 years without winning the title and have had one F.A. Cup to cheer us up during that period.
All in all, I'd say United fans didn't have a lot to moan about during their supposedly fallow years.
Even their relegation season set up a glorious campaign when they win the 2nd divison with a team which matured into one of the best English teams I have ever seen.....Tommy Doc's United, with Hill, Coppell, Greenhoff, Pearson et al.
You should post to him that the only reason we are discussing getting a new manager in is because the current one is refusing to commit himself to EFC and is being linked with all sorts of pie in the sky moves to Chelsea, Arsenal and Citeh.
If he had signed the contract, none of us would be talking about a new manager.
Elong
The fire rises
We shouldn't be comparing ourselves with West Ham fans' expectations of their team.
SpeedEFC
Player Valuation: £8m
It doesn't really but a good team should be able to hold a lead more often than not, the easy way of getting points is going in the lead then keeping in the lead. Having a comeback in you should be just icing on the cake since it is usually much harder to go behind then go on to win plus you can only really drop points if you were already in a position to drop those points in a game (i.e. in the lead/drawing).
Of course they did. West Ham and Reading fans would be ****ting on the floor with happiness if they were 6th and still in the cup.
But we are Everton fans and, as an Everton fan, I expect more than that. I'm sorry but I do.
I'm fully aware that it's because of Moyes that I now expect these things. But I think he's gone as far as he can go. He's built up a great team (great first XI at any rate) but the negativity, the dour atmosphere emanating from everything he says and does, the insane, pointless and entirely too late substitutions, the insistence on playing dross like Neville, Osman (sorry, he has his games but on the whole he's back to his average self) and, above ALL else, Naismith (WHY??) mean I would like to see a change.
I'm not saying we won't slide back down to mid-table obscurity, there's a very real chance we will. But we might not. We might find a manager who can take the excellent team we have and take us forward.
I KNOW we have hit a ceiling and won't get through it with the current Chairman/Manager setup. I know that. This is as good as we can do currently. And seeing as Bill will have to die to not be the chairman anymore then a managerial change has got to happen. At the end of the day we might as well have a go at breaking through that ceiling towards glory, fail and finish 14th rather than staying tight, staying hard to beat, doing great with the financial straight jacket etc and finish 7th repeatedly. We might have to get a bit worse to get a lot better.
It's all just gone stale and tired and boring. 10 years is a bloody long time to do anything, time for something new.
Azzurri
Player Valuation: £70m
How many United forums were you on in those days, though?
Black Belt Jones
Player Valuation: £25m
I think to stall on a contract and then turn round and sign one would be a problem. Maybe earlier in his career he would be justified in keeping his options open, negotiating for a higher salary etc. but we're well past all that - he's been here a long time and he knows that really nothing can be expected to change at the club. He can't make a 'let's wait and see where the club is in the summer' argument with any credibility.
It's been mentioned in every thread so apologies for the repetition but I'm surprised anyone can look at his actions at anything other than his attempts to see if anyone else is interested in him . I don't blame moyes for wanting the best for himself but if the best for him isn't the best for us then surely as blues that's where it seems our future paths may diverge .
So you want rid of a manager who has built up a great first team on no money because you don't like a tiny fraction of the players he has fielded over a ten year period?
Again you have acknowledged that the same manager you want rid of put together an excellent team on no money. No other manager in the last decade has done the same, it is a very rare skill. But you are prepared to risk the almost certain break up of that team and decline in form on the off chance that another manager would not only be able to match Moyes achievements (which no other manager has) but to such an extent they could do so win trophies and make CL places? It simply is not possible.
If we get a bit worse then things get a lot worse. If we finished 14th then our income would drop by around £10m. We already lose £10m a season and break even at best on transfers. We'd then be faced with having to sell some of our best players with no prospect of replacing them. Inevitably we'd then finish lower the next season and before you know it we are back to the 1990's.
This stale and boring season would have been worthy of a parade in the time before Moyes. We finished in the top 12 once between 1991 and 2003. I have a VHS of the season we finished 6th in 1996 as it seemed such a wonderful season. To get to that point we had the most expensive defender in the league (Short), Man Utds top scorer (Kanchelskis), an England international striker (Barmby) and Britain's most expensive player ever (Ferguson) in our team. Moyes beats that almost every year with bargain basement signings.
Black Belt Jones
Player Valuation: £25m
That's a good post Timak (as usual), but it does point to an illogical conclusion - that we need to keep Moyes FOREVER!
This is not possible. Clearly we will need to change the manager at some point and just face up to the uncertainties in doing that - grasp the old nettle and give it a tug.
This is not possible. Clearly we will need to change the manager at some point and just face up to the uncertainties in doing that - grasp the old nettle and give it a tug.
Agreed (not just with the good post bit
) - the board need to put into place a proper structure so that we aren't so reliant on just one man. That means a proper set up with a head coach rather than a manager and a permanent coaches, scouts at all other levels of the club.Can't see our disinterested board having anything to do with this though which means keeping Moyes until the board goes.
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