6 + 2 Point Deductions

[maccavennie]

Basically

Don't buy anyone
Sell everyone
Don't expect to win/challenge for anything
Try and avoid relegation

Brilliant eh

 

[Bedfordblue]

@Tipp blue posted this

According to that and ignoring the previous posts suggesting they showed a profit of £300k last year, they appear to be well and truly stuffed, but they should also have been done for 20-22 which was shown as a cumulative loss of over £200m.
Must be more to it that I’m not understanding.
Unless those figures are before mitigation or allowable losses.
But then the current head line of Villa post £120m loss would be pretty misleading too.

 

[b-rad]

According to that and ignoring the previous posts suggesting they showed a profit of £300k last year, they appear to be well and truly stuffed, but they should also have been done for 20-22 which was shown as a cumulative loss of over £200m.
Must be more to it that I’m not understanding.
Unless those figures are before mitigation or allowable losses.
But then the current head line of Villa post £120m loss would be pretty misleading too.

Exactly this.
The total losses in the accounts are not quite the same as losses as calculated for P&S.
I don't think we'll know what the P&S losses are for anyone unless charges are brought.

 

[Dixieslaces]

According to that and ignoring the previous posts suggesting they showed a profit of £300k last year, they appear to be well and truly stuffed, but they should also have been done for 20-22 which was shown as a cumulative loss of over £200m.
Must be more to it that I’m not understanding.
Unless those figures are before mitigation or allowable losses.
But then the current head line of Villa post £120m loss would be pretty misleading too.

Yeah I think some of the more knowledgeable of us have mentioned "writebacks" have not yet been included, but at face value it seems pretty dire and as many have said already, punishment for trying to break the glass ceiling seems to be the order of the "day" and that the rules are really fit for purpose.

Its why in my heart im saying we should still be going at them over the initial charge, my head says leave the emotion out of it but it just doesnt sit right with me!

 

[Dixieslaces]

The " " button has arrived, be ready to feel my love you beautiful people UTFT

Respect @GrandOldTeam

use it wisely

 

[Tony’s Carp]

What Villa are trying to do, and what we failed to do, is spend big in the short term in order to get long-term success (trophies, league position, Europe, and ultimately more revenue and fans).

It's almost impossible to do that without spending big. We've shown what happens if you try it and get it wrong - perilous league position and points deductions. Villa might end up showing what happens if you try it and get it 'right' - good league position and still the danger of points deductions or selling off the best players and returning to mediocrity.

Do the P&S rules force clubs to be sustainable? Well, you might be able to argue that, as you need to either spend within your means or suffer greatly because of it. In the world of sport - what's the point in being stable, if you are never going to even try to compete at the top?

I want to watch sport - where everyone is trying their best to win (a game, season, etc). I don't want to cheer for a business being sustainable.
I appreciate the two are inherently interlinked, but football is becoming more and more of a closed shop. P&S is helping it. It's not a conspiracy, but it severely affects anyone who doesn't already have large income streams. How do you get bigger income without either a) selling all your decent players, and never hoping to be near the top, or b) spend big, win things and become more appealing to global fans and sponsors. The rules, as they are, encourage clubs to do a).

Edit: I don't know what the answer is, but it doesn't feel like P&S is it.

I get what you’re saying and I wish I didn’t have to care about numbers on spreadsheets but at the same time no one wants to worry about sustainability… until your club becomes unsustainable. And while the detail of PSR is debatable I still believe that if FFP hadn’t constrained Moshiri from summer 21 he’d have kept on making the same mistakes and we’d be sitting here not fearing administration but in it. So in a sense it HAS done a job.

Re Villa, FFP isn’t going to completely destroy them if they do the right things, they don’t need a fire sale just a strategic sale or two. And the transfer market can never be a one way street for anyone.

And they can still be upwardly mobile, especially if they get Champions League. But the point is, when you compare their incomings to their outgoings they almost need Champions League just to sustain the CURRENT outgoings, such is the extent they’ve pushed the boat out. If they get CL it’s a gamble that won, but it was still a gamble. All FFP does is stop teams like us, who gamble and lose from keeping on doing the same thing. And we know how much doing that has damaged us.

 

[mccole]

Villa will be fine because the rules change in the summer so they will adjust their finances and squad

 

[MikeH72]

Villa will be fine because the rules change in the summer so they will adjust their finances and squad

How does that work when their loss is for 2022/23? That’s the same period us and Forest are currently being referred for, why aren’t Villa as well?

 

[b-rad]

How does that work when their loss is for 2022/23? That’s the same period us and Forest are currently being referred for, why aren’t Villa as well?

Because it's based on a three year rolling period, and P&S losses aren't exactly the same as losses shown in company accounts.

 

[Sussex]

I'll be honest with ya, I haven't a clue what any of this means anymore except that the Sly 6 seem to benefit.

 

[riddick]

It's madness that the 14 "other" clubs in the Premier League are agreeing to this. They could easily call for an emergency vote and quash all this in no time. It makes no sense that the ONLY teams that are allowed to operate at a loss are the Scab 6 that got in before these were rules were made.

 

[MikeH72]

It's madness that the 14 "other" clubs in the Premier League are agreeing to this. They could easily call for an emergency vote and quash all this in no time. It makes no sense that the ONLY teams that are allowed to operate at a loss are the Scab 6 that got in before these were rules were made.

The problem is bums like Luton will be made up with these rules because it’s currently the only way they have a hope of staying up, and they don’t care about ever doing anything else, and that’s all anyone cares about really. “I’m alright Jack” mentality.

 

[Cake]

this just shows that the rules were not fit for purpose, if us, forest, Chelsea, city and now Leicester are all on the precipice (or over) the limit, thats 25% of the group not compliant, there must be others that are close and make it through good management or fortune (our case mismanagement and misfortune)

The rule is a bad rule. Good rules are largely self enforcing.

Throw Villa in there as well? £119.6m losses for 22/23. Same amount as us is it?

 

[nsno-chris]

The " " button has arrived, be ready to feel my love you beautiful people UTFT

Respect @GrandOldTeam

use it wisely

Trade it for NEG REP every day of the week

 

[Cake]

Throw Villa in there as well? £119.6m losses for 22/23. Same amount as us is it?

How do I change my forum name to Yoda…