2023/24 Sean Dyche

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Can I just say the term knee-jerk banded about by the Dyche fangirls...

This manager before yesterday won 2 in 16, lost all but 1 of the last 7 home games, lost all home games this season not scoring a goal and after one result they are all claiming Dyche to be the messiah... a prime example of knee jerking!

Those of us not knee jerking will see how he continues to fare going forward....
 

Anyone who could not see yesterday's result coming really should not follow football of any descriptions.
Will be injuries to threadbare squad that will be the downfall of Dyche, won't be style or man management. And give yourselves a head wobble if injury is your hope.
 
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NilSatisOptimum said:
Anyone who could not see yesterday's result coming really should not follow football of any descriptions.
Will be injuries to threadbare squad that will be the downfall of Dyche, won't be style or man management. And give yourselves a head wobble if injury is your hope.
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You should be a bookie mate. They obviously never. Brentford were odds on to win.
Dont see many poor bookies.
 
ForeverEverton said:
Can I just say the term knee-jerk banded about by the Dyche fangirls...

This manager before yesterday won 2 in 16, lost all but 1 of the last 7 home games, lost all home games this season not scoring a goal and after one result they are all claiming Dyche to be the messiah... a prime example of knee jerking!

Those of us not knee jerking will see how he continues to fare going forward....
Click to expand...

If you only ever judge a manager based on results, then fair enough.

What I'd say is that sometimes, for whatever reason, you don't get the result that a performance deserves. The fella is by no means the messiah, but to my eyes the team has basically been very unlucky. Granted the result is what really matters but generally speaking if you play better than your opponent then more often than not you'll get the result. That side of things has improved massively since this time last year and the entire basis of my opinion that Dyche is improving us is centred around the fact that we have, quite demonstrably, improved in terms of performances.

At some point that has to be turned into points, but I'm not having people using last season and the points tally etc from that as a stick to beat him with - he took over a team in the relegation zone that was 19th, 3 points from safety and had just sold its top scorer without replacing him with anyone. The remit was to keep us up and he did that. Frankly even that is an enormous tick in the box as it seemed improbable. After that I sort of draw a line under it and judge it based on what I'm seeing and, the ball not going in the net aside, I've seen very little that hasn't felt like progress to what I saw 12 months ago.

If at Christmas, we are in the bottom three then fair enough I'll hold my hands up and say he hasn't improved us and we'll need to make another change but I'm relatively confident based on what I've seen that we won't need to worry about that
 

GN! said:
Ok now be honest with what we have in terms of players, who is this mythical shamen that could have propelled this club to the grandiose heights you demand
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Ok il give you an example,
Villa were floating in and around us last season before Emery came in and then ended up in Europe because they got themselves a good manager.
I dont remember anyone saying Villa are too good to be down there.

De Zerbi at Brighton has Milner Welbeck Lallana Dunk in his team and has them smashing teams and playing great football
Would you swap Milner or Lallana for Garner or Onana?
Or would you swap Welbeck for DCL or Beto
Would you rather have McNeil or Solly March?
Would you swap there keeper for Pickford?

Spurs new manager i know its early but they have just lost one of the best CF in the world and are playing great football and flying high and banging goals in left right and centre.

The point is if you have a manager who has a clue you can fly up this league without having superstars or spending loads of money.
Dyches style keeps us in the place where we all want to get away from (bottom half)

To answer your question on who we should get, i dont know but we should be looking now!

A manager who improves players
A manager who improves teams
A manager who has an style of play
A manager who maximizes what he has at his disposal
 
toffeeblue9 said:
If you only ever judge a manager based on results, then fair enough.

What I'd say is that sometimes, for whatever reason, you don't get the result that a performance deserves. The fella is by no means the messiah, but to my eyes the team has basically been very unlucky. Granted the result is what really matters but generally speaking if you play better than your opponent then more often than not you'll get the result. That side of things has improved massively since this time last year and the entire basis of my opinion that Dyche is improving us is centred around the fact that we have, quite demonstrably, improved in terms of performances.

At some point that has to be turned into points, but I'm not having people using last season and the points tally etc from that as a stick to beat him with - he took over a team in the relegation zone that was 19th, 3 points from safety and had just sold its top scorer without replacing him with anyone. The remit was to keep us up and he did that. Frankly even that is an enormous tick in the box as it seemed improbable. After that I sort of draw a line under it and judge it based on what I'm seeing and, the ball not going in the net aside, I've seen very little that hasn't felt like progress to what I saw 12 months ago.

If at Christmas, we are in the bottom three then fair enough I'll hold my hands up and say he hasn't improved us and we'll need to make another change but I'm relatively confident based on what I've seen that we won't need to worry about thhat
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A good measured response...

Unfortunately if you look at other managers sacked it is due to results not how lucky or unlucky they were and ultimately the results are all that matters, I agree performances have been better this season and when that becomes the norm across the last 5 games (Excl. Villa and Arsenal) then there has to be something the manager can`t fix, potentially. Yesterday was a really good step but in my mind that doesn`t make up for our poor start until we can get back on to a PPG of 1.00, wins v Luton and Bournemouth would be a good recovery.

I`m of the opinion defensive managers like Allardyce, Mourinho, Conte have had their day and the managers with possession based attacking intent like Pep, Arteta and Postecoglou (who is showing up Conte at Spurs without Harry Kane) will be the managers that will thrive in modern football. It is so frustrating to have the players but the manager reigns them in to defend.

This set of players CAN play football, we`ve seen it, but the manager will set up like v Arsenal instead of having a go at them and attacking. As a fan I know which I`d prefer..... I also know which approach will bring a fervent Goodison in to play.

I`m not going to claim Dyche has turned it around after 1 game, the next 2 will still be as important as before but Dyche needs more performances picking up points like yesterday and going to attack than Villa and Arsenal games.
 
JLW said:
Ok il give you an example,
Villa were floating in and around us last season before Emery came in and then ended up in Europe because they got themselves a good manager.
I dont remember anyone saying Villa are too good to be down there.

De Zerbi at Brighton has Milner Welbeck Lallana Dunk in his team and has them smashing teams and playing great football
Would you swap Milner or Lallana for Garner or Onana?
Or would you swap Welbeck for DCL or Beto
Would you rather have McNeil or Solly March?
Would you swap there keeper for Pickford?

Spurs new manager i know its early but they have just lost one of the best CF in the world and are playing great football and flying high and banging goals in left right and centre.

The point is if you have a manager who has a clue you can fly up this league without having superstars or spending loads of money.
Dyches style keeps us in the place where we all want to get away from (bottom half)

To answer your question on who we should get, i dont know but we should be looking now!

A manager who improves players
A manager who improves teams
A manager who has an style of play
A manager who maximizes what he has at his disposal
Click to expand...
Would emery coach this squad
Would De Zerbi coach this squad
 

ForeverEverton said:
A good measured response...

Unfortunately if you look at other managers sacked it is due to results not how lucky or unlucky they were and ultimately the results are all that matters, I agree performances have been better this season and when that becomes the norm across the last 5 games (Excl. Villa and Arsenal) then there has to be something the manager can`t fix, potentially. Yesterday was a really good step but in my mind that doesn`t make up for our poor start until we can get back on to a PPG of 1.00, wins v Luton and Bournemouth would be a good recovery.

I`m of the opinion defensive managers like Allardyce, Mourinho, Conte have had their day and the managers with possession based attacking intent like Pep, Arteta and Postecoglou (who is showing up Conte at Spurs without Harry Kane) will be the managers that will thrive in modern football. It is so frustrating to have the players but the manager reigns them in to defend.

This set of players CAN play football, we`ve seen it, but the manager will set up like v Arsenal instead of having a go at them and attacking. As a fan I know which I`d prefer..... I also know which approach will bring a fervent Goodison in to play.

I`m not going to claim Dyche has turned it around after 1 game, the next 2 will still be as important as before but Dyche needs more performances picking up points like yesterday and going to attack than Villa and Arsenal games.
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I think your point falls down on the basis that the managers you named are all managing teams with much, much better players than ours. If we had a squad like Spurs's for instance, I'd absolutely agree that a more expansive approach would be better but we have a squad which has been on the verge of relegation for two years on the bounce and we simply don't have the quality to play the way you're suggesting. That's pretty subjective as there's no real data to back up either perspective.

You're right in that results will have to come - where my opinion differs here I guess is that, if we take Lampard as an example - there was nothing in the performances which made me think it was ever going to get any better. The data and your own eyes were telling you things were grim. With Dyche, results so far haven't really been any better (we were also on 4 points from 6 games at this stage of last season) but the performance levels are night and day from last year.

It will count for nothing if that doesn't translate into points fairly soon, but whereas last season I knew from v early on that we were going to struggle, I'm not of that opinion currently. I'm not saying that we are going to be challenging for Europe or even finishing in the top half, but what I've seen on the pitch this season isn't relegation standard. I'll look pretty silly if the results simply don't come, but the law of averages says that if the performances continue as they have been, we'll do alright.
 
JLW said:
Absolutely they would mate.

Thats what sets them apart from the likes of Dyche Benitez Allardyce etc.... They are forward thinking afraid of no team type of managers.
We would have more points on the board than we have now.
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Emery is a pragmatic manager mate. Did you watch his Villareal side at all? You cut your cloth and play the type of football that gets the most out of the players you have and the way he has Villa playing isn't particularly similar to the way Villareal played - ergo if he was managing Everton, there's absolutely no reason to believe he wouldn't be playing pragmatically either.
 
JLW said:
Absolutely they would mate.

Thats what sets them apart from the likes of Dyche Benitez Allardyce etc.... They are forward thinking afraid of no team type of managers.
We would have more points on the board than we have now.
Click to expand...
You reckon with a current owner who wants out ergo ain’t gonna put a penny more in?
 
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