Financial Fair Play investigation

[catcherintherye]

Mate you're just talking nonsense now.

I'm just summarising your position, which is nonsense yes.

Several PL clubs have already indicated they are looking at legal options.

 

[Damo_1878]

Writing in block capitals doesnt make you correct, it just shows you're not confident in your position, which is reasonable enough.

I'm afraid, business can take other business to court if they wish, and they do not need the consent of the other party to do so. This is just very obvious I'm afraid.

And as indicated again, stamping your feet and screaming "no no no" doesnt prevent it happening.

You've been told by myself and a lawyer in this very thread about this and you just ignore what people tell you.

You have zero comprehension of corporate litigation. Zero.

You can only sue if you have "cause"

Where in the rulebook which is a legal Contract between the league and clubs has cause been generated?

When you figure that out. Come back to me

 

[Johnnytotal]

I've got little hope left but I have a get out if jail card .

 

[Damo_1878]

I'm just summarising your position, which is nonsense yes.

Several PL clubs have already indicated they are looking at legal options.

They can look all they want.

They can only sue if they have grounds to

If the premier league rulebook is followed they have no grounds and no cause

If they attempt to sue they'll lose.

And then have to pay costs. Which are considerable.

 

[catcherintherye]

You've been told by myself and a lawyer in this very thread about this and you just ignore what people tell you.

You have zero comprehension of corporate litigation. Zero.

You can only sue if you have "cause"

Where in the rulebook which is a legal Contract between the league and clubs has cause been generated?

When you figure that out. Come back to me

I'm not sure any lawyer has told me anything.

I dont have any expertise in corporate litigation, and neither do you. But I understand that businesses have the right to seek legal address.

A rulebook isnt really a firm legal contract, and is overridden by national laws. If a club feels they have just cause, they could seek legal redress.

Now if your argument is Everton may not have just cause, that is a different matter, and one which is an entirely different discussion. But in prunciple, there is a world, where a business can take another business to court, even if they do not consent.

To quote you, when you figure that out, we can all move forward with this discussion.

Essentially, the PL means F/A when compared to the sovereign rules of a country. Try it. Draw a contract up between you and your mates, do something illegal, and see how that document holds up.

 

[Damo_1878]

I'm not sure any lawyer has told me anything.

I dont have any expertise in corporate litigation, and neither do you. But I understand that businesses have the right to seek legal address.

A rulebook isnt really a firm legal contract, and is overridden by national laws. If a club feels they have just cause, they could seek legal redress.

Now if your argument is Everton may not have just cause, that is a different matter, and one which is an entirely different discussion. But in prunciple, there is a world, where a business can take another business to court, even if they do not consent.

To quote you, when you figure that out, we can all move forward with this discussion.

Essentially, the PL means F/A when compared to the sovereign rules of a country. Try it. Draw a contract up between you and your mates, do something illegal, and see how that document holds up.

You're wrong there. In terms of my experience.

You're also wrong. The rulebook is a legal contract.

You're just wittering on at this point. Talking nonsense.

As I already said to you.

Where in the rulebook which is a legal Contract between the league and clubs has cause been generated?

When you figure that out. Come back to me

 

[catcherintherye]

They can look all they want.

They can only sue if they have grounds to

If the premier league rulebook is followed they have no grounds and no cause

If they attempt to sue they'll lose.

And then have to pay costs. Which are considerable.

Well your argument is that nobody can ever sue, whether they have grounds to or not.

I am pointing out, they can sue if they have grounds too.

I dont know enough about the case to say whether any of them, including EFC do in the specific of the case. But theoretically, there is a world where a club could sue either another club, or the league, and as indicted to you previously, many are considering this.

But as you say, you know better than the legal advisors they have, because you can parrot the PL rulebook (not a meaningful legal document) and stamp your feet and shout in block capitals.

 

[badloaf]

Unless we show some level of miraculous player scouting or suddenly find some good players in our youth system, if we go to 60-70% we'll end up relegated anyway. Lower wages get you Tom Davies and Maupay style players. We can't win really

But Davies and Maupay should never have been given the contracts they’re on. If they’d gone to supposedly ‘lesser’ clubs, they wouldn’t have got them there. We’re artificially keeping journeymen players at the top level when we should be letting mediocre players leave and recruiting younger potential.

If we do go down, there’s no way this board would be able to get us back up given both their utterly cack player acquisition and business management of the last few years. You really have to wonder how Moshiri made his money if he thinks this shower are credible managers of any business.

 

[catcherintherye]

You're wrong there. In terms of my experience.

You're also wrong. The rulebook is a legal contract.

You're just wittering on at this point. Talking nonsense.

The rulebook could be interpreted as a legal document of sorts. It's a contract. But contracts can be overridden and challenged.

That you dont seem to think that's possible, in any circumstance is astonishing. Such acriticality of a rulebook. Jesus.

 

[Mrk]

Writing in block capitals doesnt make you correct, it just shows you're not confident in your position, which is reasonable enough.

I'm afraid, business can take other business to court if they wish, and they do not need the consent of the other party to do so. This is just very obvious I'm afraid.

And as indicated again, stamping your feet and screaming "no no no" doesnt prevent it happening.

In fairness, I don't think he's suggesting otherwise, he's just correctly identifying that CAS can't be used as part of an appeals process.

Everton could sue the Premier League independently for loss of earnings if they felt they had cause, but that could only happen retrospectively - we wouldn't get the points back or be reinstated to the league if we went down as no court has the ability to to adjudicate on that, but we could receive compensation if the court found in our favour.

 

[Damo_1878]

Well your argument is that nobody can ever sue, whether they have grounds to or not.

I am pointing out, they can sue if they have grounds too.

I dont know enough about the case to say whether any of them, including EFC do in the specific of the case. But theoretically, there is a world where a club could sue either another club, or the league, and as indicted to you previously, many are considering this.

But as you say, you know better than the legal advisors they have, because you can parrot the PL rulebook (not a meaningful legal document) and stamp your feet and shout in block capitals.

Do you actually know how to sue someone? Or a company?

And for you to say the Premier League rulebook is "not a meaningful legal document" just shows you know nothing of what you're talking about.

 

[catcherintherye]

In fairness, I don't think he's suggesting otherwise, he's just correctly identifying that CAS can't be used as part of an appeals process.

Everton could sue the Premier League independently for loss of earnings if they felt they had cause, but that could only happen retrospectively - we wouldn't get the points back or be reinstated to the league if we went down as no court has the ability to to adjudicate on that, but we could receive compensation if the court found in our favour.

Well he suggested exactly that, which is why I challenged it.

And I understand what the PL rulebook says. It's also worth saying, it would be unlikely if a court trial was going on, that the PL would go through with penalties. They would be opening themselves up to such liability.

But yes, Everton or others could launch a civil claim. But again Damo doesnt think it's possible, when it is.

 

[catcherintherye]

Do you actually know how to sue someone? Or a company?

And for you to say the Premier League rulebook is "not a meaningful legal document" just shows you know nothing of what you're talking about.

Yes I have successfully mitigated against someone. I know that they did not wish to go to court, so I did not need their consent (the opposite of what you had said).

And it's not, comparatively speaking. It is a legal document, as it's a signed agreement, but it's not as enshrined as something such as a Bill of Rights. That you cant grasp this sort of indicates how little you know.

That and multiple other falsehoods you have stated. The one about only being able to take people to court if they agree being a personal favourite.

 

[Mrk]

Well he suggested exactly that, which is why I challenged it.

And I understand what the PL rulebook says. It's also worth saying, it would be unlikely if a court trial was going on, that the PL would go through with penalties. They would be opening themselves up to such liability.

But yes, Everton or others could launch a civil claim. But again Damo doesnt think it's possible, when it is.

But Everton could only sue the Premier League after the points deduction had been applied and no further appeals process was possible - you can't sue another party because "they might do something we don't agree with", you have to be able to prove damages before a court will even entertain a hearing.

If the PL give us a points deduction (or any other penalty for that matter) and that still stands after the appeals process Everton have agreed to as a shareholder of the league, there is nothing the club can do to reverse that. All they could do is sue the league for loss of earnings, but we wouldn't, because it would be frivolous in the extreme unless genuine wrongdoing or corruption on the PL's part could be proven.

 

[Efcjake]

Are we going to cease to exist come may?

If we're relegated it will probably be done by September