Who would we miss

[Dymak]

But it should be done in phases, not a cull.

Hibbert has amassed 328 games
Gibson 177
Osman 453
Pienaar 423
McGeady 386
Oviedo 85
Naismith 376

Thats 2228 games between them at varying levels.

Ridding the squad of that experience in one blow and bringing in Yarmolenko is just about the most bonkers suggestion I've seen. You'd be ripping the squad of al ot of qualities that the kids you've named can't bring a)on their own as they are a different type of player b)without the support of the more experienced players.

It isn't short-term-ism, it's logical common-sense.

They may have ammassed 2228 games between them over the last 15 years, but how many games will they amass in the next 12 - 24 months, and at what level will they be playing at, and for which club? Most of these players are a waste of wages, which could be used to attract far better players that are capable of playing in the first team.

Pienaar is on over 70k a week and offers nothing. I'll be surprised if he finds another club after Everton. Retirement is imminent.

Osman offers next to nothing, retirement is imminent, people were dismayed when Moyes extended his last contract at age 32. He will also probably be on about 40k a week at least. He just isn't worth what he is costing. He needs to be let go in the summer.

Gibson, McGeady, Oviedo and Naismith are still capable of playing first team football in the Premier League, but I don't think they are good enough for Everton, and most of them aren't even first choice cover. We could receive a substantial amount of money through selling these players, and save a lot of money in wages. This money could be much better spent elsewhere, on younger, fitter, better players.

I think a single very good player, like a Yarmolenko, would offer far more than all of these players combined. Just like Deulofeu offers far more than all of these players combined.

 

[Dithering Dougie]

But it should be done in phases, not a cull.

Hibbert has amassed 328 games
Gibson 177
Osman 453
Pienaar 423
McGeady 386
Oviedo 85
Naismith 376

Thats 2228 games between them at varying levels.

Ridding the squad of that experience in one blow and bringing in Yarmolenko is just about the most bonkers suggestion I've seen. You'd be ripping the squad of al ot of qualities that the kids you've named can't bring a)on their own as they are a different type of player b)without the support of the more experienced players.

It isn't short-term-ism, it's logical common-sense.

Love the way some think you can get shut of a number of players to bring in one and saying there always injured, like the incoming player is indestructible or something.

 

[mkrudden]

They may have ammassed 2228 games between them over the last 15 years, but how many games will they amass in the next 12 - 24 months, and at what level will they be playing at, and for which club? Most of these players are a waste of wages, which could be used to attract far better players that are capable of playing in the first team.

Pienaar is on over 70k a week and offers nothing. I'll be surprised if he finds another club after Everton. Retirement is imminent.

Osman offers next to nothing, retirement is imminent, people were dismayed when Moyes extended his last contract at age 32. He will also probably be on about 40k a week at least. He just isn't worth what he is costing. He needs to be let go in the summer.

Gibson, McGeady, Oviedo and Naismith are still capable of playing first team football in the Premier League, but I don't think they are good enough for Everton, and most of them aren't even first choice cover. We could receive a substantial amount of money through selling these players, and save a lot of money in wages. This money could be much better spent elsewhere, on younger, fitter, better players.

I think a single very good player, like a Yarmolenko, would offer far more than all of these players combined. Just like Deulofeu offers far more than all of these players combined.

But you looking purely at the match day team and considering nothing else. In any line of work there are those experienced staff that contribute less on a day to day basis than the eager graduates or those with their careers ahead of them. The reason these people are kept within the company, and the squad, is because they offer insight, experience and "know-how" as RM likes to put it.

I haven't at any point said "we need these players because they are contributing a lot of the pitch". Most of them aren't getting in the team. In the background, I am positive that they are coaching and guiding the younger players whilst putting them under pressure for the place that they are occupying.
Ledson coming through the ranks with Gibson, Barry and McCarthy as mentors is brilliant. Oviedo is an international footballer, and with Baines are going to be passing on their experiences and techniques to Garbutt and Galloway. Osman and Hibbert are scousers and are able cover whilst the younger players are developing.

They will be phased out and so they should, but dropping a nuke in the squad and turning to these youngsters and saying "not only have we rid the club of the experience, you guys are now the back up to the first team without any bedding in period" is bonkers.

 

[Brennan]

This sort of short termism astounds me.

How many of those outfield players are actually regularly in 1st team squads?

How is it short termism to get rid of 9 players and replace them with three you fool ?

 

[Brennan]

But you looking purely at the match day team and considering nothing else. In any line of work there are those experienced staff that contribute less on a day to day basis than the eager graduates or those with their careers ahead of them. The reason these people are kept within the company, and the squad, is because they offer insight, experience and "know-how" as RM likes to put it.

I haven't at any point said "we need these players because they are contributing a lot of the pitch". Most of them aren't getting in the team. In the background, I am positive that they are coaching and guiding the younger players whilst putting them under pressure for the place that they are occupying.
Ledson coming through the ranks with Gibson, Barry and McCarthy as mentors is brilliant. Oviedo is an international footballer, and with Baines are going to be passing on their experiences and techniques to Garbutt and Galloway. Osman and Hibbert are scousers and are able cover whilst the younger players are developing.

They will be phased out and so they should, but dropping a nuke in the squad and turning to these youngsters and saying "not only have we rid the club of the experience, you guys are now the back up to the first team without any bedding in period" is bonkers.

Long as he doesn't ask Darron for driving lessons.

 

[Dymak]

But you looking purely at the match day team and considering nothing else. In any line of work there are those experienced staff that contribute less on a day to day basis than the eager graduates or those with their careers ahead of them. The reason these people are kept within the company, and the squad, is because they offer insight, experience and "know-how" as RM likes to put it.

I haven't at any point said "we need these players because they are contributing a lot of the pitch". Most of them aren't getting in the team. In the background, I am positive that they are coaching and guiding the younger players whilst putting them under pressure for the place that they are occupying.
Ledson coming through the ranks with Gibson, Barry and McCarthy as mentors is brilliant. Oviedo is an international footballer, and with Baines are going to be passing on their experiences and techniques to Garbutt and Galloway. Osman and Hibbert are scousers and are able cover whilst the younger players are developing.

They will be phased out and so they should, but dropping a nuke in the squad and turning to these youngsters and saying "not only have we rid the club of the experience, you guys are now the back up to the first team without any bedding in period" is bonkers.

Nobody is dropping a nuke. Their contracts end in six months and we face a decision as to whether we let them go or keep them on. You may think that the words of the mature and headstrong Darron Gibson are worth 40k a week (2 million pound a year) but I think that's seriously bad value for money, and that the 2 million pound a year would be better spent on someone who is capable of improving the first team.

 

[bluestevon]

But it should be done in phases, not a cull.

Hibbert has amassed 328 games
Gibson 177
Osman 453
Pienaar 423
McGeady 386
Oviedo 85
Naismith 376

Thats 2228 games between them at varying levels.

Ridding the squad of that experience in one blow and bringing in Yarmolenko is just about the most bonkers suggestion I've seen. You'd be ripping the squad of al ot of qualities that the kids you've named can't bring a)on their own as they are a different type of player b)without the support of the more experienced players.

It isn't short-term-ism, it's logical common-sense.

Pretty good post that one mate, the first line said it all really as well.

For what my own opinion is worth (not much i will admit)

McGeady and Naismith could be moved on this January to a team that they will play more for and who wants them without causing any major disruption, McGeady has just been a mistake sicne day one and Naismith you have to assume would still interest Norwich and frankly he is a huge square peg in a round system

Pienaar, Osman and Hibberts contracts all run out this summer and they should be thanked and wished luck with their future careers, if they retire then Hibbert especially should be offered some role to keep him within the club - should he be suited to any

Gibson and Oviedo - Leaning towards a one year extension on relatively low wages with incentives if they can maintain fitness and in Gibsons case stay out of trouble.

But we need to bring in quality additions to offset any dent to morale from players who may be quite popular and liked at the club

 

[Zatara]

Haha i am a "fool" yet you believe that 9 sub-standard players (6 of which cant get near the bench) are better value than 3 with two going directly into the first 11.

How obtuse.

How is it short termism to get rid of 9 players and replace them with three you fool ?

 

[Zatara]

Think best to keep Robles as Howards wages are higher...

McGeady and Naismith would fetch money and the others just save on wages

Think we should keep 1 goalie, apart from that it looks like a good plan. Wonder if we'd get any money for any of them, after all Norwich were supposedly in for Naismith @ 8m ... and some of the struggling teams / newbies may need to buy 'experience'.

 

[Zatara]

@bluestevon highlighted that in the summer Oviedo, Pienaar hibbert,osman will be out of contract....they arent playing and certainly arent coaches so adios.

We should also shift McGeady an Naismith in Jan...gibson i think no one would want so stuck with him really.

Howard, hopefully has a change of heart and goes to the MLS.

Jags/Baines/Barry as the three senior players.

But it should be done in phases, not a cull.

Hibbert has amassed 328 games
Gibson 177
Osman 453
Pienaar 423
McGeady 386
Oviedo 85
Naismith 376

Thats 2228 games between them at varying levels.

Ridding the squad of that experience in one blow and bringing in Yarmolenko is just about the most bonkers suggestion I've seen. You'd be ripping the squad of al ot of qualities that the kids you've named can't bring a)on their own as they are a different type of player b)without the support of the more experienced players.

It isn't short-term-ism, it's logical common-sense.

 

[sportbillyblue]

But you looking purely at the match day team and considering nothing else. In any line of work there are those experienced staff that contribute less on a day to day basis than the eager graduates or those with their careers ahead of them. The reason these people are kept within the company, and the squad, is because they offer insight, experience and "know-how" as RM likes to put it.

I really don't see how many of these players offer any insight or "know how". In the case of the older players and those that have seen little playing time in the past 2 seasons I doubt that their perspective is current, if anything it would possibly be self-serving as they try to eek out the last big paydays.

I also doubt that they are coaching or guiding the younger players either. I've seen 5 U21 games this year and not seen any of the listed players attend any of these matches except when they've been playing. Martinez and the 1st Team coaching staff regularly attend the U21 games and it should be them and Unsworth coaching our bright, young things in a proper, structured manner. Makes me shudder to think of some of those listed let loose coaching anyone, let alone the young talent.

"Ledson coming through the ranks with Gibson, Barry and McCarthy as mentors is brilliant." I truly hope not.

If getting rid of most of the listed players realises a significant reduction in our wage bill and raise funds to bring in 1 or 2 'Yarmalenko~esque'
like quality players and allows more focus on bringing some of the quality youngsters through .. I'm all for it.

Chelsea are not the force they were and obviously have big problems, some of the other top teams are struggling and will be consumed in part by European commitments .. I think we should be looking at this season as a good opportunity to make the Top 4 .... and if that means bringing in top talent in January then it must be done.

 

[mkrudden]

I really don't see how many of these players offer any insight or "know how". In the case of the older players and those that have seen little playing time in the past 2 seasons I doubt that their perspective is current, if anything it would possibly be self-serving as they try to eek out the last big paydays.

I also doubt that they are coaching or guiding the younger players either. I've seen 5 U21 games this year and not seen any of the listed players attend any of these matches except when they've been playing. Martinez and the 1st Team coaching staff regularly attend the U21 games and it should be them and Unsworth coaching our bright, young things in a proper, structured manner. Makes me shudder to think of some of those listed let loose coaching anyone, let alone the young talent.

"Ledson coming through the ranks with Gibson, Barry and McCarthy as mentors is brilliant." I truly hope not.

If getting rid of most of the listed players realises a significant reduction in our wage bill and raise funds to bring in 1 or 2 'Yarmalenko~esque'
like quality players and allows more focus on bringing some of the quality youngsters through .. I'm all for it.

Chelsea are not the force they were and obviously have big problems, some of the other top teams are struggling and will be consumed in part by European commitments .. I think we should be looking at this season as a good opportunity to make the Top 4 .... and if that means bringing in top talent in January then it must be done.

But they all train together. Every day?

 

[mkrudden]

@bluestevon highlighted that in the summer Oviedo, Pienaar hibbert,osman will be out of contract....they arent playing and certainly arent coaches so adios.

We should also shift McGeady an Naismith in Jan...gibson i think no one would want so stuck with him really.

Howard, hopefully has a change of heart and goes to the MLS.

Jags/Baines/Barry as the three senior players.

3 senior players? And you think that's enough?

Each to their own. I think that's about 5 or 6 short of what's needed for balance.

 

[Zatara]

But the 5/6 additional dont get near the bench...and probably never will do again.

3 senior players? And you think that's enough?

Each to their own. I think that's about 5 or 6 short of what's needed for balance.

 

[chrismpw]

How can this entirely hypothetical thread about people in and out, be any different from my thread assessing the virtues of 2 players we entirely could lose, which was locked?

Right fuming here!

 

[Zatara]

If we go with the "2 players for every position" next season:

GK= Robles
LB = Baines / Garbutt / Galloway
LCB = Jagielka / Mori
RCB = Stones / Browning
RB = Coleman / Holgate /Pennington
DM = Barry / Besic
DM = McCarthy
CM = Barkley / Cleverley
LW = Kone / Mirallas
CF = Lukaku
RW = Deulofeu / Lennon

3 new players added to that.

I'd actually favour this:
GK= New Player / Robles
LB = Baines / Garbutt / Galloway
LCB = Jagielka / Mori
RCB = Stones / Browning
RB = Coleman / Holgate /Pennington
DM = McCarthy / Besic/ Barry
CM = Barkley / Cleverley
AM = New Player / New Player
LW = Kone / Mirallas
CF = Lukaku /New player
RW = Deulofeu / Lennon

Obviously thats 4 players but we could perhaps get away with 3 with just one Attacking midfielder signed as others in midfield can play several positions.

Seems far more logical to me than having 9 players not good enough and eating wages

 

[mkrudden]

But the 5/6 additional dont get near the bench...and probably never will do again.

We are going round in circles.
Let's agree to disagree mate.