Ross Barkley

[MikeH72]

I'm intrigued as to why no club has even looked like showing an interest in Barkley if he's as good as our wise old sage Day Vek says. Just has me thinking.

 

[davek]

Dave,I have a lot of time for many of your comments which might seem 'controversial' for many posters, but think you're off target re Ross. There are no, none at all, genuine Evertonians who do not want Ross to succeed at Everton, but its looking more and more unlikely that he will make progress....unless Koeman does not lose patience as quickly as we know he can. Ross is no longer an 'established international'...while he was an 'established international squad member' he is no longer this.He has a fight to regain any international status,and in the same way he has to fight for his position as an established Everton first teamer. Football is a cruel game....there are many brilliant technical players who spend their careers plying a trade in the lower leagues,or with also ran Prem and ELC clubs and most of them have been through a time, however briefly, when they were described as 'the next big thing'. Bad luck, injury, personality problems, bad management, management that is 'too good',lack of self belief,physical weakness, mental weakness, major loss of form, all these and much more effect a p[layer striving for the top.
But....the 'skill' that any player wanting to succeed needs is an ability to play to his personal physical and mental strengths(use his 'football brain' in other words) and do it quickly enough to pressurise the opposition.

All the basic ability in the world is no use if you don't have the desire and work ethic to succeed.No one, but no one, gets an easy ride to the top.

Steve, we'll see later on today whether his international career has stalled or not. I suspect Southgate will choose him again.

The thing with some players is that they are quite obviously thoroughbred classic horses amongst a load of handicapped nags. It's a bit much to use that analogy fully on Ross's situation here but it's a decent enough shout to demonstrate the "problems" he has (such as they are - exaggerated by a manager who should keep his own counsel, IMO) is one mainly brought about by being asked to join in with the type of heavy defensive lifting that's suitable for those less gifted. If you insist on that then you don't get the full benefit of his attacking threat. As said above in response to another post, he's a specialist. Maybe he's not what Koeman wants and the managerprefers to see everyone roll their sleeves up and get stuck in. That's not me being snobbish on RBs behalf btw, I'm just stating the case for specialism over a general type of effort for one particularly talented footballer that we have. Again as stated above: play him with the defensive responsibilities off his shoulders or sell him. That's the choice Koeman has.

 

[davek]

There wasn't much movement last year after February...

It's up to Barkley mate.

He played well the other day I felt - up until his mistake that led to their goal (ultimately).

One chances summed up Barkley atm.

He burst through the ranks of Palace brilliantly, and had the entire half to run into. He had Lukaku to his left and Bolasie to his right - both of whom had made good runs.

He slowed down, and then decided to shoot from range.

An in form Barkley makes the right call in that moment. IMO, he shouldn't be looking any further than watching what De Bruyne does.

We committed numbers as always under RM to attack: that's how a player like Barkley came through and had his impact. Don't commit many to attack: don't expect Barkley to have the same impact.

 

[davek]

So you would drop Barry and allow Barkley to be a poor man's Toure?

I hope Koeman can teach him how to defend.

He'd have more of an impact from back there yes. But I'd say that RB playing so deep needs a very good quality team around him to get away with it....do you think Yaya Toure could have been played as one of our two CMs with the defensive fragility all around him? He'd have been responsible for multiple opposition goals if he had.

 

[Lowste]

That's a much simpler and better way of putting it.

I really fear for our midfield against a Guardiola City. They are going to just pass right through us. It could be a cricket score. Either that or we will park the bus.

I think Gueye and McCarthy can do enough to stifle teams in energy, amd this then can leave space for the more creative players.
I am a big fan of Barry, but things are getting quicker and sadly he isn't.

 

[davek]

Wish he would show it more consistently. And Dave what is his specialism?

He's a Lampard or Toure type. Obviously he's not reached their heights yet, but at his age now he compares favourably with some of the best that's been seen in the PL.

It seems many want him gone though. And I think possibly that comes down to some supporters feeling that we need a more basic type of player for the objectives we want to reach in the short term. Which is fair enough I suppose, I just wish they'd articulate that and stop blaming RB for being what he is.

 

[Lowste]

Barry is absolutely key

He isn't mate
Barkley is key as he is the future
Sadly Barry will only ever get slower which puts pressure centrally in the midfield
Make no bones I am a big fan of Barry, but we need to build for the future and he will not be part of it

 

[MartyMcFly]

He'd have more of an impact from back there yes. But I'd say that RB playing so deep needs a very good quality team around him to get away with it....do you think Yaya Toure could have been played as one of our two CMs with the defensive fragility all around him? He'd have been responsible for multiple opposition goals if he had.

I was actually referring to when Toure plays as a 10. I would drop Barkley back. I think he could dominate teams there and with Gueye alongside defensively we would be OK. I would then play Gerri as a 10. His work rate has improved and we have seen against Spurs he will press until he runs out of steam. His pace with the ball is frightening, one breakaway with Ross supplying him the ball and Rom up in support would be all it takes to score a goal.

It does require Barkley to improve defensively but the advantage would be would have more legs in midfield and a far superior and pacey attack.

 

[MartyMcFly]

He isn't mate
Barkley is key as he is the future
Sadly Barry will only ever get slower which puts pressure centrally in the midfield
Make no bones I am a big fan of Barry, but we need to build for the future and he will not be part of it

Honestly I'm not sure but Barry has been poor after a good start. We need to do what's right for the present and I think it's borderline.

 

[BlueToff]

We committed numbers as always under RM to attack: that's how a player like Barkley came through and had his impact. Don't commit many to attack: don't expect Barkley to have the same impact.

We committed just as much to attack the other night. It has very little to do with that.

Barkley's in a poor run of form where he makes one mistake and he seems to lose his head, despite initially starting well.

 

[BlueToff]

I'm intrigued as to why no club has even looked like showing an interest in Barkley if he's as good as our wise old sage Day Vek says. Just has me thinking.

Because we'd re-buff any offers anyway.

He isn't for sale. And he's a key part of the team. He's in poor form but it happens.

 

[davek]

I was actually referring to when Toure plays as a 10. I would drop Barkley back. I think he could dominate teams there and with Gueye alongside defensively we would be OK. I would then play Gerri as a 10. His work rate has improved and we have seen against Spurs he will press until he runs out of steam. His pace with the ball is frightening, one breakaway with Ross supplying him the ball and Rom up in support would be all it takes to score a goal.

It does require Barkley to improve defensively but the advantage would be would have more legs in midfield and a far superior and pacey attack.

Worth a try - and Koeman has stated Barkley might be played there.

 

[Toffeelover]

He's a Lampard or Toure type. Obviously he's not reached their heights yet, but at his age now he compares favourably with some of the best that's been seen in the PL.

It seems many want him gone though. And I think possibly that comes down to some supporters feeling that we need a more basic type of player for the objectives we want to reach in the short term. Which is fair enough I suppose, I just wish they'd articulate that and stop blaming RB for being what he is.

Dave I have never said I want him to leave on the conrary I have continually extorted him to show us what he is capable and do it consistently. If as you say RK is not playing him in his best position then surely RB needs to show RK where it is.

 

[billyblue80]

We need a passer in the ten role he can learn from and link with.

 

[Deco]

He's a Lampard or Toure type. Obviously he's not reached their heights yet, but at his age now he compares favourably with some of the best that's been seen in the PL.

It seems many want him gone though. And I think possibly that comes down to some supporters feeling that we need a more basic type of player for the objectives we want to reach in the short term. Which is fair enough I suppose, I just wish they'd articulate that and stop blaming RB for being what he is.

I've always thought he was very Toure-like. He's clearly got the talent and some people slate him even when he's played alright.

We should be building around him and Lukaku if anything. Two of the best players in their positions.