Ronald Koeman discussion

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davek said:
That's all I'm saying mate. Win and win style. There's no excuse not to try and do both if it's at all possible. And teams should be set up to win by playing in as stylish a manner possible. I do laugh at the people who trundle out the stuff about "i just want to win, I dont care about anything else". What an attitude to have. This is an entertainment too at the end of the day isn't it? Yes, be competitive, but as I've said before: the best teams ever at club or national level have almost ALWAYS been the best in the business at entertaining. Try and think of some that haven't and they are stand outs because they are exceptions to the rule. The Arsenal team under Graham or that Leicester team last season are good examples but are buried under a mountain of fine football exponents who lift the big trophies.

Pragmatism? Yes, but that just means joining the ranks of the exponents of fine football, because that is what gets the job done.
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Given that we have been winning in style in the last month, are you still not warming to Koeman at all?

Style is subjective, but I don't think any Goodison regular could have been leaving the match feeling short-changed over the last 6 weeks or so.

The build up play needs work but we've scored some fantastic goals and are playing committed, fast paced, winning football. It's ticking the boxes for me.
 

davek said:
That's all I'm saying mate. Win and win style. There's no excuse not to try and do both if it's at all possible. And teams should be set up to win by playing in as stylish a manner possible. I do laugh at the people who trundle out the stuff about "i just want to win, I dont care about anything else". What an attitude to have. This is an entertainment too at the end of the day isn't it? Yes, be competitive, but as I've said before: the best teams ever at club or national level have almost ALWAYS been the best in the business at entertaining. Try and think of some that haven't and they are stand outs because they are exceptions to the rule. The Arsenal team under Graham or that Leicester team last season are good examples but are buried under a mountain of fine football exponents who lift the big trophies.

Pragmatism? Yes, but that just means joining the ranks of the exponents of fine football, because that is what gets the job done.
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13 goals in the last 3 home games mate, I'd call that entertaining personally.
 
Mountfield1985 said:
Given that we have been winning in style in the last month, are you still not warming to Koeman at all?

Style is subjective, but I don't think any Goodison regular could have been leaving the match feeling short-changed over the last 6 weeks or so.

The build up play needs work but we've scored some fantastic goals and are playing committed, fast paced, winning football. It's ticking the boxes for me.
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I've acknowledged that performances are on the up and my resistance is lowered in unison with that. I dont like his character though. I dont think I'll ever warm to it.
 
Foot Long Hot Dog said:
13 goals in the last 3 home games mate, I'd call that entertaining personally.
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It has been. Which is why I haven't been poking people in the ribs of late and describing him as a hoofball merchant. He's going to have to make sure the entertainment levels are maintained when these bottlers dip again...which they WILL.
 
davek said:
It has been. Which is why I haven't been poking people in the ribs of late and describing him as a hoofball merchant. He's going to have to makes sure the entertainment levels are maintained when these bottlers dip again...which they WILL.
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After taking 17 points from 21 it's obvious that there'll be a dip at some point, as that's league winning form, so you're on safe ground there like.
 

davek said:
It has been. Which is why I haven't been poking people in the ribs of late and describing him as a hoofball merchant. He's going to have to make sure the entertainment levels are maintained when these bottlers dip again...which they WILL.
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That is a fair point, actually.

I called that City performance after Leicester effectively ended our season.

It'll be interesting to see if we do manage to overtake one of the teams above us if we can hold our nerve.

I think with the introduction of Davies, Lookman and Sneiderlin that they have a bit of a fearless attitude and it is rubbing off on our other players.

We could have easily bottled that Bournemouth game when they made it 3-2, but instead we got angry that it had even got to that stage.
 
If you could win the league with scrappy 1-0's or come 6th with some results like Saturday, but getting tonked by the likes of Chelsea, what would you choose?
 
davek said:
It has been. Which is why I haven't been poking people in the ribs of late and describing him as a hoofball merchant. He's going to have to make sure the entertainment levels are maintained when these bottlers dip again...which they WILL.
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Sorry to intrude Davek, but it appears to me that the only way you will 'like' Koeman is if the team score for fun every week and play like barcelona, but i have noticed you in the past for rubbishing the idea of Koeman managing Barcelona.

No manager in the world plays to the level you seem to expect from Koeman to deliver, even some of the best have bad spells or games where they grind a result out because they other team has learned how to play against them. the only comparable i can see from your viewpoint is that you compare our team with ones filled with the best players in the world and as good as some of them may be, they are not messi/ronaldo/muller level of players. These players cost great amounts of money to sign, so it is almost like Koeman on the whole is always going to fail in your mind unless he achieves something we have not since 1987, and win a league title.

for what it is worth, Koeman has had to manage a squad a players into his way of doing things and at first it didn't work as well, but since it sunk in we have seen our results improve quite a bit. Being negative to the manager so early on is a little bit short sighted i think, until he has had 2 seasons in charge we cannot really see his imprint in the team.
 

GwladysBlue said:
That is a fair point, actually.

I called that City performance after Leicester effectively ended our season.

It'll be interesting to see if we do manage to overtake one of the teams above us if we can hold our nerve.

I think with the introduction of Davies, Lookman and Sneiderlin that they have a bit of a fearless attitude and it is rubbing off on our other players.

We could have easily bottled that Bournemouth game when they made it 3-2, but instead we got angry that it had even got to that stage.
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That's the key for me, and signalled a possible shift in mentality for most of those players. Last year they would have completely crumbled once the fans started getting edgy and panicky. The 4th goal was brilliant, kept the ball calmly and waited patiently for an opening, then the superb cross and finish just brought out a wave of relief around the ground.
 
mikeh72 said:
That's the key for me, and signalled a possible shift in mentality for most of those players. Last year they would have completely crumbled once the fans started getting edgy and panicky. The 4th goal was brilliant, kept the ball calmly and waited patiently for an opening, then the superb cross and finish just brought out a wave of relief around the ground.
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There was 23 passes in the build up to that 4th goal, which came after he'd altered the system back to a 3 when Holgate came on.
 

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