Obama

[johnnydawg68]

Just a question how far away should they build it to be accepable ?

Obama will be good for the states in the long run but i can see him being assasinated before he gets his job done unfortunatly.

Great question. At what distance from Ground Zero is it acceptable to worship? Which mile marker does it go from being a slap in the face to being ok? Muslims died in 9/11 too. This kind of jinoistic BS is exactly the fuel the Islamofascists love. Instead of promoting moderate Muslims in this country we simply paint with a broad brush and give the assholes around the world a reason to say "look, the Americans don't really care about you".

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I always live in hope that one day politics will be able to be debated without it getting aggressive and nasty. Alas it would seem that this isn't that day.

 

[TX Bill]

The coming mid-term elections are way too early for the Democrats to turn the tide.

Incumbent presidents (unless it's a wartime scenario) are invariably unpopular. That's just the way it is.

You talk of me lacking knowledge and you're calling Obama a socialist. Incredible. You have socialist parties in the US. Go and check their agenda out. I doubt it's to hand over bail out money to banks and industries and continue an imperialist policy abroad.

Socialist agenda? Friend, you really need help. Not least to look up the word, "socialist". And then back to your rifle, lethal injections and God is American you go. Good God almighty, you are seriously disturbed if you think your elected president is in any way socialist.

Oh really? And what would you two call him? Where on your political spectrum does he fall?

Speak for yourself Bill. He may be hated by certain segments of this country, but then he was even before he took office wasn't he? The right wing hate machine is a thing to behold. Just a constant stream of whining, lying, and bitching about everything. The right wing in this country is a joke. Intellectually bankrupt. If you don't agree with Rush/Hannity/Beck you are not a patriot. Well [Poor language removed] that.

So what's your answer? More of the same stuff that got us where we are today?

Please, please, please elect that muppet Palin as your candidate in '12, so we can all see Obama mop the floor with that idiotic little c**t.

By the way, 50% of self identified Republicans STILL have doubts whether Obama was born in the US. Proud of that? But to fair, most self identified Republicans aren't smart enough to know Hawaii is part of the US.

The polls say otherwise. But since we're on the subject, why would we, as right wing hate machine Republicans, "reach across the aisle" to work with him on his socialized medic...err...healthcare plan. Oh, wait, we tried and he politely declined, not only to listen to our objections with the policy, but to listen to some of our ideas to improve it. Fact (and facts are pesky things) is that the majority of the public don't want his healthcare agenda nor the costs associated with it. If you think it's all peaches and cream, then you're entitled to your opinion.

The Republicans never, not for once, had any intention of working with this President to get anything done and you know it. The tactic from day one has been to paint Obama as a radical and lay down on the tracks. So please spare us with your BS.

Are you saying Obama had intentions of working with us and representing ALL of the country and not just his left wing interests?

Really?

And yet no one has disproved his "radical" agenda. You use the term BS. Ok, I have a question for you then. Where do YOU put him on the spectrum. Center? Moderately Left? Where? That's the problems that the libs have with us on the right. We KNOW who and what Obama is. The rest of the country is just now catching up to that very unfortunate reality. The best part??? We get called racists for bringing these issues up.

Oh. I don't recall ever bringing up Palin. I don't recall bringing up his birth certificate or where he was born. That's just a strawman. Let's stick with the topic at hand.

 

[McBain]

 

[TX Bill]

I'd like mine buttered please. With just a pinch of salt.

 

[TX Bill]

Hmmmm....

Unless my math is fuzzy (and it has been known to be), more than 2/3 of the American public oppose the mosque being built there.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100814/ts_afp/uspoliticsreligionattacksobama_20100814172344

Again, that's just opinion. See my earlier post about whether or not they have the right to build it there.

 

[johnnydawg68]

Oh really? And what would you two call him? Where on your political spectrum does he fall?



The polls say otherwise. But since we're on the subject, why would we, as right wing hate machine Republicans, "reach across the aisle" to work with him on his socialized medic...err...healthcare plan. Oh, wait, we tried and he politely declined, not only to listen to our objections with the policy, but to listen to some of our ideas to improve it. Fact (and facts are pesky things) is that the majority of the public don't want his healthcare agenda nor the costs associated with it. If you think it's all peaches and cream, then you're entitled to your opinion.



Are you saying Obama had intentions of working with us and representing ALL of the country and not just his left wing interests?

Really?

And yet no one has disproved his "radical" agenda. You use the term BS. Ok, I have a question for you then. Where do YOU put him on the spectrum. Center? Moderately Left? Where? That's the problems that the libs have with us on the right. We KNOW who and what Obama is. The rest of the country is just now catching up to that very unfortunate reality. The best part??? We get called racists for bringing these issues up.

Oh. I don't recall ever bringing up Palin. I don't recall bringing up his birth certificate or where he was born. That's just a strawman. Let's stick with the topic at hand.

1) The polls say otherwise because jobs haven't come back and the President gets the blame fairly or unfairly.
2) Thank you for at least having the guts to admit you never had any intention of getting any kind of meaningful legislation passed because, politically, it wouldn't have been good for you. I get that. It's good politics. But it's bad leadership. The fact is IF YOU HAD ALL OF THESE GREAT IDEAS ON HEALTHCARE, why didn't you enact them when you were in power? There are a lot of ideas in the bill that republicans agree with. Obama did make concessions. The final bill isn't the the original bill is it? So how can you say that? Personally I favor a different approach on healthcare, but the status quo sucks. I would have liked to see more bi-partisanship on the bill, but it was probably a fantasy to think that either side were in the mood for that.
3) I think at heart, Obama is a good old fashioned liberal - but not remotely a socialist. Ask the real Labour Party socialists on here if he is and they will tell you no. I'm not sure what you mean by "disproving" his radical agenda...if I don't think it's radical, how can I disprove it. Funny the biggest criticism you hear is that he hasn't done much. But it can't be both "radical" and "non-existent". So can you list for me that part of what he's actually done so far that is "radical"?
4) I have no idea if you are racist because I don't know you. I'm going to assume you're not. But there is a large element of racism in the most vocal opponents of the president - not the average guy on the street who couldn't care less.
5) No you didn't bring up Palin. But whether you like it or not, she's a spokesperson for the right. And I just pray that she runs and gets the nomination, because then you'll be stuck with Obama for four more years.
6) Again, not aiming the "birther" thing at you. Clearly you are not in that 50%. But, to me at least, it's an indicator of the level of ignorance that many on the right start with. Not saying everyone that votes democrat is smart and vice versa. Not at all. Let me be clear. Most of my best friends in the world, guys that I'm closer than brothers with, would be on your side of the argument. But it's shameful and it shows that there is a radical right wing agenda at work here that I fight against every day in conversations.

I have no problem with people who want smaller government, or lower taxes, or balanced budgets or whatever. We can have civil discussions about policy and what's right/wrong. What I fear, and what really gets me worked up, is this radical right wing subculture taking over the Republican party. Where are the Bob Doles and Alan Simpsons, and yes, even Ronald Reagan. Because it was never personal with Reagan. It was never hateful. This generation of republicans makes it very hard for even someone who is pretty centrist or center left (I tend to view each issue on it's own merits and facts rather than through some ideological prism) to vote for them. Without getting into religion, the bible thumpers have taken over the Republican party and I want no part of the thought/behavior police.

 

[johnnydawg68]

Hmmmm....

Unless my math is fuzzy (and it has been known to be), more than 2/3 of the American public oppose the mosque being built there.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100814/ts_afp/uspoliticsreligionattacksobama_20100814172344

Again, that's just opinion. See my earlier post about whether or not they have the right to build it there.

I thought conservatives were in favor of individual freedom to do stuff like build building on private property? We should never put principles up against opinion polls.

Great article on this subject by Fareed Zakaria. http://www.newsweek.com/2010/08/06/the-real-ground-zero.html

 

[johnnydawg68]

And another one from the Republican mayor of New York here: http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2010/08/03/mayor_bloomberg_on_mosque

 

[johnnydawg68]

Bill,

Separate thought here. How do you feel about conservatives getting elected as the party of smaller government, when in fact government spending under Bush dwarfed everyone before him? Are you a big government conservative or a libertarian?

 

[TX Bill]

1) The polls say otherwise because jobs haven't come back and the President gets the blame fairly or unfairly.

Yep...the libs loved bashing Bush with the polls. Hate it when the shoe's on the other foot though huh?

2) Thank you for at least having the guts to admit you never had any intention of getting any kind of meaningful legislation passed because, politically, it wouldn't have been good for you. I get that. It's good politics. But it's bad leadership. The fact is IF YOU HAD ALL OF THESE GREAT IDEAS ON HEALTHCARE, why didn't you enact them when you were in power? There are a lot of ideas in the bill that republicans agree with. Obama did make concessions. The final bill isn't the the original bill is it? So how can you say that? Personally I favor a different approach on healthcare, but the status quo sucks. I would have liked to see more bi-partisanship on the bill, but it was probably a fantasy to think that either side were in the mood for that.

Simple answer to this question. We don't want socialized medicine in this country. Surely you know that about us?

3) I think at heart, Obama is a good old fashioned liberal - but not remotely a socialist. Ask the real Labour Party socialists on here if he is and they will tell you no. I'm not sure what you mean by "disproving" his radical agenda...if I don't think it's radical, how can I disprove it. Funny the biggest criticism you hear is that he hasn't done much. But it can't be both "radical" and "non-existent". So can you list for me that part of what he's actually done so far that is "radical"?

Radical? A healthcare plan that the MAJORITY of the country didn't want. I guess he thought he had a mandate for it though because he forced it through. And I do mean forced. Elena Kagan...another liberal on the court to make law vs. interpret the law. A moratorium on Gulf drilling when the experts said a moratorium would hurt more than help business in the Gulf region.

4) I have no idea if you are racist because I don't know you. I'm going to assume you're not. But there is a large element of racism in the most vocal opponents of the president - not the average guy on the street who couldn't care less.

Surprise. TX Bill isn't a racist.

5) No you didn't bring up Palin. But whether you like it or not, she's a spokesperson for the right. And I just pray that she runs and gets the nomination, because then you'll be stuck with Obama for four more years.

She's no more a spokesperson for the right than James Carville is for the left. But hey, if the left thinks she speaks for all of us, we could do a lot worse.

6) Again, not aiming the "birther" thing at you. Clearly you are not in that 50%. But, to me at least, it's an indicator of the level of ignorance that many on the right start with. Not saying everyone that votes democrat is smart and vice versa. Not at all. Let me be clear. Most of my best friends in the world, guys that I'm closer than brothers with, would be on your side of the argument. But it's shameful and it shows that there is a radical right wing agenda at work here that I fight against every day in conversations.

The irony of the statement above. Does the left, of which you are most clearly a part of, even have an idea? A clue? Yeah, I'm a member of the right wing but the irony of someone on the left calling out the right for "ignorance" really has me in stitches here.

I have no problem with people who want smaller government, or lower taxes, or balanced budgets or whatever. We can have civil discussions about policy and what's right/wrong. What I fear, and what really gets me worked up, is this radical right wing subculture taking over the Republican party. Where are the Bob Doles and Alan Simpsons, and yes, even Ronald Reagan. Because it was never personal with Reagan. It was never hateful. This generation of republicans makes it very hard for even someone who is pretty centrist or center left (I tend to view each issue on it's own merits and facts rather than through some ideological prism) to vote for them. Without getting into religion, the bible thumpers have taken over the Republican party and I want no part of the thought/behavior police.

I'm a "Bible thumper" and there isn't a "sub-culture" as you say. It's just a fact that most of your Christians are on the right? Why you ask? Because of our moral objections to the left's (read: Democrat) support for homosexuality (TX Bill doesn't have a problem with homosexuals. TX Bill has a problem with the lifestyle. Let's be clear about that before someone says "Hey !!! TX Bill hates homosexuals") and abortion on demand.

You don't want any part of the thought police/behavior? Interesting as I don't want any part of the moral decay supported by the left. But since we brought religion into it, I fully expect this thread to be shut down in 5...4...3...2....