New Everton Stadium Discussion

[PhilM]

The ale selection at Goodison is shocking. I’d be happy to pay £6 for an actual pint in BMD.

I already, reluctantly, pay £5 for a pint of robo-Guinness.

It's £4.60 something for a pint of Carling already (a little bit more for Coors) and it tastes like panther piss. If it was a decent pint, I'd pay the £6 like you say.

The Northern line is a great asset to BMD, but we're now being told that Sandhills' current arrangement would only allow approx 3000 people per hr to access it. So that, and the buses serving Scotland Rd would have to go some to shift the numbers required to meet the club's 60% criteria, with no direct services to the bulk of the city's suburbs..

To the best of my knowledge, the plan for Sandhills is to build a covered waiting area and in the long-term another route up to the platforms from Errington St.

If people are expecting to get to the station and on the train relatively quickly, like currently at Kirkdale or Bank Hall, then people are going to be sadly mistaken.

If people want to leave the ground straight at the end of the game, the expected wait time could be 30 mins+.

 

[John from Bootle]

No wonder we're skint. Bet you all take egg butties in too.

 

[John from Bootle]

If people are expecting to get to the station and on the train relatively quickly, like currently at Kirkdale or Bank Hall, then people are going to be sadly mistaken.

Only thing that differentiates them 2 stations from Sandhills is a more spacious/bigger platform is it not?

Sandhills has got away with the size platform it has because whilst being the busier of the three numbers wise, it's also served by 24 trains an hour.

Shouldn't be a massive deal to extend the platform should it?

 

[Goat]

Lets hope we have our own catering firm and can set our own prices, cos if we retain Sodexo, which I think we will, you can forget sensible pricing, IMO.

 

[PhilM]

Only thing that differentiates them 2 stations from Sandhills is a more spacious/bigger platform is it not?

Sandhills has got away with the size platform it has because whilst being the busier of the three numbers wise, it's also served by 24 trains an hour.

Shouldn't be a massive deal to extend the platform should it?

Well, it isn't that simple.

Firstly, train passengers are currently distributed between three stations: lots walk to Kirkdale, many gets the soccer bus and some walk to Bankhall.

As the capacity grows with BMD, the distribution will likely decrease as Kirkdale will be 1.7 miles away from BMD - for reference, Bank Hall is currently 1.1 miles.

Yes, there'll be people who will walk to Bank Hall and Moorefields, but with its location you would expect that more will focus on directly going to Sandhills.

The largest issue with Sandhills is that it's served by one tunnel to a central island that serves both platforms. Will the width allow for sufficient capacity?

From what I've been told, Merseyrail are concerned about this, hence the covered waiting station and hopefully an additional route up to the platform.

Without adaptations, the number of people being able to use the station will be below what is required. It's not just the length but width and access arrangements.

One end of the platform goes directly onto the bridge over Sandhills Lane, so an extension there is unlikely or incredibly costly. Southbound, it narrows.

 

[John from Bootle]

Well, it isn't that simple.

Firstly, train passengers are currently distributed between three stations: lots walk to Kirkdale, many gets the soccer bus and some walk to Bankhall.

As the capacity grows with BMD, the distribution will likely decrease as Kirkdale will be 1.7 miles away from BMD - for reference, Bank Hall is currently 1.1 miles.

Yes, there'll be people who will walk to Bank Hall and Moorefields, but with its location you would expect that more will focus on directly going to Sandhills.

The largest issue with Sandhills is that it's served by one tunnel to a central island that serves both platforms. Will the width allow for sufficient capacity?

From what I've been told, Merseyrail are concerned about this, hence the covered waiting station and hopefully an additional route up to the platform.

Without adaptations, the number of people being able to use the station will be below what is required. It's not just the length but width and access arrangements.

One end of the platform goes directly onto the bridge over Sandhills Lane, so an extension there is unlikely or incredibly costly. Southbound, it narrows.

Yeah, not sure on the scope for expansion tbh. They could almost certainly put the ticket office back downstairs though which would free up some space, and there's currently a staff building on the platform which again could possibly be moved. You mention Bank Hall is 1.1 miles away from Goodison, well, Old Hall Street entrance to Moorfields is also 1.1 miles away from Bramley Moore, perhaps a touch more. 1.2 at the most, and that also has the pull of the bars, hotels, and restaurants that part of town has to offer.

EDIT: there's also other things to take into consideration, which I've referenced in a post on the previous page.

Also wouldn't be surprised to see a sizeable taxi rank spring up on the dock rd with the caveat of it only being in use on matchdays. Most taxi drivers wouldn't dream of sitting there on a non-matchday anyway. If it's not under consideration, then it certainly is worthy of consideration.

 

[Ralphie Boy]

The piss poor (no excuses for the pun) beer served at GP is due to the bars being small and so pre-poured and sitting going flat, something we accept as we are in a rush for a drink.

This is a similar issue with the food, no real facilities except for the hotdog,pie scenario. Given the option of street food that is knocked up in minutes the appeal would be greater and more profitable, their is still room for pies etc but choice is always the way forward.

The times I have been lucky enough to secure a ticket for over the road I have never had problems getting a drink and not flat, I think out hospitality is trying to do its best in a bad setup which hopefully will be reactivity in a brand new stadium.

the promise of street food etc should encourage fans to spend, I only hope they stick with competitive pricing and think about retaining the supporters in the stadium rather than pushing us to locals etc.

 

[TommyDavo]

Hope we treat the away section concourse as Spurs do. Reminded me of the lower Bullens

 

[Kever10]

Well, it isn't that simple.

Firstly, train passengers are currently distributed between three stations: lots walk to Kirkdale, many gets the soccer bus and some walk to Bankhall.

As the capacity grows with BMD, the distribution will likely decrease as Kirkdale will be 1.7 miles away from BMD - for reference, Bank Hall is currently 1.1 miles.

Yes, there'll be people who will walk to Bank Hall and Moorefields, but with its location you would expect that more will focus on directly going to Sandhills.

The largest issue with Sandhills is that it's served by one tunnel to a central island that serves both platforms. Will the width allow for sufficient capacity?

From what I've been told, Merseyrail are concerned about this, hence the covered waiting station and hopefully an additional route up to the platform.

Without adaptations, the number of people being able to use the station will be below what is required. It's not just the length but width and access arrangements.

One end of the platform goes directly onto the bridge over Sandhills Lane, so an extension there is unlikely or incredibly costly. Southbound, it narrows.

But what would be the point in walking to Bank Hall or Kirkdale, only to get on a train that already filled up at Sandhills, with no stops inbetween? Unless you were getting the train back towards town, in which case the walking time would probably have you back towards town anyway, and it would still get chocka going back through Sandhills.

A monorail from BMD to Otterspool would be perfect if feasible, with stops at Mann Island, Kings Dock, Baltic Triangle, somewhere near the Britania, and Otterspool. Maybe a Garden Festival stop if they do anything with that land. Could maybe even do it as far as Speke near the Airport. Now that would be something.

 

[PhilM]

But what would be the point in walking to Bank Hall or Kirkdale, only to get on a train that already filled up at Sandhills, with no stops inbetween? Unless you were getting the train back towards town, in which case the walking time would probably have you back towards town anyway, and it would still get chocka going back through Sandhills.

A monorail from BMD to Otterspool would be perfect if feasible, with stops at Mann Island, Kings Dock, Baltic Triangle, somewhere near the Britania, and Otterspool. Maybe a Garden Festival stop if they do anything with that land. Could maybe even do it as far as Speke near the Airport. Now that would be something.

Exactly. Hence why the current setup at Sandhills is inefficient. If you're going to town, the walk to Moorefields is 1.4 miles, compared to Sandhills at 0.7miles.

But, it's 0.7 (half way) in the wrong direction, so many going southbound will head straight to the city. Going north, however, it's going to be majorly busy!

 

[cooperman]

Only thing that differentiates them 2 stations from Sandhills is a more spacious/bigger platform is it not?

Sandhills has got away with the size platform it has because whilst being the busier of the three numbers wise, it's also served by 24 trains an hour.

Shouldn't be a massive deal to extend the platform should it?

If heading north at the station it looks like there's space for an additional platform on the left that could be used for exit only from the city pre match and North departures after

 

[John from Bootle]

Exactly. Hence why the current setup at Sandhills is inefficient. If you're going to town, the walk to Moorefields is 1.4 miles compared to Sandhills at 0.7miles.

But, it's 0.7 (half way) in the wrong direction, so many going southbound will head straight to the city. Going north, however, it's going to be majorly busy!

1.1 miles to Old Hall Street. If Merseyrail have any concerns, I fully expect that entrance to be in use.

 

[Jacko93]

Lets hope we have our own catering firm and can set our own prices, cos if we retain Sodexo, which I think we will, you can forget sensible pricing, IMO.

I'm not so sure we keep Sodexho tbh, as I think a bit of the risk is removed by being at BMD. Sodexho have the expertise, but importantly for us in GP they carry less risk due to being a larger company. Overall take at GP is limited due to serving capacity, we can only sell a finate amount. If half time was half an hour, we could double, but profit levels and volumes sold probably don't change much from game to game. I think that changes at BMD, we could price more aggressively in order to get people in and keep them there, while taking the reward ourselves. People turn up to the Oak, the Brick etc 1-2 hours before, nobody's doing that to drink in GP, its entirely feasible in BMD

 

[arch stanton]

a decent beer at a price that isnt stupid, some decent grub, plenty of space to stand or sit and watch other games and id happily spend more at the ground

 

[Tim UpperBullen]

EFC essentially had planning permission for the stadium in Kirkby. That came from Knowsley Council. It was primarily the retail park (that didn't comply with any regional or national planning legislation) that attracted the bulk of the protests from all neighbouring authorities, causing it to be called in. The point is, throughout the process (including during the inquiry), EFC and Knowsley council repeatedly stated that the transport plan was in place. Only then was it revealed that even after several revisions of the plan, the transport modellers were unable to make the scheme work, none of it added up. Consequently knowsley council put in a clause to protect themselves, whereby the capacity could be capped.

As regards predicting fan's behaviour. I've been in corporate and general admission sections at many stadia (including the Emirates) and at night games they all tend to empty pretty sharpish.

a decent beer at a price that isnt stupid, some decent grub, plenty of space to stand or sit and watch other games and id happily spend more at the ground

I think there has to be a lot of bar/concourse area. Whilst standing in the fan plaza might appeal in August I don't think standing outside for an hour or two for most of the season will appeal to many