2020/21 Marcel Brands

[Goat]

That's valid he'd definitely have to concoct a different approach to recruitment. I'd still take a chance on him just due his ample experience just not content with Marcel.

Honestly I get people not being content, things really haven't worked out as they should have.

I can offer a lot of mitigation, but when you have to offer a LOT, well, its kinda hard to defend some things.

I do think hes been unlucky, with certain players and I think some players will come good and show their worth, I mean Rico was pretty bad last night, but hes defo not a bad player.

So sure, I get that people have doubts and I would be all for trying a fresh set of eyes, but people need to realise that every single DoF makes mistakes, no player is a sure thing and somebody like Gmblammo just makes things look very bad, when its not even a fault of anybody.

A new person would still have the same problems Brands has, rubbish players on massive contracts that nobody will pay a penny for.

 

[Goat]

It'd work it'd just cost a bit more.

I dont think it would work.

I mean I assume most windows he signs about 30 players.

Redbull seems to be doing alright without him as well, how central was he?

 

[Nymzee]

I dont think it would work.

I mean I assume most windows he signs about 30 players.

Redbull seems to be doing alright without him as well, how central was he?

Hugely central. What I mean by it would work is that you can still build a club in the same vein without feeder clubs just at higher expense.

It wouldn't work here because it means basically giving up on the next few seasons, would cost an absolute fortune & doesn't fit in with the fans wishes of us progressing to Europe/cups immediately.

Moot point anyway; he's never coming here now.

 

[toffee-L]

Anyway, I think Brands has been very unlucky.

Gomes snapping his ankle, Gmblammo turning into Mr Glass.

He took a chance on Hamez and Delph and whilst Hamez has been worth it, Delph defo hasnt.

His 1 glaring error for me has been Iwobi tho, not even I can defend that, other than blame Marco Silva, but that's not even an option.

We had a 46 player first-team squad when he took the job.

People say its dead easy to get rid of players and whilst we could probably find clubs to take them for free, you ain't finding any clubs willing to pay the wages they want, so they stay on the fat contracts and go out on loan.

But anyway, we get rid of quite a bit of rubbish this summer, hopefully we can shift a few more out, yes the likes of Bernie haven't really worked out, but to go back to my first point, hes been very unlucky.

Sure some players hes bought have had a few niggles over the years, like Allan, Gomes, but none of them have missed as much time as they have for us, its just really unlucky.

Last night we had 10 injured players, with another 1 coming off, so we currently have 11 injured players, its no surprise that the bench is full of kids, its called an injury crisis. We can only name a 25 player squad, so simple maths says that if you lose 11 players, you only have 15 left, 1 of which is Besic, 3 of which are Keepers.

But anyway, big Summer for The Don coming up.

Lets hope he gets this 1 right, but please, have a sense of realism, hes not going to be able to shift the 15 players you want rid of.............................................

I certainly agree that he's (well we as a club) have been very unlucky with all the injuries that are piling up but I think this is looking at things too simplistically. We were only 3 outfield players away from what would be considered our first choice team last night. We are obviously much weaker without Allan, Doucs and DcL but should we be this much weaker?

As for the other players who are injured, are we seriously missing any of them? Would Bernard have made a difference, would Gomes, would King?

If we had a large amount of good players absent then I would agree with you completely. But that's not the case. We had four first team players out (the other being Pickford) and our manager decided that he'd rather play a centre back signed by Roberto Martinez for 2million in midfield rather than a midfielder signed by Marcel Brands for 28million.

It's just not good enough really.

 

[Zatara]

I think the problem is, it's actually very difficult to sell players in this market. Whatever his plan is, I don't think it can be based around selling the dead wood for money.

In your opinion he has players he can shift for fees.

Sadly most of the players you want rid of, he cant.

I mean you keep saying sell Keane, to who? You think clubs are going to have money to burn this window?

I reckon there will be a LOT of loans all over the place this upcoming window, most clubs are skint.

The good news is that it sounds like we can sell Mina and Kean for circa £65-70mil.

We also would see pure profit for Kenny and Bernard which may be another £10mil.

Moyes wanted Tarkowski last summer, same age as Keane. Surely Brands can shift him somewhere for £25mil with the English premium...i keep reading here what a good player he is.

Then of course we have Gomes and Sigurdsson who could be moved on for very cheap fees -- In the knowledge that were already way up on FFP.

Iwobi surely must be a target for someone who thinks they can get a tune out of him...

In any case, these players all had/have value...its about extracting the bids from clubs...a different ball game to moving Walcott and Bolasie on for example.

There is certainly a case that the players are worth more than he's spent (particularly if you discard the deflationary pressure that's coming). The issue is, the on pitch performance is still likely to be 8th. The other way of looking at it is it's likely to be around 60 points. Thats around a 25% increase in 3 years (or 8% year on year). Given the money thats been spent we have to ask ourselves is that enough? Would a 60 to say 75 point increase in 3 years be enough for people? It would mean we were a solidly CL team, but are people willing to waint another 3 years for that, withn 2 likely to now should much improvement!

That depends on performances on the pitch...more so seeing something begin to evolve.

Also seeing players join who its clear will benefit the club in the long term e.g Richarlison, Digne, Godfrey type signings.

 

[catcherintherye]

Delph, I can honestly see the reasoning, I don't care what people say, when fit he was a good player, but he done now, cant stay fit and I doubt he cares about the club, I'm not stupid, most players don't care about the club, but I think Delph takes it to the next level, so it hasn't worked out.

Iwobi is just utter madness, there's not a single thing you can point to, as you say maybe if the window didn't bomb we could have maybe mugged a Palace for 15m or something, but meh, he stinks, ain't nobody touching him.

So how do you sell a player like Delph? Hes on decent money and he hasn't played football for nearly 2 years, good luck Marcel.

Which leads me to Tosun, another player who has done nothing but get injured for the last 2 years, Clubs do not need to buy him, they can just simply loan him for nominal fee, why would any club pay for money for him?

I could go on, but I wont, the list is painfully long.

I'd agree on Delph, all I would say is more due diligence was needed. Moyes was always good at this, and I do think, yu might have got a feel for Delph and his injury record.

Iwobi, I could sort of see the logic, but again, it's been awful. The thought was, I'd imagine, even if it went wrong, he's a young player, and someone will give us 20m for him. The problem is, the world has crashed so that won't happen now.

As for Tosun, he's got no chance moving him on.

There is an argument he has added to the deadwood list which is certainly a valid criticism.

 

[Goat]

The good news is that it sounds like we can sell Mina and Kean for circa £65-70mil.

We also would see pure profit for Kenny and Bernard which may be another £10mil.

Totally unrealistic.

We couldnt sell Kenny for 2m last window or Bernie for free.

If you think we are getting 70m for Mina and Keane you need to smoke less crack.

And there you go, there's the problem.

Already you have sold Bernie, Kenny, Keane, Mina, Gomes and Iceberg, realistically we are getting no more than 60m for all of them.

That leaves us with 60m to sign 6 FIRST TEAM players, then we need to buy a new Right Back, another midfielder, A Right Winger and a Striker.

So that's 60m to sign 10 players, lets add on the 40m for Kean.

Thats 100m to sign 10 players, good luck Zatmania.

 

[billyblue80]

I mean i'm not really forgetting the players am I. It's the whole point of my post. Either the players are good enough to do better than this or they aren't. Either Ancelotti isn't getting the most out of them, or we haven't bought good enough players. I don't really know how to make it clearer.

It's about quality but also attributes and how they work together, we lack players who can offer a wide outlet, attack at pace, drive on centrally. We are so reliant on one or two players. The likes of Iwobi and Bernard don't offer us that, so we have nothing in terms of drive or width beyond Richarlison. Doucoure is the only one with legs and drive centrally and he'd out. James can create but he needs options and our wide players are pathetic. So it's become very static narrow and slow. Carlo has worked well at times with what he has dragging results out, but now the business end is here and injuries have kicked in and it's been shown up how bad and imbalanced the squad is, how poor certain areas are and how the collection of players we have isn't up to it. Yes I think we should still be doing slightly better especially at home and maybe Carlo has questions to answer on patterns of play but the point is the attributes and make of the squad isn't right.

 

[Curtis]

Honestly I get people not being content, things really haven't worked out as they should have.

I can offer a lot of mitigation, but when you have to offer a LOT, well, its kinda hard to defend some things.

I do think hes been unlucky, with certain players and I think some players will come good and show their worth, I mean Rico was pretty bad last night, but hes defo not a bad player.

So sure, I get that people have doubts and I would be all for trying a fresh set of eyes, but people need to realise that every single DoF makes mistakes, no player is a sure thing and somebody like Gmblammo just makes things look very bad, when its not even a fault of anybody.

A new person would still have the same problems Brands has, rubbish players on massive contracts that nobody will pay a penny for.

I think for me I try to be to objective as possible, I understand that he inherited a pretty chaotic scenario and I know it's not FIFA where he can correct all our weaknesses in one or two windows. But the frustrations arise for me not from purchases like glabbamo because there's no way he could of foreseen that calamity it's more with Delph who was clearly problematic and even with James and Allan who are exceptional players but had signs of rustiness. It's not just how on the sole merits of a player it's how they play off each other. I like doucs but even when him Allan are on the pitch together which is a rarity , they don't possess enough skills on the ball for me. Iwobi was huge whiff too and like you stated DOF aren't going to be immaculate in their recruitment at the same time I feel he could of left the squad more prepared for this season . For a lot of people including myself it feels easier to just walk away and make another approach with someone else it just feels more promising. I don't have the answers but it just doesn't seem like brands has them either.

 

[Zatara]

Totally unrealistic.

We couldnt sell Kenny for 2m last window or Bernie for free.

If you think we are getting 70m for Mina and Keane you need to smoke less crack.

And there you go, there's the problem.

Already you have sold Bernie, Kenny, Keane, Mina, Gomes and Iceberg, realistically we are getting no more than 60m for all of them.

That leaves us with 60m to sign 6 FIRST TEAM players, then we need to buy a new Right Back, another midfielder, A Right Winger and a Striker.

So that's 60m to sign 10 players, lets add on the 40m for Kean.

Thats 100m to sign 10 players, good luck Zatmania.

I "have to smoke less crack" ???

Kean at £45mil is high for you? Mina at £23mil (as rumoured) thats £68mil

Theyre reasonabe valuations.

 

[Martin Alvito]

I "have to smoke less crack" ???

Kean at £45mil is high for you? Mina at £23mil (as rumoured) thats £68mil

Theyre reasonabe valuations.

Looking at the posts, I believe he read your "Kean" as "Keane".

The other, lesser issue appears to be that he believes there will be far more deflationary pressure in this summer's market than you do.

 

[Brisan123]

The good news is that it sounds like we can sell Mina and Kean for circa £65-70mil.

We also would see pure profit for Kenny and Bernard which may be another £10mil.

Moyes wanted Tarkowski last summer, same age as Keane. Surely Brands can shift him somewhere for £25mil with the English premium...i keep reading here what a good player he is.

Then of course we have Gomes and Sigurdsson who could be moved on for very cheap fees -- In the knowledge that were already way up on FFP.

Iwobi surely must be a target for someone who thinks they can get a tune out of him...

In any case, these players all had/have value...its about extracting the bids from clubs...a different ball game to moving Walcott and Bolasie on for example.





That depends on performances on the pitch...more so seeing something begin to evolve.

Also seeing players join who its clear will benefit the club in the long term e.g Richarlison, Digne, Godfrey type signings.

Not a hope in hell any PL club takes Iwobi
No one else will pay him his wages
He actually runs like he is wearing a nappy (Diaper for our american fans )full of poo

 

[ForeverBlue92]

Not a hope in hell any PL club takes Iwobi
No one else will pay him his wages
He actually runs like he is wearing a nappy (Diaper for our american fans )full of poo

Think Iwobi would end up somewhere like Germany meself

 

[Lanolin]

I think for me I try to be to objective as possible, I understand that he inherited a pretty chaotic scenario and I know it's not FIFA where he can correct all our weaknesses in one or two windows. But the frustrations arise for me not from purchases like glabbamo because there's no way he could of foreseen that calamity it's more with Delph who was clearly problematic and even with James and Allan who are exceptional players but had signs of rustiness. It's not just how on the sole merits of a player it's how they play off each other. I like doucs but even when him Allan are on the pitch together which is a rarity , they don't possess enough skills on the ball for me. Iwobi was huge whiff too and like you stated DOF aren't going to be immaculate in their recruitment at the same time I feel he could of left the squad more prepared for this season . For a lot of people including myself it feels easier to just walk away and make another approach with someone else it just feels more promising. I don't have the answers but it just doesn't seem like brands has them either.

Totally agree with that. I hope they prove me wrong next year but from what i've seen of them both this year they're both good players in their own right but they don't complement eachother. Not only on the ball but off it, as neither of them seems to be disciplined to just sit. They both go haring round the pitch chasing people, which would be fine if we were a pressing team playing high up the pitch, but we aren't so they just leave massive gaps to be exploited. The two of them as a pair just don't really work in my eyes, which again leads me to believe that our recruitment criteria is 'good and available' rather than 'fits into what we're trying to do'.

 

[Brisan123]

Think Iwobi would end up somewhere like Germany meself

I know he is bad but FFS we can hardly send him to a concentration camp
Thats a joke before the PC brigade set me on fire