Manager, Long Term.

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Kaiser Soysauce said:
Dude, same deal.

Brick layer: "I've been on site for 15 years and know how stuff works. Give me a go at project management and if I lose you millions, just let me go"

Boss: "close the door on your way out".

The analogy is justified. Football is a business, end of. Fools let newbie grads/newbie managers run things. What business do you run by the way? Would you trust your hard earned graft to some "new idealist type who spouts new ideas out of his ass"?

I appreciate your views mate, but god help your employees when your company goes boobs up!
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Football is a business yes, but its a completely different business to anything else

How many companys do you know who strike up deals between them to transfer over employees, for huge wads of wonga?

Would the project manager see another building firm have a top quality left back so pay the other building firm to get him on side?

If that project manager was not doing his job properly and then got sacked, would the project manager still receive payment for the rest of his contract? (Martinez, Koeman etc)
 
Borussin said:
that's probably something that will have to happen regardless, not a coplete one, but one all the same and as tough as it is, the pay off can be massive. But the problem is with football more and more in these days is a lack of patience. Not many clubs have the patience for a restructure or rebuild. so you get the never ending cycle of coach after coach coming in, each with a different playing style and philosophy, each getting rid of a few players from the last coach, and getting a few of his own. So you end up with a big inbalance in the playing squad and no clear philosophy of a style.

But the thing is, it dosn't have to take an absolute age, it's not like it's a 5/6 year commitment. But it does often need to take a couple seasons to get that structure in place. And then you go on from there.
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Im sure if the club decided to take this route, say in the lines of "we tried something, it hasent worked, we are looking to do something else long term, but it may take a while, please be patient"
Im sure the fans would get on board of that, the prospect of something great to come can sometimes be better than the here and now
 

bluestevon said:
Koeman won trophies, as did Martinez, Martinez for one had the mentality of believing we could win every game.

Eventually you have to look and say we are not a club in a position to appoint a manager who is 'a dead cert' very very few clubs are in that position either though.

Manager is very young = he hasn't the experience
Manager is old = he's lost his fire and won't want a project
Manager hasn't managed before = we need someone with experience whose won things
Manager has experience and has won things = he'll want a bigger club why would he want to come to a project for etc


If we are looking at the last 6 managewrs we have had (permanent)

Walker - flavour of the month - prem experienced - flopped massively
Smith - serial winner - proven in europe - flopped massively
Royle - former player with not great experience in the top flight managing - success
Moyes - young with little experience and in the lower leagues - have to say a success for the first 8 years at least
Martinez - prem experience - young and ambitious - won a trophy in this country - flopped
Koeman - winner as player and manager - prem experienced - single handedly tried to destroy the club
Allardcye - vast prem experience, most hated manager we have ever had.

On the continent - quite often a team outside or even inside the elite level of clubs will give a manager his first big job at a really young age, maybe it's time we sdtopped thinking about ourselves as some sleeping giant etc and realised that what we are is a project and a long term one as well, and need a manager who maybe has the fire in his belly to actually go and dive fully into that and succeed.
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Agree with what this guy has said

Side note - I'm going to get killed for this, Martinez first season was the best ive enjoyed as an everton fan (maybe the 4th place finish came close), he also got us on a europa league run, and 2 semi finals were we got knocked out by the eventual winners (we never get the likes of Cardiff or West Ham or Wycombe in these type of games like other teams). Would that be classed as a semi success?, did we not show enough patience? Or was it just he had a good mix and blend of players and really should of done better (2 x 11th place finishes)
 
Raino85 said:
Agree with what this guy has said

Side note - I'm going to get killed for this, Martinez first season was the best ive enjoyed as an everton fan (maybe the 4th place finish came close), he also got us on a europa league run, and 2 semi finals were we got knocked out by the eventual winners (we never get the likes of Cardiff or West Ham or Wycombe in these type of games like other teams). Would that be classed as a semi success?, did we not show enough patience? Or was it just he had a good mix and blend of players and really should of done better (2 x 11th place finishes)
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Anyone giving you grief for that viewpoint is a moron. That season was boss. Things did fall apart after that though.
 
Raino85 said:
Football is a business yes, but its a completely different business to anything else

How many companys do you know who strike up deals between them to transfer over employees, for huge wads of wonga?

Would the project manager see another building firm have a top quality left back so pay the other building firm to get him on side?

If that project manager was not doing his job properly and then got sacked, would the project manager still receive payment for the rest of his contract? (Martinez, Koeman etc)
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Agreed, but it still doesn't mean ex-players get to leap frog hard work and endeavour to manage premier league teams in the hope they'll be good managers. That would just make an already crazy industry that bit more crazy. I don't like where football is or where it is going.
 
If we get a young ambitious manager and he lays out his blueprint of how he wants to play , the timeframe and the budget restrictions he is or isn’t working to I think fans will give him time.
Bobby got the time in his first and second seasons but it was clear things were regressing not progressing on the pitch
If the new manager is seen to be progressing season upon season I would hope and think he will be given the time to succeed
If it means 2 or 3 seasons with 7 th or 8 th place finishes then so be it
A couple of cup runs would be nice
 

bluestevon said:
He's crap mate, Zenit fans hate his way of playing.
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He did tighten up City's defence though and managed to get them playing well after Hughes went, which is something we badly need.
But OK (sorry just had to) if his current form is not too clever it may be better to swerve that one as getting the next appointment right is critical.
We seem to have had so many managers lately that simply by the law of averages we will get it right.......or not.
 
maccavennie said:
Yep I think we are at the stage where we need to get a punt on someone who might not tick all the boxes, a Fonseca ( lack of experience folk say, manager in a poor league ), Arteta for the points you have mentioned. I think the Tuchels and Simeone's of this world are looking for bigger jobs than us and let's be honest, we don't currentky look an attractive proposition for the top managers as the squad is unbalanced and no where near the quality needed to challenge

But a young hungry manager with something to prove, who knows.

Let's hope it's done sooner rather than later becsuse I really worry about this summer, the window is so small to be able to get players signed up/pre season etc so whatever we do needs to have the wheels in motion half an hour after the last game of the season.
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It needs to be officially announced soon after the final game, but it should be agreed well beforehand, with the incoming manager watching videos of the matches and identifying transfer targets before it's all made public. Same with the new director of football, if we're getting one. The window is too short to leave things late, and we can't afford another window chasing and not getting targets.
 

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