Manager, Long Term.

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bluestevon said:
Koeman won trophies, as did Martinez, Martinez for one had the mentality of believing we could win every game.

Eventually you have to look and say we are not a club in a position to appoint a manager who is 'a dead cert' very very few clubs are in that position either though.

Manager is very young = he hasn't the experience
Manager is old = he's lost his fire and won't want a project
Manager hasn't managed before = we need someone with experience whose won things
Manager has experience and has won things = he'll want a bigger club why would he want to come to a project for etc


If we are looking at the last 6 managewrs we have had (permanent)

Walker - flavour of the month - prem experienced - flopped massively
Smith - serial winner - proven in europe - flopped massively
Royle - former player with not great experience in the top flight managing - success
Moyes - young with little experience and in the lower leagues - have to say a success for the first 8 years at least
Martinez - prem experience - young and ambitious - won a trophy in this country - flopped
Koeman - winner as player and manager - prem experienced - single handedly tried to destroy the club
Allardcye - vast prem experience, most hated manager we have ever had.

On the continent - quite often a team outside or even inside the elite level of clubs will give a manager his first big job at a really young age, maybe it's time we sdtopped thinking about ourselves as some sleeping giant etc and realised that what we are is a project and a long term one as well, and need a manager who maybe has the fire in his belly to actually go and dive fully into that and succeed.
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Knowing our luck mate we'll end up with Kevin Nolan lol
 

maccavennie said:
Knowing our luck mate we'll end up with Kevin Nolan lol
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No doubt mate lol

funny thing is though, same people shouting about we won't be able to get any decent manager in, then on the other hand dismiss anyone who isn't proven etc, which basically means you need to hire a proven mediocre manager in reality

Ideal scenario - you get the best you can, either in the here and now what he offers, or on the potential he has.

I(f Everton fans appointed manager at Barca be interesting as they'd never have had Guardiola ...
 
We thought Big Sam was a low-risk appointment who would do well for us keep us up, etc. Any club in a perfect world signs a low-risk manager. "Low-risk" simply means by our context, wins us matches and does not lose them. Of course I want a manager like that. It's hard to come by.
 
bluestevon said:
No doubt mate lol

funny thing is though, same people shouting about we won't be able to get any decent manager in, then on the other hand dismiss anyone who isn't proven etc, which basically means you need to hire a proven mediocre manager in reality

Ideal scenario - you get the best you can, either in the here and now what he offers, or on the potential he has.

I(f Everton fans appointed manager at Barca be interesting as they'd never have had Guardiola ...
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Yep I think we are at the stage where we need to get a punt on someone who might not tick all the boxes, a Fonseca ( lack of experience folk say, manager in a poor league ), Arteta for the points you have mentioned. I think the Tuchels and Simeone's of this world are looking for bigger jobs than us and let's be honest, we don't currentky look an attractive proposition for the top managers as the squad is unbalanced and no where near the quality needed to challenge

But a young hungry manager with something to prove, who knows.

Let's hope it's done sooner rather than later becsuse I really worry about this summer, the window is so small to be able to get players signed up/pre season etc so whatever we do needs to have the wheels in motion half an hour after the last game of the season.
 
maccavennie said:
Yep I think we are at the stage where we need to get a punt on someone who might not tick all the boxes, a Fonseca ( lack of experience folk say, manager in a poor league ), Arteta for the points you have mentioned. I think the Tuchels and Simeone's of this world are looking for bigger jobs than us and let's be honest, we don't currentky look an attractive proposition for the top managers as the squad is unbalanced and no where near the quality needed to challenge

But a young hungry manager with something to prove, who knows.

Let's hope it's done sooner rather than later becsuse I really worry about this summer, the window is so small to be able to get players signed up/pre season etc so whatever we do needs to have the wheels in motion half an hour after the last game of the season.
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Sometimes a young manager comes in and has the courage to actually make decisions that more experienced managers will shy away from out of worrying about their own jobs etc (fear of player power etc), example Guardiola absolutely gutting the 'world class' players at Barca who had not been living up to their hype the last could of seasons before he took over - a absolute massive risk he took by doing that and one i don't think very many if any experienced proven managers would have taken the risk to do, similarly i seem to remember Wenger got rid of a fair few from the Graham era when he took over.

Whatever we do we need to have it done before the season ends - even if it means holding off on the announcement then at least make sure the deal is signed and sealed to get a new man in, if we stick with Sam then well I'll have a nice year off from having to fit footy into my life lol


As for the Arteta stuff, can easily imagine a situation ion 5-6 years where he is managing City post Guardiola and being touted as the best in the game, and people on here slating the idea of him shouting out how we should have gone for him back now... Ofc if we did hire him he will end up being utter rubbish no doubt.
 

Mentioned on another thread, but would like Mancini.
He did a job at City when they were in a similar position to where we find ourselves now (money but rudderless).
Maybe Dunc could offer some fashion advice regarding scarves though.
 
The best options are Mancini (after his time at city, it would be logical)
Or Fonseca, he's producing amazing football over in Ukraine, obviously a premier league club would be a step up for him, hopefully it's someone we could talk around to coming to us!

The sad thing is that there aren't many choices when it comes to management at the moment...most likely be stuck with this fat mess for another year...
 
Kenwright might entertain the thought of Arteta, but I imagine Moshiri would think he would be slaughtered if he went with him and it went wrong.

We are not going to get anyone with a cabinet full of trophies from the major leagues or a manager who clearly won't fancy a rebuilding job with relatively limited resources when compared to the elite clubs.
We can't "throw" money at candidates - we are probably seen as much less than a 50/50 bet these days and there is no need for anyone to risk it with us if they can wait for something better.

We could make the same mistake as with Koeman in hiring a past big-name player with a patchy / nondescript record as manager. No thanks.

We are really back to the process out of which Moyes/Martinez emerged - hiring a younger up and coming manager with a good reputation. On the next occasion you would just hope the process is far more thorough and exhaustive and not limited to whomever happens to be available domestically.

So its impossible to see past a Fonseca / Silva type as that's the market we are firmly in now. Other than that the only other alternative is someone coming out of a break from the game or returning to club management from international football.
 

Manager, long term.

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Talk to me.
 

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