Let's not kid ourselves

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I'm still right behind Koeman. He's tried and tested. It's a measure of how much he rates the club that he has come here.

There's dead wood to be offloaded and money to be spent. He needs time to do these things. God knows we've waited long enough to win something. We can at least allow a top manager a couple of years to get a team together.
 

Angelgabriel said:
I suppose he was sacked for raising expectation for that 5th placed finish in his 1st season, if he'd done it the other way round everything would have been good. You tend to to get teams performing for a short while under a new manager though......................
If Martinez could get that team to 5th, I don't see the problem in thinking Koeman could do something similar with what he's got
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I don't get your logic as 'that team' finished 6th the previous season , Martinez got them 1 place higher. Yet based on that your demanding Koeman has to improve by 6 places to gain your approval. It doesn't make sense.
 
gonetomorrow said:
I'm still right behind Koeman. He's tried and tested. It's a measure of how much he rates the club that he has come here.

There's dead wood to be offloaded and money to be spent. He needs time to do these things. God knows we've waited long enough to win something. We can at least allow a top manager a couple of years to get a team together.
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He did well at Southampton but he's got a lot to prove still as a manager...
 
GrandOldTeam said:
He did well at Southampton but he's got a lot to prove still as a manager...
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aye, looking at his overall record it's not that much better than Martinez or Moyes. He's won one cup when at La Liga, and finished just about in the European places in the Prem. Discounting the minor leagues he's not done much else of note.

I think a lot of blues are seduced by his Big Name as a player, but that's never been a reliable indicator of quality as a manager.
 
Angelgabriel said:
Which makes what Martinez done in his 1st season all the more impressive. The players had been playing turgid football for years, he comes in & has them playing like Barcelona.............in his 1st season. Anyone would think having a new manager doesn't make much difference to how we play.
You mention the Defence now, koeman has improved the defence immeasurably. The problem is Midfield and getting service & more support to help Rom (he's supposed to have improved that too, with Guaye & Yannick) and the general consensus is that they're successes. When Koeman took over, I would have expected to see an identity,regardless of personnel. He's made us hard to beat, but where's the high energy, high pressing, he himself was mentioning when we were unbeaten and turning up on Sky's MNF.
Theres a manager not too far from here, who took over a bad team and got them to 2 cup finals playing football no one thought some of them players were capable of. Without buying anyone. Perhaps I'm being ultra critical, but I just would have expected more from us/him.
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I can see your point here, honestly. It's just that we differ ever so slightly.

I am disappointed that we took a turn from the high intensity style we showed in the beginning (safe from a few 10-20 min periods every so often) to be honest. I don't take your criticism as ultra critical as well, it's just that I'm not expecting miracles - loads of other teams actually strenghtened, so if we're still around the same spot we are currently come January - I'd expect us to well keep it and improve on it, provided we buy quality players and we don't Everton up the injuries, as we usually do (even now, tbh).
 

Eggsyblueskin said:
I don't get your logic as 'that team' finished 6th the previous season , Martinez got them 1 place higher. Yet based on that your demanding Koeman has to improve by 6 places to gain your approval. It doesn't make sense.
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Makes perfect sense to me. Except it's not 6 places, it's 5 places. I think it maybe asking too much to get top 5 with Arsenal, Spurs, Citeh, Liverpool, Martinez the fraud got them 1 place higher, playing a brand of football that was alien to the players. To expect Koeman to improve on 6 places isn't really that far fetched when you consider

1: the team massively underperformed last season
2: our defence has improved massively with the signing of Williams
3: we now have one of the brightest upcoming managers in the game, allegedly
4: Guaye has been a success, improving the Midfield
5: if you believe most on here, Bolasie has been ace and is a big improvement on what we had.
6: Lukaku

Stoke, Soton, West Ham and obviously Leicester finished above us last season, there's 3 placings, maybe 4 we can improve on straight away. Combine all the points above, why can't we improve 6 places. I'm not demanding top 6, I want, and think we should be challenging. Utd are no great shakes under Jose, Chelsea is an unknown quantity. I just don't get people on here saying they'd be happy finishing mid table. Can anyone really say that Soton, West Ham and stoke are better than us?
 
....seeing is believing and results after 10 games don't lie. We've been beaten at home by a side from a lower league in the only cup competition we've been in and lost away to the likes of Burnley and Bournemouth in the league. It would take a leap of faith to believe we are a top 6 side.

Much will depend on the January transfer window but what you see is what you get and that's not much at the moment.
 
Eggs said:
....seeing is believing and results after 10 games don't lie. We've been beaten at home by a side from a lower league in the only cup competition we've been in and lost away to the likes of Burnley and Bournemouth in the league. It would take a leap of faith to believe we are a top 6 side.

Much will depend on the January transfer window but what you see is what you get and that's not much at the moment.
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Mate, we currently sit in 6th, its not that much of a stretch to assume we are a top 6 team, surely?
 

Angelgabriel said:
Makes perfect sense to me. Except it's not 6 places, it's 5 places. I think it maybe asking too much to get top 5 with Arsenal, Spurs, Citeh, Liverpool, Martinez the fraud got them 1 place higher, playing a brand of football that was alien to the players. To expect Koeman to improve on 6 places isn't really that far fetched when you consider

1: the team massively underperformed last season
2: our defence has improved massively with the signing of Williams
3: we now have one of the brightest upcoming managers in the game, allegedly
4: Guaye has been a success, improving the Midfield
5: if you believe most on here, Bolasie has been ace and is a big improvement on what we had.
6: Lukaku

Stoke, Soton, West Ham and obviously Leicester finished above us last season, there's 3 placings, maybe 4 we can improve on straight away. Combine all the points above, why can't we improve 6 places. I'm not demanding top 6, I want, and think we should be challenging. Utd are no great shakes under Jose, Chelsea is an unknown quantity. I just don't get people on here saying they'd be happy finishing mid table. Can anyone really say that Soton, West Ham and stoke are better than us?
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So tell you what ,shall we wait till the end of the season before the debriefing .
 

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