Everton article on espn soccernet

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

3 at the back only works at it's best, if at least one of the 3 are very capable footballers, who are comfortable on the ball & prepared to bring it out of defence. Otherwise you simply end up with 3 CB's marking one solitary striker & it's therefore a less attacking option that playing with a back 4 with both fullbacks pushed on.

I don't mind him introducing it to the lads & getting them comfortable with it, so we have another option, but if it's to be our default formation I'd be concerned.

 

[Jags..class]

3 at the back only works at it's best, if at least one of the 3 are very capable footballers, who are comfortable on the ball & prepared to bring it out of defence. Otherwise you simply end up with 3 CB's marking one solitary striker & it's therefore a less attacking option that playing with a back 4 with both fullbacks pushed on.

I don't mind him introducing it to the lads & getting them comfortable with it, so we have another option, but if it's to be our default formation I'd be concerned.

after reading more about this formation, its seems that our wing back and wingers will be our weapons, well we have Baines and Coleman who could do an excellent job and we have Mirallas and the barc kid plus pienaar for the wingers jobs, this formation seems to suit our players and its like a perfect fit except for the 3 defenders right now. This is a good article http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...east-popular-formation-in-europes-top-leagues

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

after reading more about this formation, its seems that our wing back and wingers will be our weapons, well we have Baines and Coleman who could do an excellent job and we have Mirallas and the barc kid plus pienaar for the wingers jobs, this formation seems to suit our players and its like a perfect fit except for the 3 defenders right now. This is a good article http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...east-popular-formation-in-europes-top-leagues

That piece highlights the fact, that only 1 club played with that formation over here last season & they got gubbed playing it most weeks. When they got it right they had a few great performances & results, but over the course of the season, they were picked apart & often walloped playing it.

 

[toffeeben15]

We shouldn't start with 3 at the back . Wear the opposition down first then over power them when they are leg less. The key to having success in this formation is having flexible players . Alcaraz looks like the right middle man to play the ball out . Start with a 4-2-3-1 and if it's not working go into a 3-4-3 .
4-2-3-1
Howard/Robles
Coleman. Jags distin baines
Gibson fellani
Mirallas. Osman/Barkley. Pienaar
Jelavic
Then a 3-4-3
Howard/Robles
Jags alcaraz distin
Coleman. Gibson. Fellani. Baines
Mirallas. Jelavic Pienaar

Osman goes Off for alcaraz . If we need pace then bring on kone for jelavic deulofue for pienaar

I would prefer a 4-3-3 out of all the formations though

 

[allen]

Interesting read.

I'm sure I'm not the only one wishing they'd paid more attention to Wigan and how they played over the last couple of seasons.

 

[davek]

Interesting read.

I'm sure I'm not the only one wishing they'd paid more attention to Wigan and how they played over the last couple of seasons.

I'm equally not sure it would have done us much good. In my minds eye I seem to recollect that his time at Swansea (a bigger fish in a small pool) was characterized by his having them play higher up the pitch and relying less on breaking out at speed on the counter that he relied on at Wigan. In other words, he'll adapt an approach that reflect the squad he has and the environment they find themselves in.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

I'm equally not sure it would have done us much good. In my minds eye I seem to recollect that his time at Swansea (a bigger fish in a small pool) was characterized by his having them play higher up the pitch and relying less on breaking out at speed on the counter that he relied on at Wigan. In other words, he'll adapt an approach that reflect the squad he has and the environment they find themselves in.

I've seen little to suggest that in him during his time at Wigan. To me he seemed to be obsessed with intalling his system at any cost, rather than putting his 'principles' to one side & getting the best out of what he had available by whatever means necessary.

 

[Tubey]

I find that a pretty poor article to be honest. It's making out like Fellaini is a big carthorse in the mould of Emile Heskey, which is just ridiculous.

Fellaini is a fine footballer in terms of technical ability - the ball sticks to him and he has very good distribution, whilst also being a destructive defensive presence. Any Everton side without him in midfield will be weaker, regardless of formation.

The problem with an article like this is that it's misinformed and based largely on his misuse as a forward during the last two seasons. The more obvious switch out is Osman, allowing Fellaini and Gibson to form a barrier in front of the defense.

Not only that, I think this "pure football" discussion with Martinez is very premature. He played 35 games with a grock of a forward named Franco di Santo last year. We'll play a 4-5-1 more often than not this year.

 

[throughthewindandthedrain]

I think the 3 at the back could work when teams are sat deep parking the bus. 2nd half we seemed to have twice as many players all sat in the middle of the park, hovering between there 18yrd box and half way line. Purely just trying to thread balls through to break them down. It was almost barca like, going from side to side, short passing just waiting for that chance to play in a striker or release a wing back. In that tho....Fellaini is a little bit the odd man out.
....................Howard......................
..........Jags.....Alcaraz.....Distin.........
.....................................................
...Coleman.......Gibson.........Baines...
...............Osman.....Pienaar............
...................Mirallas......................
..........................Jelavic.................

That's how the posistions basicaly set up second half, Gibson plays a deep lying playmaker role as apposed to DCM which the formation may suggest. It does enable you to litterally swarm all over there 18yrd box with multiple options and players trying to make things happen! As you can see, there's not really a dedicated Fellaini posistion in that formation tho. If it becomes a plan b, we initially could see the big fella subbed off a few times! Although he's still very important in the more natural 4-2-3-1. I honestly think RM may be secretly hoping to cash in on the big fella.

I just don't see any situation in a game where the team you have selected becomes more of a threat because you have replaced Fellaini and probably Barkley with Osman and Pienaar, and to be honest in a Barca system then probably Jelavic goes too. If a team parks the bus then you need options, Barca have tended to find this out themselves when their style has been completely nullified, which teams have done by parking the bus. Barca are the best in the world at this but still could do have done in certain situations with players who can not just play fluent passing football but can bring a different threat. We are not Barca so I would think Fellaini and Barkley who bring something different but can play passing football too are much more crucial to the squad than Osman and Pienaar. Fellaini may go but saying he will become a misfit doesn't seem to hold up at all to me and an indication of the mistakes most fans seemed to be hoping he would avoid

 

[throughthewindandthedrain]

the other part of that passing system is finding space to receive the ball and having the confidence to draw players to you then releasing others in space. seems to be an assumption you have to be a small, neat player to do this but is Osman better than Fellaini at this? The dutch team who supposedly invented total football had some pretty big players in the team as I remember, as did some of the best Brazil teams.

 

[Christiffa25]

I just don't see any situation in a game where the team you have selected becomes more of a threat because you have replaced Fellaini and probably Barkley with Osman and Pienaar, and to be honest in a Barca system then probably Jelavic goes too. If a team parks the bus then you need options, Barca have tended to find this out themselves when their style has been completely nullified, which teams have done by parking the bus. Barca are the best in the world at this but still could do have done in certain situations with players who can not just play fluent passing football but can bring a different threat. We are not Barca so I would think Fellaini and Barkley who bring something different but can play passing football too are much more crucial to the squad than Osman and Pienaar. Fellaini may go but saying he will become a misfit doesn't seem to hold up at all to me and an indication of the mistakes most fans seemed to be hoping he would avoid

I'm only looking from what he did yesterday, that is NOT what I want us to do although to have as a different option later in the game if its not happening for us then it may be ok. Barkley is neither here nor there as he'd easily slot into the roles that were being played by osman and pienaar second half....but can u see Fellaini playing in either of those roles? I'm not sure. Don't know if you were at the game? But it was clear to see from behind the goal how he had the players set up second half and the roles they were trying to play. The roles were really not suited to Fellaini. Again please don't think I'm supporting or advocating this set up at the cost of loosing Fellaini...I'm not!

Just saying what I seen yesterday...

 

[Christiffa25]

the other part of that passing system is finding space to receive the ball and having the confidence to draw players to you then releasing others in space. seems to be an assumption you have to be a small, neat player to do this but is Osman better than Fellaini at this? The dutch team who supposedly invented total football had some pretty big players in the team as I remember, as did some of the best Brazil teams.

It depends on what part of the pitch your operating in. Around the 18yrd box osman is superior to Fellaini in this as its usually ltd space and tight situations. Deeper in the midfield Fellaini is superior to osman. It could well depend how the game is going. Considering a lot moaned of moyes using different options/subs etc maybe we should be excited were looking like we may have options for once.

 

[throughthewindandthedrain]

It depends on what part of the pitch your operating in. Around the 18yrd box osman is superior to Fellaini in this as its usually ltd space and tight situations. Deeper in the midfield Fellaini is superior to osman. It could well depend how the game is going. Considering a lot moaned of moyes using different options/subs etc maybe we should be excited were looking like we may have options for once.

I agree Osman comes into his own in tight areas around the box but I have seen lovely weighted balls from Fellaini in those situations and can hold players off. I like Osman but in terms of limited contributions then surely he has to be more expendable

 

[Petit]

we have three at the back but we really still have 5 defenders on when it comes to the defensive side of it. This 4.4.1.1 under Moyes was good for us but we weren't winning enough games or even be able to beat the big teams, this new formation under Martinez might give us that extra. But not many teams are using 3 at the back in this league for some reason, not even Wenger.

Thats the problem with the rigid 4-4-1-1 employed by Moyes; safe and consistent but unless you have an extraordinary player in the hole you simply don´t score enough goals.

3-5-2 is a virtuoso formation, it is difficult but if it comes off it´s superior to almost anything else.

 

[throughthewindandthedrain]

I'm only looking from what he did yesterday, that is NOT what I want us to do although to have as a different option later in the game if its not happening for us then it may be ok. Barkley is neither here nor there as he'd easily slot into the roles that were being played by osman and pienaar second half....but can u see Fellaini playing in either of those roles? I'm not sure. Don't know if you were at the game? But it was clear to see from behind the goal how he had the players set up second half and the roles they were trying to play. The roles were really not suited to Fellaini. Again please don't think I'm supporting or advocating this set up at the cost of loosing Fellaini...I'm not!

Just saying what I seen yesterday...

sorry yeah the Fellaini comments aimed at the article. I thought the second half was really dominated by the fact that Coleman can play wing back and Hibbert can't so no way we could really attempt it in first. Heitinga coming in for Fellaini changed pattern too but assuming it will generally be Alcaraz in the back three then I just see Gibson's role changing a bit and then four from Mirallas, Fellaini, Osman, Barkley, Pienaar, Jelavic, Kone, the Barca lad. I think you pick in terms of the team you are playing at the time but seems less options with Fellaini gone even if he isn't ideal for one specific role. lots of threat though and as long as players happy to be rotated then I don't see a misfit