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ECHO Comment: "Fears of Witch-hunt Against Liverpool FC" part 3


WilliamPerry said:
Yeah but straw was involved too I think
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I would never imagine that labour's Jack Straw would have any involvement with the redshoite tory liverpool Michael howard, especially since it was the year b4 Labour came to power under Blair.
Also Michael Howard allegedly received a £400 000 bribe from one of Haases associates who is also Howard's cousin, and another scabby red.

Kopites and Tories shoiteing all over society since John Houlding...
 
Dan Tanner said:
I would never imagine that labour's Jack Straw would have any involvement with the redshoite tory liverpool Michael howard, especially since it was the year b4 Labour came to power under Blair.
Also Michael Howard allegedly received a £400 000 bribe from one of Haases associates who is also Howard's cousin, and another scabby red.

Kopites and Tories shoiteing all over society since John Houlding...
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Kilfoyle and Straw went after Howard
 
Liverpool need to realise they have to - HAVE TO - be more responsible. That being said, UEFA also encourage fans to go to fan parks - those fan parks stay open all night until the game finishes, they aren't just for people with tickets. So we can't just pin that on Klopp.

That being said, Liverpool and UEFA should have had the nous to have a rule that only people with match tickets were allowed to get anywhere near the stadium. All that takes is better organisation - they only had one checkpoint in operation. Why? They knew loads had gone to Paris, so why not put a checkpoint on outside the station, and then one before the flyover, and then one after it?

That could easily have been done, easily policed and it weeds out those with fakes, or no tickets, or anyone trying to mug people or whatever.

It's a major final, in a very difficult area to police as it is it seems, so why not have a bit of nous and more common sense?

I'll blame the idiots for being idiots and they deserve what they get. But it still boils down to the people in charge not being prepared - I count the clubs in that too.
 
Tony’s Carp said:
Yeah, I’m not sure if they were claiming 40000 fake tickets were detected and turned away, or whether some got in or what. But if there was an extra Goodison worth of people, either inside or outside the ground, there’d be much more evidence of it than there was. It would’ve been genuine carnage.
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People would have been killed. There wasn't room as it was, but they've stated it was 40k turned up with fake tickets. So they're lying
 

Just seen a video of local Arabs fronting reds in Paris , equal numbers . One red cracks one Arab . Fair play to them as that was clearly local Arab lads looking for easy pickings
 
BlueToff said:
Right, the French government are claiming that 30-40k turned up with fake tickets

That would mean there were 60,000 people at one end of the ground - as in outside the stadium?

No, there weren't. And we all know it. So please, take the blue-tinted specs off, realise that they are CLEARLY lying and be angry about that.
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I get what you have been posting, I really do. Few think the French police weren't beyond irresponsible in the behaviour, but we've been here before. Many times. We've been the target of their 'exuberance' many times, Rupert's Tower, Liver Buildings, Dean's statue, off the top of my head. There's a pattern.
So forgive me for not being sympathetic on the whole, until they accept some responsibility. I feel for those who suffered at the end of police tactics. Perhaps they'd have been in the ground had their seats not already been 'allocated'.
More than this though, I am angry at the insensitive arrogance that they, their club and even Liverpool council, allowed a celebratory parade on the anniversary of such an horrific event in their history.
Would we be allowed a parade on the anniversary of Hillsborough? The answer is an absolute NO. Because we would never even consider it. That is what seperates us.
 
magicjuan said:
I get what you have been posting, I really do. Few think the French police weren't beyond irresponsible in the behaviour, but we've been here before. Many times. We've been the target of their 'exuberance' many times, Rupert's Tower, Liver Buildings, Dean's statue, off the top of my head. There's a pattern.
So forgive me for not being sympathetic on the whole, until they accept some responsibility. I feel for those who suffered at the end of police tactics. Perhaps they'd have been in the ground had their seats not already been 'allocated'.
More than this though, I am angry at the insensitive arrogance that they, their club and even Liverpool council, allowed a celebratory parade on the anniversary of such an horrific event in their history.
Would we be allowed a parade on the anniversary of Hillsborough? The answer is an absolute NO. Because we would never even consider it. That is what seperates us.
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I'm not sympathetic with the RS, but I don't like the tribalism that has come from it either.

that club, it needs to have some gumption and responsibility, but when authorities lie like they have it's pretty sickening. That's all really.

agree on the rest
 
BlueToff said:
Hang on, I have not absolved them. They are to blame for their own stupid actions.

But all the government have said that the fake tickets did was cause the bottleneck, which is why they then removed the checks (this is as per their statement today).

The fake tickets didn't result in police tear gassing people, according to the French government. And there's videos that clearly show people simply scanning tickets and then getting pepper sprayed as they walk in through the turnstiles.

There's no defence of that.
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There is a defence of it. I have already explained it.

1. This was the location of a terrorist attack not so long ago.
2. Tear gassing people is an effective way to stop people rushing into the ground causing a potential disaster.

Obviously it is not an ideal solution but the reasons are there. For both of those examples it's probably better to act first and ask questions later.

The incident I assume you are talking about I have seen. A fan is arguing with the police/staff at the gates. The police sprays somebody else. No idea what happened there, I assume he/she lost the plot. It's not like that was happening en masse.

Again to solve all of this you need to take away the catalyst in the first place.
 

Papa Shango said:
They more than likely would not know their ticket is fake.

I don't expect that a bunch of fans have gone over there with a piece of card cut out from a cereal box that says "Tikket" on.

The dodgy tickets and poor management of legitimate tickets is a whole other argument.
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The key here is 'paper tickets' requested/demanded by the club themselves.
 
Bluestar said:
Given the memory of Hillsborough disaster, the authorities need to go after the ticket forgers and throw the book at them.

Fans were always going to chase tickets, wherever they could get them, it’s not their fault they were sold forgeries. UEFA are also at fault. They create a black market themselves by selling their own allocated tickets.

There were also reports of thecUEFA digital ticketvsystem not working properly and needing several attempts to scan valid tickets.

Perhaps tickets need to be sold to named individual.
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i don"t know for certain, but i reckon most people who had a blag ticket would have known that it was a blag ticket.
 
Bluestar said:
Given the memory of Hillsborough disaster, the authorities need to go after the ticket forgers and throw the book at them.

Fans were always going to chase tickets, wherever they could get them, it’s not their fault they were sold forgeries. UEFA are also at fault. They create a black market themselves by selling their own allocated tickets.

There were also reports of thecUEFA digital ticketvsystem not working properly and needing several attempts to scan valid tickets.

Perhaps tickets need to be sold to named individual.
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Well this is the key issue really isn't it?
 

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