Discussion: does our meagre status demand reactive tactics?

[dholliday]

Hi admin, I don't think this thread has to be merged with the main Moyes threads...it's more about our fundamental tactics. Cheers!


Really interesting article on Moyes's reactive tactical nature and how it ensured our best of the rest status during his time with us.

The staffers note that most fans and media seem unaware of this planning. Often, in pubs and TV studios, a game is discussed as if it were a mix of bursts of inspiration, individual blunders and a manager’s motivational powers. Hargreaves, who works for the academy with the remit to ensure its decisions are evidence-based, says: “What the public sees isn’t necessarily what’s happening.” In part, that’s because managers such as Moyes won’t reveal their tactical secrets.

Great image this too:

Moyes has no particular ideology of how to play football. Arsène Wenger of Arsenal, say, has always striven for a fast-passing attacking game. Moyes, by contrast, tailors Everton’s style to each new opponent. He works out what the opposition does – and then tries to stop it.

Michael Cox agrees:

whereas other managers believe paying too much attention to the opposition affects self-belief, the Scot is a naturally reactive manager who varies his side's approach to nullify the strengths, and expose the weaknesses, of a particular opponent.

"Meagre status" nowadays obviously is related to money (not history). Meaning our lack of investment, lack of potential new owners and lack of net spend in comparison to our peers.



Question: does this status demand that our next manager also needs to be an expert in reactive tactics? Does the lack of money mean we simply can't afford the quality of players required for pro-active tactics?

Are Arsenal a counter-example to this? They really haven't net-spent much more than us, the only difference in status being their new stadium and London-centric fanbase secures their long-term future. But aside from that, would a manager with a clear playing philosophy (like Wenger) be beneficial to us?

Can a pro-active tactical method transcend individual player quality (ala Wenger)? Or is the reactive method (ala Moyes) necessary with the players we have?

 

[Bungle]

You like your polls don't you mate?

 

[quasi modo]

I think our style of play has to contributed to sending perfectly good strikers to the knackers yard.

 

[Allezfan]

Arsenal vastly outspend us. They just don't do it on transfers. If you can afford to keep players when they're among the best in the world, henry, fabregas, van persie etc by paying them huge wages then you're not skint.

They pay their players twice what we pay ours so naturally they attract better players and keep those players for longer. You can't compare their situation with ours.

Having said I happen to think we're good enough that the Moyes style reactivism isn't needed and we can project our own style instead.

 

[kenada_blue]

This has given me a headache

 

[ToffeeMike]

You like your polls don't you mate?

So do I Bungle, they're boss.

 

[dholliday]

You like your polls don't you mate?

Yeah, I'm addicted to how they can show us at-a-glance what we're thinking. Our microcosm can fairly extend to the Everton fanbase as a whole (as the patterns early-established in polls tend to continue no matter how many people end up voting).


With all the pessimistic talk of us joining relegation battles because Moyes has left us I thought this spin on the debate would show us if the fanbase really is that negative. Of course, the pro-active philosphy working is dependent on the quality of our next manager. But that's another debate.

Arsenal vastly outspend us. They just don't do it on transfers. If you can afford to keep players when they're among the best in the world, henry, fabregas, van persie etc by paying them huge wages then you're not skint.

They pay their players twice what we pay ours so naturally they attract better players and keep those players for longer. You can't compare their situation with ours..

Yes, their wage bill is a lot more than hours. I probably should have linked a table comparing wage bills too.

But they did sell Van Persie, Overmars, Fabregas and the like when these players were at their peak for Arsenal. And they replaced them with the likes of Arteta & Podolski, who haven't been quite as effective.

Having said I happen to think we're good enough that the Moyes style reactivism isn't needed and we can project our own style instead.

I hope so, and voted as such.

 

[Azzurri]

Er, I dunno?


Put the ball in the net?

 

[noharmdone]

Who's Michael Cox ?

 

[Allezfan]

Who's Michael Cox ?

Writes for the guardian, espn and a blog called zonal marking, does a lot of articles about tactics and the like. Arsenal fan.

Like a jarg executioners bong, basically.

 

[dholliday]

Like a jarg executioners bong, basically.

is jarg good or bad?


Mr Bong also has written of Moyes's reactive nature, I'd be interested if he thinks it'll be necessary for our new manager to adopt similar.

 

[dholliday]

As much as most of us don't find Martinez good enough, his pro-active philosophy has just won Wigan the FA Cup.

But then again, this same philosophy has got his club battling relegation. If he utilised Moyes's patented reactive-tactics, would Wigan be comfortably mid-table (while possibly not winning the cup)?

 

[anton66]

I thought the mere mention of Moyes would throw your thread into "everything 300 pages long Moyes thread"so good luck in posting a hybrid. Far too many admin police about.

 

[saplingg]

Why not both?

I applaud the way Moyes sets his teams up at home against the big sides, but when he goes out to play against weaker teams he acts all coy and ****, when we should be imposing ourselves.

 

[zirc]

Yes, their wage bill is a lot more than hours. I probably should have linked a table comparing wage bills too.

But they did sell Van Persie, Overmars, Fabregas and the like when these players were at their peak for Arsenal. And they replaced them with the likes of Arteta & Podolski, who haven't been quite as effective.

It's not just bigger than ours. It's bigger than Bayern Munich's, who get slated routinely for buying their league titles. They lose their best players not because they can't afford to pay them, but because instead of paying them more they give the money to terrible players. They have a maximum wage but they'll have (for example) four left backs on 50k+/week. That's not being skint it's just wasteful. We don't operate anywhere near the financial sphere of Arsenal.