Baines

Allezfan · June 5, 2011

For the record, I admit that Baines isn't perfect, when we went to Old Trafford Valencia utterly roasted him. But then three weeks later Cole went there and Valencia had even more joy against him.

horatia · June 5, 2011

In this season Leighton was one of the best Everton player, and he's really the best left-back in PL. We can't lose him this summer.

Allezfan · June 5, 2011

Cookachoo said:
An awful season ? He was an ever-present in the side with the joint-best defensive record in the league. Lets not be silly now.

I realise that it's not in your nature to ever give credit to an everton player but you are aware that Arsenal have had a really good defensive record over the last few years too right? Should we go out and buy Squilaci and Silvestre?

The better your team is at holding the ball and attacking, the less your defenders have to do to keep a clean sheat. (and that's not even getting into the question about whether a full back in the modern games is primarly a defender or not)

Cookachoo · June 5, 2011

RadioFriendlyUnitShifter said:
5 goals (2nd most for a defender in the league) and 11 assists (most for a defender in the league - by 7!)

Baines was our penalty taker for a spell and he takes the majority of our set-pieces. Of course he's going to have a favourable goal and assists record.

horatia said:
We can't lose him this summer.

I think most are resigned to it now.

Cookachoo · June 5, 2011

Artetafan said:
I realise that it's not in your nature to ever give credit to an everton player but you are aware that Arsenal have had a really good defensive record over the last few years too right? Should we go out and buy Squilaci and Silvestre?

The better your team is at holding the ball and attacking, the less your defenders have to do to keep a clean sheat. (and that's not even getting into the question about whether a full back in the modern games is primarly a defender or not)

I'm not quite sure what bearing that has on your argument. Arsenal have had a decent record defensively, about as appropriate as any team in that area of the table, but they've not been anything special in defence since the invincibles 7 years ago. Defensive strength is relative to the style of the team, in Arsenal's case posession, in Blackpools case, "you score 3 and we'll score four" mentality. Obviously the less the opposition have the ball, the less actual defending you have to do, and its more about positioning, movement and concentration. That goes without saying.

But a full-backs job primarily is to defend, a team playing with sweepers or an anchorman ala De Jong, obviously have much more latitude for attacking full-backs ala Kolarov and Richards. Though i'd personally label that system as utilising 'Wing-backs', which neither Cole nor Baines are in their usual system.

Oxon · June 5, 2011

Cookachoo said:
I think most are resigned to it now.

I don't think most people are to be honest.

horatia · June 5, 2011

Oxon said:
I don't think most people are to be honest.

I don't think so too.

bluejock · June 5, 2011

Aside from their footy skills, Baines is a consumate professional, the sort who would never be seen on the front pages of the Sunday rags.

Cole is a bad, bad weapon. Imagine taking an air rifle to training and shooting a work experience kid.

Know who I'd rather have in my team.

horatia · June 5, 2011

bluejock said:
Aside from their footy skills, Baines is a consumate professional, the sort who would never be seen on the front pages of the Sunday rags.

Cole is a bad, bad weapon. Imagine taking an air rifle to training and shooting a work experience kid.

Know who I'd rather have in my team.

I hope, Baines will take a rifle and shoot Anichebe, Kenwright for example...

Silas · June 5, 2011

Cookachoo said:
Baines was our penalty taker for a spell and he takes the majority of our set-pieces. Of course he's going to have a favourable goal and assists record.

I think most are resigned to it now.

Will give you the goals but assists are not even debatable. Even if you took set pieces out of the equation Baines would be miles ahead. Cole rarely crosses or centres a ball whereas Baines does that often. In terms of productivity there really is no comparison.

RFUS · June 5, 2011

Cookachoo said:
Baines was our penalty taker for a spell and he takes the majority of our set-pieces. Of course he's going to have a favourable goal and assists record.

I think most are resigned to it now.

Half of Lampard's goals are from the spot but that doesn't stop the media, or Chelsea fans, raving about him as the "20 goal a season midfielder".

As for assists, most of Baines come in open play. And the set piece thing... that just shows that to us he has more worth than just being a regular LB; he's got the best delivery in the squad, and the best pen accuracy.

Defensively the margin isn't as big as you're making out. Cole plays for Chelsea -- a team with better defenders, a better keeper, higher possession and a team that generally has to endure less opposition attacks. Add to that that for us this season Baines hasn't had great cover at LM. At first Pienaar was going missing, and then Ossie there still isn't the best tracking back as he also likes to roam.

Hibbert&Ernie · June 5, 2011

Mvflusk said:
Baines 10-11
Total Tackles Attempted: 84
Successful: 62 (73.8%)

Cole 10-11
Total Tackles Attempted: 100
Successful: 67 (67%)

Source: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/rankings/4949054/Premier-League-Statistics.html

Spurious. Those figures could suggest Cole wasn't caught out of position as often and was therefor in place or quick enough to make the required challenges. Also not taken into consideration is closing down crosses, as well as stats for the left mid. There is no doubt Pienaar was a fantastic partner for Baines.