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PING!
Reidy's Bottle Of Grecian
The Unobstructed View
It does actually signify reaching a milestone in their life for the younger ones, as it is only worn after they have 'become a woman.' As do the headscarfs etc.
B
BlackToffee
Guest
Let me see if I can help you.
legalising honour killings - dishonourable (I refuse to use your term) killings are murder and are covered in UK law as such. I don't see groups marching on Parliament demanding this right. Nobody supports it being allowed, not even as a "crime of passion".
arranged marriages featuring children with adults = again, the age of consent determines this issue. Arranged marriages were very common in the UK, including those between adults and children, more notably amongst the nobility.
The death penalty by stoning for being raped or homosexuality, = The death penalty by the state has been outlawed since the 1960's
The end of universal suffrage = is a human right,,not negotiated
Bigamy = again, illegal.
I realise that there are many on here who believe that Muslims (as if they are one people) are advocating for laws which are signficantly different from UK law. UK law is very good at making accommodations which have not destroyed the fabric of UK society. I remember Sikhs who wanted to join the Police refused the wea the traditional bobby hat. For those Sikhs a special hat has been made, their culture accommidated within the context of UK traditions, the helmets are Police blue, but if you listened to the Sun at the time, you'll think that the UK was about to turn into a Sikh society.
The point I'm making is that various communities advocate for particular changes in the law. It doesn't mean that it will necesarily happen or happen in the way that community, or should i say their most vocal advocates might want.
if the UK won't bring back hanging, I doubt it will allow stoning, whatever the pretext
Just wish some of you guys would come up with more rational arguments. sh
As I said before, is British Culture so weak that it is frightened by a few women in a burka?
I'd be more worried speaking to someone in a balaclava to be honest. Balaclava wearers have form.
Love to hear the specifics of EFCNIKS allegation about a woman in a burka attacking someone (but of course we all know its bull, so I'm not holding my breath)
neonleon
Player Valuation: £35m
Please show your own work.
It skirts the issue of pressure and compulsion on women to wear the niqab or burka. All the phonelines, help centres and community support isn't going to make a women decide that its worth losing her family or her children over this issue. For some women that is at stake. The newsnight show had an Imman and academic discussing the Nigab and Burka as something that predates anything in the Koran. To a medieval time when women were treated like property and denied their basic rights.
Above all else I think it shows precisely the opposite of what some people want to pin on the ban the burka people. Namely being cultural philistines. I think the more people that look into the pressure Islam women go under from early age, in religious schools, from family and friends and from reading religious texts will see that modesty and freedom of expression is a secondary consideration to a paranoid fear of immodesty and a cultural reversion to female sexuality and beauty.
If you want to allow it on cultural principles; why particular this facet of Islam and not another?
Given that multiculturalism has proven problematic (for all concerned) to varying degrees (as well as rewarding in others) why are we denying something that is so symbolic of division and prevents so much of basic communication taking place.
I lived in Bradford for years and there's a fair few Muslim women there who don't even speak english.
How can we even discuss the problems that Muslim women have when a centuries old system of enslaving them (whether with or without their culpability) is preventing them from facing their fellow people. Or is segregation something to be applauded now?
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neonleon
Player Valuation: £35m
You have failed to grasp my entire argument.
People are arguing pro niqab or burka because it should be allowed as a cultural expression of Islam. I'm merely highlighting that there are various expressions of Islam and most of them one way or another are legislated against in the UK. Nobody considers this a problem and are saying its a matter of liberty or for that culture to decide.
And there are many who have called for Sharia Law.
The BNP likes this.
Clint Planet
Utter Cad.
With all due respect, I am perfectly capable of "showing my own work, " compadre, but am also intelligent enough to realise that any relevant journalism on the matter in hand is worth considering, should anyone see fit offer it. Apologies if that put you on the back foot there.
Clint Planet
Utter Cad.
*like*
Clint Planet
Utter Cad.
Are they? Read Garton Ash's article.
Anyone thinking that neon is defeated here is making a silly error.
Hold on tight folks.
Hold on tight folks.
neonleon
Player Valuation: £35m
If I was a BNP member the thing I'd most want is not to ban the burka or niqab.
The greater the isolation, social division, lack ofintegration, self segregation, emphasis on cultural differences, suspicion and hatred; the more the argument gets polarised, Islamophobia reigns supreme, and the ranks of far right groups swell.
A liberal policy that facilitates communication between cultures and helps to emancipate women is the last thing I'd want. (if I was a BNP'er)
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I haven't replied to your posts as often as Tubey's because I disagree with you less.
But in short in my perfect world, if people come into this country they should be allowed to do anything I think is harmless and not allowed to do anything I think is harmful.
I view wearing a Burka like watching Liverpool, distasteful but harmless as long as its voluntary and therefore I wouldn't stop women being able to do it.
I view rape victims being stoned to death as harmful and therefore I would stop people being able to do it.
This is why I want 'the death penalty by stoning for being raped or homosexuality' to remain illegal and the burka to remain legal.
You seem to consider this position hypocritical. That either I must be against everything the Iranian government does (like for example breathing and walking) or none of it. I refute that. I can view certain parts of that culture as good, others as acceptable if voluntary and yet others as completely unacceptable.
And for the record, I believe Western Culture is superior to Islamic Culture. I think the world would be a batter place if everyone thought like I do and not like the government in Iran does. And I would protest very strongly against anyone trying to impose some of the Iranian Goverments values into law in my country.
neonleon
Player Valuation: £35m
It didn't.
Clint Planet
Utter Cad.
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