2017/18 Tom Davies

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Abraders said:
Yeah, can't be firing on all cylinders all the time.

He would benefit from somebody around him who moves us forward with the ball at their feet - allowing Davies to just get in and around the right positions for support. Last season that player was Barkley.

He will come good though. Without a doubt.
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I actually think Davies and Barkley were good for EACH other. Happens sometimes when players games compliment each other, and when one is missing the other is not quite the same.
 

Been asked to play a lot of different roles under different managers this season which hasn't done him any favours, performance wise anyway.

Would be surprised to see him start on Wednesday night.
 
Bruce Wayne said:
I'm not talking about playing defensively, that's not my gripe with that performance, it was that we played defensively so poorly. The first half in particular, even our long balls were going nowhere near their intended target and we were losing pretty much every 50/50 on the pitch (and quite a few 60/40s tbh). In that first half, for instance, we must have overhit balls a dozen times where they went straight out of play or straight through to their keeper. I remember Rooney had a freekick and it barely got off the ground, let alone made it into their box. We played terribly in all aspects bar the backs to the wall defending.

As for the striker comment, ours played in the same England youth team as the Liverpool striker, so if we don't have one, neither do they.
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I'm not sure I agree on DCL v Solanke.

For starters, their youth team striker is being flanked by Mane and Salah.

In any event, they had all of the ball so it's far easier for him to be high up the pitch, with people around him and shuttle in small spaces to try and get a goal. DCL had the width of the pitch to cover on his own.

All i'm saying is,

If we had gone there with Bolasie on the wing and a striker who reads the game far better than DCL and had held the ball and brought us in the game, you'd have seen a better passing percentage.

The fact we gave the ball away so much is directly linked to fatigue and the fact we were under the cosh from minute 1.

There is no pace in the team so counter-attacking was completely nullified.

All we could do is sit in and try and scrape through it.

Of course, it won't be tolerated if we do the same with a fully fit / balanced squad but for the purposes of yesterday all context needs to be considered.
 
Toffe3m4n said:
Learn how to approach a derby.
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Not sure I know what you mean there mate, unless you're talking about his attitude. In which case I think you're being a bit unfair to the lad.

I just don't think it's right to directly compare the two players. Kenny is a right back who clearly enjoys the art of defending, and he was in his element yesterday playing his natural game. Yes he played very well, but I guarantee he won't play that well every game, as consistency is a disease that affects ALL young players.

Davies is a centre midfielder who's natural game is to link play and get the ball moving forward quickly. He is at his best when we have more of the ball and he has options to play off. Yesterday he was asked to play a game that he wasn't really suited to and he was out of his comfort zone. Yes he has good legs, but he is not a natural ball winner or chaser down in the McCarthy/Gana mould. I think it was probably the correct decision by the manager to bring him off at half time, and I'm pretty sure the lad would have learned a lot from that game. We have another great kid in Beni who I think is better suited to that game than Davies. Personally I would rotate the two lads depending upon who we're playing and how much of the ball we expect to have. Bottom line is that we're very lucky to have 2 teenage midfielders who are as good as they are at that age.

The other thing with Davies is that many on here are criticising him for not kicking on from last season, and I think that's also unfair for a number of reasons. Firstly, our expectations of the lad are completely different now to what they were. Last season he was looked upon as a rookie and was afforded a lot of leeway. Now we expect him to control games, when the reality is the lad is barely 12 months older than when he broke into the team. Secondly, we have the second year syndrome, when other teams get to know the players strong/weak points and play on them; something he has to learn to cope with as part of the natural development of young players. Also, this season the team as a whole is dysfunctional, and we're not seeing as much of the ball, so it's been difficult for him to play his natural game. Most of his best games last season were when we were controlling games at home and he was directing play.

To put things in perspective, can anybody name me an English midfielder over the last 5 years, who has played as many minutes at the top level as this lad?. Maybe Dele Alli. I've no doubt he will continue to develop and will have a good career at Premiership level. Just hope it is with us;)
 
Davies was a bit lost in the first half but then so were most of the teamfrom a creative or attacking perspective.
In the second half the structure of the team was better and you could see where players were supposed to be. I would not be too critical of Davies as he was simply trying to be just another defender and as nothing was sticking up front he never had a chance to move forward up the field. On the day I think somebody like Vlasic or Lookman might have offered something better up front as Niasse looked lost from start to when he went off.
 

He's been below average this season (as have others) but is standing out as one who loses the ball far too many times. As others have said, he needs a rest and probably best for him, as his confidence is probably shot to pieces at the moment. He'll come good again.
 
bluelegend said:
He's been below average this season (as have others) but is standing out as one who loses the ball far too many times. As others have said, he needs a rest and probably best for him, as his confidence is probably shot to pieces at the moment. He'll come good again.
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In a three he needs to play.

He's the most dynamic midfielder we currently have available.

However, if we're playing a two then unfortunately he's not ready yet - imo - for that role. Gets caught out in possession too much.

In away games, I'd go Schneiderlin, Gueye and Rooney.

At home, Davies, Gueye and Rooney.

For the time being, at least.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
Not sure I know what you mean there mate, unless you're talking about his attitude. In which case I think you're being a bit unfair to the lad.

I just don't think it's right to directly compare the two players. Kenny is a right back who clearly enjoys the art of defending, and he was in his element yesterday playing his natural game. Yes he played very well, but I guarantee he won't play that well every game, as consistency is a disease that affects ALL young players.

Davies is a centre midfielder who's natural game is to link play and get the ball moving forward quickly. He is at his best when we have more of the ball and he has options to play off. Yesterday he was asked to play a game that he wasn't really suited to and he was out of his comfort zone. Yes he has good legs, but he is not a natural ball winner or chaser down in the McCarthy/Gana mould. I think it was probably the correct decision by the manager to bring him off at half time, and I'm pretty sure the lad would have learned a lot from that game. We have another great kid in Beni who I think is better suited to that game than Davies. Personally I would rotate the two lads depending upon who we're playing and how much of the ball we expect to have. Bottom line is that we're very lucky to have 2 teenage midfielders who are as good as they are at that age.

The other thing with Davies is that many on here are criticising him for not kicking on from last season, and I think that's also unfair for a number of reasons. Firstly, our expectations of the lad are completely different now to what they were. Last season he was looked upon as a rookie and was afforded a lot of leeway. Now we expect him to control games, when the reality is the lad is barely 12 months older than when he broke into the team. Secondly, we have the second year syndrome, when other teams get to know the players strong/weak points and play on them; something he has to learn to cope with as part of the natural development of young players. Also, this season the team as a whole is dysfunctional, and we're not seeing as much of the ball, so it's been difficult for him to play his natural game. Most of his best games last season were when we were controlling games at home and he was directing play.

To put things in perspective, can anybody name me an English midfielder over the last 5 years, who has played as many minutes at the top level as this lad?. Maybe Dele Alli. I've no doubt he will continue to develop and will have a good career at Premiership level. Just hope it is with us;)
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Totally agree with this, and think it's a really important point. It's why I think it's a lot better to be honest about the perfomances of young players, and judge them as first teamers rather than as if they've just won a competition. When we hype players up to be better than they are in reality, we then inevitably turn on them when they don't live up to the expectations we have of them. I saw people genuinely touting Davies for England last season, and others saying he was what we'd hoped Barkley would be. It was ridiculous, and the truth is he only really played well in about dozen games last season - from April onwards he started to struggle. That's fine, and normal, but some people were determined to pretend it wasn't/isn't happening. The same thing happens with DCL, people making out like he's much more developed than he really is. They'll both be good players for us, but there's no shame in admitting that at the moment they're probably not good enough to be regular PL starters.
 

I like Tom but I feel he looks jaded and i reckon a rest would do him good. He has been paying far longer than he would have had the likes of Schneids or McCarthy been interested / fit. He has been retained ( to his own detriment) due to our wretched form and missing players.

Give the lad a rest and he'll come back into a team with more confidence, who arent bricking it everytime we are attacked and i think we'll see the Tom Davies of last season again!
 
His performances have suffered badly since last season, it's due to him being a young player and the whole team under-performing this season. Look at DCL and Kenny when they first came into the team, they have both lifted their game as the team are performing better the last few weeks. Hoping the same will happen to Tom because he has the potential to be an important player for us.
 
Lanolin said:
Totally agree with this, and think it's a really important point. It's why I think it's a lot better to be honest about the perfomances of young players, and judge them as first teamers rather than as if they've just won a competition. When we hype players up to be better than they are in reality, we then inevitably turn on them when they don't live up to the expectations we have of them. I saw people genuinely touting Davies for England last season, and others saying he was what we'd hoped Barkley would be. It was ridiculous, and the truth is he only really played well in about dozen games last season - from April onwards he started to struggle. That's fine, and normal, but some people were determined to pretend it wasn't/isn't happening. The same thing happens with DCL, people making out like he's much more developed than he really is. They'll both be good players for us, but there's no shame in admitting that at the moment they're probably not good enough to be regular PL starters.
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Them the polar opposite starts happening - they're labelled rubbish or not good enough. Where the truth is development takes time and patience, even in the best players.
 

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