Darth Vader
Player Valuation: £25m
Imagine being made up sitting 11th and being a laughing stock
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Elong
The fire rises
Most people on here won't get that reference, but that's actually a very, very good one. A lot of people still think he will be a great All Blacks coach, despite having a talented Auckland Blues team finish near bottom 3 years in a row.
I like Martinez. But I also like Kirwan. I don't know where I am at now lol
kithnou
Player Valuation: £70m
Say it loud and proud mate
This is a valid point Dave makes regarding the wins we have got. It's stupid Martinez bashing to say wins against lower opposition don't count or Chelsea were crap so that doesn't count. All wins count, scrappy wins count just like balls bouncing in off someone's arse counts.
I've seen it mentioned a few times as if the wins we have got don't count. If that's the case then surely the defeats don't matter either.
I'm all for our Boberto packing his bags back to Wigan by all means but things like that just isn't a reasoned debate imo.
A wins a win, a few more of them and we wouldn't all be crammed into this thread nearly every day of the week
Elong
The fire rises
ianefc
Player Valuation: £70m
I read that little conversation between yourself and site owner. I think that's brilliant how you took note, you really are a brilliant member of this forum.
Please be a touch more consistent though, we can't be hammering officials for the Sterling decision whilst ignoring the Stones and Mirallas ones now can we? We should pride ourselves on being honest.
Jreverton1
Player Valuation: £15m
You can point out official's mistakes but at that point it was 3-3 on aggregate, we weren't losing, so it wasn't the officials fault we conceded another, it was our inability to see out a game.
My point about beating teams in the bottom half is that, as a side wanting to challenge for top 4/6 we should be beating those teams, not made up when we actually win against them.
It's against the top teams that you have to pick up points as they're the ones you're competing against for the top places surely?
Elong
The fire rises
Hahahahaha. The gift that keeps on giving.
deipnosophist
Player Valuation: £80m
Yes, sound bloke was JK. But his coaching, recruitment etc etc just wasn't up to required standard. I wish him well in his ventures going forward.
Elong
The fire rises
Perhaps there is a bit of that regarding Martinez too? He's a really sound bloke who gets Everton. It gives him a bit more leeway, right or wrong.
Lads, less of the bickering.
We are all blues here
We are all blues here
deipnosophist
Player Valuation: £80m
Oh absolutely. The parallels are almost uncanny. For me, the writing is on the wall as regards Martinez's inability to take us forward on the football field. I genuinely hope that that writing turns out to be illegible scrawl, but ...
ianefc
Player Valuation: £70m
I don't think that any doubt can be cast over many of Martinez' qualities. He's a nice bloke, he does and will do wonders for our image publicly, he understands our history and status, he's good with the media (which helps) he can spot a player unfortunately his record of 20 wins in 64 league games means he ain't the man IMHO.
If a rival club of ours stuck with a manager with a similar record we as fans would have a field day.
abelard
Player Valuation: £35m
Mostly in response to the petulance and poor quality of response on here, I always find myself instinctively supporting Martinez more than I do during the actual games. Regarding the "Martinez out!!!" crowd, to paraphrase, "it's not the band I hate, it's their fans." In any case, though there are plenty of reasons to suggest being patient for another year could be wise, it's pointless to get rid of him before the summer, at the very least.
And then what would happen? I understand there's a whole generation conditioned by the rote absorption of half-assed click-bait punditry cliches to project the entirety of their impotent wrath solely on the manager, but it doesn't follow that everything will magically improve just by replacing your angst avatar. In addition to jeopardizing all the progress we've demonstrably made - transfers, strong attacking, youth development, 72 pts etc. - and risking the harmony of a squad that's shown no sign of doubting the manager despite frustrating results and a home crowd that shrieks at the best young players in a generation for making the mistakes that it takes to learn and improve, there's the real possibility that a new manager, imposing a new system, and buying and ditching players, will make things much worse.
We all complained, despite a solid defensive core that was rarely acknowledged, about hoof-ball, launching endless crosses, and lacking a striker under Moyes; now we have arguably the best young striker in the game, play exciting attacking football, control the ball, and score as often as any side in the country - so much so that the lazier/more impetuous among us rewrite Moyes, commie-style, as no different than Pulis. But now the defensive core is obviously weaker. Replacing the manager only changes the problems rather than guaranteeing a solution. And if you do it too often, you get stuck with chaos, player apathy, and emergency spending on mediocre players just to stay in the division. If you're going to convince us that everything will magically get better, at least try to grapple with the complexities involved.
But instead, it's like listening to Texans frothing about Obama. One-track minds are not persuasive minds. Let's see if we can't at least do better on here than "Government off my Medicaid/RAWK."
Anyhow, I usually know better than to get involved in these things.
And then what would happen? I understand there's a whole generation conditioned by the rote absorption of half-assed click-bait punditry cliches to project the entirety of their impotent wrath solely on the manager, but it doesn't follow that everything will magically improve just by replacing your angst avatar. In addition to jeopardizing all the progress we've demonstrably made - transfers, strong attacking, youth development, 72 pts etc. - and risking the harmony of a squad that's shown no sign of doubting the manager despite frustrating results and a home crowd that shrieks at the best young players in a generation for making the mistakes that it takes to learn and improve, there's the real possibility that a new manager, imposing a new system, and buying and ditching players, will make things much worse.
We all complained, despite a solid defensive core that was rarely acknowledged, about hoof-ball, launching endless crosses, and lacking a striker under Moyes; now we have arguably the best young striker in the game, play exciting attacking football, control the ball, and score as often as any side in the country - so much so that the lazier/more impetuous among us rewrite Moyes, commie-style, as no different than Pulis. But now the defensive core is obviously weaker. Replacing the manager only changes the problems rather than guaranteeing a solution. And if you do it too often, you get stuck with chaos, player apathy, and emergency spending on mediocre players just to stay in the division. If you're going to convince us that everything will magically get better, at least try to grapple with the complexities involved.
But instead, it's like listening to Texans frothing about Obama. One-track minds are not persuasive minds. Let's see if we can't at least do better on here than "Government off my Medicaid/RAWK."
Anyhow, I usually know better than to get involved in these things.
Elong
The fire rises
Indeed. I'm glad we're not another club though, I like that we show loyalty and give players and managers time, it's one of the attractions of being an Everton supporter and not a glory seeker jumping to the next best thing. There's a lot to be said for how we behave as a club. That doesn't give Martinez a free reign though. If we don't see an improvement by the end of the season summer is going to be very interesting.
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