2015 post UK election discussion

[daylightrobber]

It's no different here except the poor pay less. America isn't known for it's generous wealthy elites and good public services.

The Americans are far more generous than the Brits when it comes to philanthropy because of the tax breaks involved. They give a lot to the arts and culture in particular.

 

[Garrick]

I also quoted the US figure that the bottom 50% pay 3% even though they earn 13%.

Here's a page from the mail.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...L-income-tax-half-country-contributes-10.html

Depends who you believe.

That's a pretty disingenuous report. Income tax is one small slice of a person's overall tax burden. It's also the most progressive tax.

Poorer people spend much more of their money on the VAT, for example, because they have to spend nearly all of their income to live and can't save or otherwise invest it.

 

[Tubey]

They aren't though. They're limited by their abilty. However it's still a level playing field. That's why we should bring back grammar schools so gifted poor kids have a chance.

It isn't - there's an 8% tax differential. They're limited straight off the bat by the tax system for earnings, before you go anywhere near the morality of educational standards and opportunity.

 

[bizzaro]

Your source must be off, because they also wrote this.

http://www.themag.co.uk/2015/05/mike-ashley-nets-106m-windfall/

Its not my 'Source'

They are quoting a UK PARLIAMENT SELECT COMMITTEE (the Scottish Affairs Committee) that published a letter to Mike Ashley over his apparent unavailability to appear before them.

They say clearly the only reason he did not have a legally enforceable summons to Westminster to appear before them was THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH TIME IN THAT PARLIAMENT.

Thats not to say they won't drag him in this year in the new parliament. Probably by September I'd say after the Summer.

 

[The Equaliser]

They may not last 5 years anyway.

They will publicly rip themselves apart over the European issue and will struggle to get bills through parliament. It has echoes of the Major government all over again which in the end was wiped out. History could repeat itself if Labour gets it's act together and is ready to pounce when the opportunity arises.

Things can change very quickly. At least that's what I'm telling myself in an effort to lift the gloom.

 

[bizzaro]

I fear a 10 year pay freeze while prices rise as normal.

Pay will probably start to rise this year. Will not be huge but probably offset by the low oil price and very low inflation.

The low oil price was like giving everyone a small pay rise. Looks set to continue for two years.

 

[Seanjd]

Its not my 'Source'

They are quoting a UK PARLIAMENT SELECT COMMITTEE (the Scottish Affairs Committee) that published a letter to Mike Ashley over his apparent unavailability to appear before them.

They say clearly the only reason he did not have a legally enforceable summons to Westminster to appear before them was THERE WAS NOT ENOUGH TIME IN THAT PARLIAMENT.

Thats not to say they won't drag him in this year in the new parliament. Probably by September I'd say after the Summer.

You used it as your source.


I have no doubt that buggar all will happen to Mike Ashley or his business while this government is in power.

 

[bizzaro]

Your source must be off, because they also wrote this.

http://www.themag.co.uk/2015/05/mike-ashley-nets-106m-windfall/

"The election result produced Champagne corks popping at Sports Direct (amongst the bosses anyway), as with Labour’s failure it means no crackdown on zero hour contracts which would have potentially given around 90% of Mike Ashley’s employees better employment rights."

You used it as your source.


I have no doubt that buggar all will happen to Mike Ashley or his business while this government is in power.

THE SCOTTISH AFFAIRS COMMITTEE is CROSS PARTY.

Its irrelevant what party are in government. As he'll still get summoned.

Also the Conservatives will unlikely allow someone to cheat the system with zero hour contracts too. As it means the UK government isn't getting the tax revenue or national insurance it is otherwise due.

 

[Groucho]

They may not last 5 years anyway.

They will publicly rip themselves apart over the European issue and will struggle to get bills through parliament. It has echoes of the Major government all over again which in the end was wiped out. History could repeat itself if Labour gets it's act together and is ready to pounce when the opportunity arises.

Things can change very quickly. At least that's what I'm telling myself in an effort to lift the gloom.

Perhaps, but Major's lasted 5 years.

Struggling to see how this one won't, sadly.

Labour needs to get it's act together.

 

[Tubey]

They may not last 5 years anyway.

They will publicly rip themselves apart over the European issue and will struggle to get bills through parliament. It has echoes of the Major government all over again which in the end was wiped out. History could repeat itself if Labour gets it's act together and is ready to pounce when the opportunity arises.

Things can change very quickly. At least that's what I'm telling myself in an effort to lift the gloom.

I think they'll last three. Not for the reasons you've said - but because the knives will be out for Cameron as he isn't standing for the third term - Johnson and May will be at his throat, and all their allies on the backbenches.

Early 2018 at the latest, as if it were me I'd be looking to get rid quick for two reasons - first, they have a commanding grip on the electoral landscape and don't want to allow time for the SNP voters to realise the error they made, seats to swing back to Labour and the "Scottish threat" being nullified to translate to Labour votes in England. And secondly, they won't want to come leader after five years of horrific austerity measures, if the chance is there to get in after just a few years.

 

[hibbos left peg]

This election was such a shambles it reminded me of an Everton preseason program. It just goes to show the best way to get ahead in Britain is to fail miserably

 

[Groucho]

Pay will probably start to rise this year. Will not be huge but probably offset by the low oil price and very low inflation.

The low oil price was like giving everyone a small pay rise. Looks set to continue for two years.

But pump prices fell for about a week, then went up again.

They think we're thick.

 

[davek]

They may not last 5 years anyway.

They will publicly rip themselves apart over the European issue and will struggle to get bills through parliament. It has echoes of the Major government all over again which in the end was wiped out. History could repeat itself if Labour gets it's act together and is ready to pounce when the opportunity arises.

Things can change very quickly. At least that's what I'm telling myself in an effort to lift the gloom.

The only thing positive that can be said for this is that at least every other political party will now be lined up against the Tories.

Last time we had the terrible situation of not only having a de facto Tory government to put up with, but also their hand luggage the Lib Dems had equal coverage on news programmes and stuff like Question Time giving a double dose of austerity propaganda. That's changed now.

Cold comfort, I know.

 

[marty mcfly]

I think you're wrong mate.
Lets run with an example, it's on a smaller scale, but the principle's the same.

I have a fictitious 100k burning a hole in my pocket, but don't need to spend it so have quite a few options, some of which are :-

1. Invest it in something in the UK and pay Income Tax on it, and / or CGT on any profits
2. Stick it in the bank, receive bugger all interest and pay next to no tax on the minimal income generated
3. Invest it abroad, generating a return outside of UK tax

I will only do (3) if I get a better return on the tax-free option than I'd get from the taxed option on (1). If option (3) was a poor investment, I'd be better off going for (1) and paying the tax on it. Anything else would be cutting my nose off to spite my face, and, in this hypothetical world, I'm rich, but not stupid.

The caveat to that is if the rich are worried about being on their assets rather than the profit generated by their assets then it makes sense to shift those assets out of reach of the state. The country's pretty goosed financially so that's a real concern for the super-rich.

It's called wealth management but even if they personally didn't do that. The banks would.

Interesting story about how the whole banking industry started. People used to leave their money in banks for safety and paid for the priviledge. Banks realized that only a small fraction was ever taken out and over time this meant that they could lend this money out if they kept enough to cover this small amount charging interest. Then they realized that the money didn't actually need to be lent out and as long as they used an IOU slip they could exponentially increase the amount lent out to multiples of what they actually had in deposits again to cover if anyone ever actually traded it in for real money (gold). This is the reason it says on our notes "Please pay the bearer".

There's no way the money would stay in the bank one way or another since it means the bank would be losing money. It would go back into circulation creating jobs and paying for public services.

 

[Tubey]

This election was such a shambles it reminded me of an Everton preseason program. It just goes to show the best way to get ahead in Britain is to fail miserably

I look at it a different way - if you're that disappointed and disillusioned and can identify that much wrong, a result like this can galvanise you.

If some of those Labour politicians who have came in this week have learned lessons, then things can look up pretty quickly. You've got to remember that the Tories in power now looked utterly hopeless as recently as 2007.